Joe Hart (joined Torino on season long loan - Official)

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mosssideblue said:
Think about it. We have a keeper that clearly Pep is wanted to ship out. Why on earth would he dis Joe in public?

If you cannot see it, fine.
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he wouldn't diss him but he would probably redirect the answer.....as all managers do...very few answer questions directly, especially when they don't want to give out the whole truth but Pep has been answering things very directly
 
simon23 said:
what I'm getting at is that people want to have their points proven....so they will highlight or come up with certain things...like the fact that hart is a trouble causer...there is no evidence to say otherwise yet when pep says he has a good relationship with the player (clear first hand evidence from a spoken comment a number of times by the manager who everyone "trusts in" people say...oh he is just saying that.....

Of courser they will have had words...probably cross words about the situation but people for some reason feel the need to then justify this with soap opera bollox
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Was it Cheeseman who went public wit something recently?
 
super_city_si said:
If I was Hart, I'd be thinking "this team and this manager is going to win a shit load of things and have a good chance at CL, why would i leave?" I'd convince Pep of my determination to work like a dog on doing whatever it takes for me to stay in this squad and push Bravo.
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What's disappointed me most about Joe is his lack of determination to do something about his situation. Firstly he has known for at least 9 months Pep was coming as far as I can see he has done nothing to adapt his game. As Carragher said has he been watching videos , getting extra coaching ? seems not. If Pep had seen that willingness to learn it may have been different.
Even now If I was him I would have pushed the Seville deal, A chance to adapt his game in Spain and on a different level experience life and football in another league. Surely he must have a few words of Spanish, we know Milner did. Then come back and challenge Bravo. From what we hear he doesn't want to go abroad ( a big weakness in English players)
It just seems to me he isn't prepared to challenge himself or do what's necessary to try and win back his place and stay at a club that is challenging at the very top. That's a big surprise and a bit of a disappointment for me.
 
1) Pep wants an upgrade in GK position for City - No disrespect to Hart. Every incoming signing can then be seen as a disrespect to some existing player!
2) Pep has played Willy in the first 3 games because Willy has spent 3 more weeks of training in Pep's system (btw its not mere 5 yard passing, Pep's GKs need to hv footballing vision & in-game intelligence to decide their positioning when we play high & also the passing option to make when the GK is pressed, coupled with the ability to execute it. Contrary to some Hart fans, there is no evidence to suggest that Hart can do this better than Willy. So I will trust the coach here - Again, no disrespect to Hart!
3) Pep has explained in length about Hart in his PC suggesting he has offered Hart to stay here and improve his GK skills to the next level - I see no disrespect here too. If anything, it suggests, Hart is not keen on that option. Coz if it was true, Pep would hv known already Hart is staying
4) The fact that Pep moved for Bravo so late in the window means obviously he was open to working with City's existing GKs initially & evaluate their quality in training personally - I see no disrespect to Hart again

"City" fans all of them, without exception consider Hart as a legend. Many of them hv accepted Hart is not good enough for Pep's plans. This seems to be the point where "Hart" fans feel aggrieved? Not sure why this is difficult for them to accept. No-one is looking to disrespect Hart. Some seem to accept that we are aiming for Elite status, while some seem to think, this is somehow against the club's values? Why this selective perspective for Hart alone? This is a process that happens all the time in football, in all the clubs. And this doesnt happen just in football, but in all institutions, in all walks of life. Review & Upgrade.

I recall many Hart fans badly wanted Pep to atleast give Hart a game before sending him off. Well, Pep WILL give Hart the opportunity (maybe even today) IF Hart fits the system/style of play in a beneficial manner. Unfortunately we dont hv a charity game or a friendly or Hart's testimonial.

Where is the catastrophe? Where is the disaster that City hv become? Why is there so much drama being created? A player has been benched. A legend has been benched. Not for the first time. Nor the last time in football, or even sports. This drama (created intentionally or unintentionally) along with media rags adding fuel to fire, is certainly not helping City. What is the disrespect here Hart fans? What should Pep/City do? Just re-instate him? Cancel Bravo's contract? Go back to status-quo? Thats the city-way? Of course no disrespect meant to Willy here, who btw, also happens to be a City player & a capable GK.

Sure it is a difficult situation for Hart. But since when did ONE player's difficulty become more important than the team & club's goals?
 
blueparrot said:
What's disappointed me most about Joe is his lack of determination to do something about his situation. Firstly he has known for at least 9 months Pep was coming as far as I can see he has done nothing to adapt his game. As Carragher said has he been watching videos , getting extra coaching ? seems not. If Pep had seen that willingness to learn it may have been different.
Even now If I was him I would have pushed the Seville deal, A chance to adapt his game in Spain and on a different level experience life and football in another league. Surely he must have a few words of Spanish, we know Milner did. Then come back and challenge Bravo. From what we hear he doesn't want to go abroad ( a big weakness in English players)
It just seems to me he isn't prepared to challenge himself or do what's necessary to try and win back his place and stay at a club that is challenging at the very top. That's a big surprise and a bit of a disappointment for me.
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yup hart could/should possibly have done more - completely agree..at least during practise sessions as i would expect during games the set up wouldn't allow him to nor the instructions from the manager


agree on the seville bit as well - though he might have his england position in the back of his mind about that one (and being forgotten as he aint playing int he prem by the elgland selectors - completely plausible as well)

I don't know about the third bit about not wanting to...maybe he doesn't want to spend a year being out of the first team trying (and losing his england place), maybe he thinks he cant do it himself..i agree though if that is his attitude it would be disappointing but it would be surprising for someone like hart as he has always come across as very determined, self critical and completely honest enough to know what is good enough and what isn't. I would hazard a guess at it being a mixture of all these things but his engalnd plan being under threat will be playing on his mind should he be a number 2 (but from what i can see its under huge threat as anyway)
 
mosssideblue said:
He's putting the onus on Joe
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That's your interpretation though, maybe he does believe what he says(even if the ball is in Joe's court as long as he improves he could be first choice keeper again). I think what he's trying to say is when Pep says: "I rate Joes abilities but he needs to improve the other parts of his game I need from him" people who have been saying.. "he doesn't have any faith in Joe's goalkeeping" will still find away to dismiss it to keep on with that narrative.

Now the attitude or player power thing is tricky(it's been vague and we can't know for sure the extent of it... might be a mountain over molehill), it may have been the case in the past(spats with previous managers that got noticed by those higher up) he got above his station and it's contributed, I don't believe Cheeseman would have said anything if there was nothing to it, any other journalist I'd have questioned but he's well known at City.

Maybe Pep sat him down when he came back into the team, addressed what he needs to improve on such as: fitness, tactics, technical ability and attitude... maybe all have been mentioned. Maybe they didn't have a good start and Joe disagreed with some things or felt they were a tad harsh on him but now they are on good talking terms as he has said most recently, situations like that can change quickly there was no major direct fallout rumored between the two. Even if Joe did throw a wobbler I doubt he'd be stupid enough to direct it at Pep, he might have just lost his cool and lashed out at something on his way out... Kompany has done the same for a ref decision before.
 
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