Jury Duty

[SWP's back]

I got off a few years ago after writing to the court saying that my job meant that I knew and had worked with some of the judges and barristers

If I was called rather than use that excuse, I would go and hope that some of the solicitors and Barristers I know from work would be defending the case, "Guilty to all charges, and here are some more the CPS might have overlooked M'lud"

Seems strange that some people complain about the legal system, but when asked to participate, then decide they cant afford it.

Not strange in the slightest. Try working for yourself rather than being moddy coddled in the public sector and you may then understand business overheads and the cost/damage to ones business that being away not working can do.

 

[mackenzie]

I think anyone called up for Jury Duty should do it, unless of course they have a genuine reason for not doing so.
I'm sure other self employed people have done it before.

 

[SWP's back]

I'm sure other self employed people have. Not every company and situation is the same though.

Would you really do jury service if it was going to cost you the neck end of £5k? Especially if you were not exactly rolling in cash at any rate? I doubt it.

 

[law74]

I got off a few years ago after writing to the court saying that my job meant that I knew and had worked with some of the judges and barristers

If I was called rather than use that excuse, I would go and hope that some of the solicitors and Barristers I know from work would be defending the case, "Guilty to all charges, and here are some more the CPS might have overlooked M'lud"

Seems strange that some people complain about the legal system, but when asked to participate, then decide they cant afford it.

Not strange in the slightest. Try working for yourself rather than being moddy coddled in the public sector and you may then understand business overheads and the cost/damage to ones business that being away not working can do.

So clarify, do you not want to carry out your civic duty at this time due to it being the busiest time of the year, or do you feel that you should be above carrying out your civic duty?

 

[Paladin]

I’ve twice been called up. The first time was to Minshull Street court in Manchester. My first trial was for a Polish guy who threatened his wife and assaulted a police officer when he was called to attend. When he was questioned by the prosecution, he said “No comment”, and was swiftly told by the judge that he had to answer all questions put to him. I still remember the defendant’s name after 30 odd years. The case lasted about 4 days and was quite interesting. The second case was for a mundane traffic offence, well before the days of Nick Freeman (Mr Loophole).

The second time was around 20 years ago, at Crown Square in Manchester. I had a rape case which was so weak the judge ordered the jury to find not guilty, and he criticised the police and CPS for bringing the case. Another trial was against a young lad accused of raping a Down syndrome young adult. The judge said she was mentally defective, a legal term meaning she was not capable of making certain decisions for herself, and needed protection from the law in these areas. There was a strong implication she could not consent to having sex. However, some of the jurors would not have it that she was defective as they considered this to be a derogatory term towards the young girl, and this was a hung jury. To the consternation of the other jurors the foreman of the jury gave the wrong decision, and there were suppressed coughs behind him until he realised and corrected his mistake.

Another case I had was of someone who was caught receiving a television at 3 o’clock in the morning. He claimed he didn’t know it was stolen from a nursing home down the road. My fellow jurors outvoted me in finding him not guilty. The judge was not pleased and he refused the defendant’s request to have his expenses paid.

Then on the last day of my service, the ushers called thirty of us and we were driven to Minshull Street to be selected for a jury in a drugs case, which was due to last two weeks. I was lucky enough to be selected, and had another week off work hearing about all the finer aspects of drug smuggling and the gangster lifestyle. The judge here fined one juror for appearing late for a session, yet he himself nodded off at one point during the trial.

For me, it was much easier than work, as we would be asked to attend at 10am or sometimes 12am the next morning, and we were hardly ever still in court at 4pm. And someone was covering my work so it wasn’t as if I had a backlog to go back to.

I found the whole experience to be very interesting. The worrying thing for me though, is the thought that someone’s liberty can be decided by twelve random people, supposed to be of good standing. Of my fellow jurors, there were a couple of middle-aged people flirting with each other, who eventually withdrew from the discussion having made up their minds, and were not about to be persuaded. Some had a remarkable unexplained loyalty towards the criminal fraternity. Many had an unfortunate inability to concentrate for long periods. Some appeared to show disfavour towards ethnic minorities. I mentioned the ones that let a guy off from raping a Down syndrome girl, because they refused to accept that she had limited mental capacity.

On the subject of wanting to be excused, a friend of mine has chronic back pain, and his doctor wrote to the court saying he could not sit down for long periods of time (which was true). On the other hand, there should be some form of intelligence test to make sure the jurors are competent, so if you tell the court you are a member of Bluemoon, that might be sufficient to get you out of it.

Thanks for that mate, very interesting.

I was chuffed when I got the letter until I saw the expenses for loss of earnings. I simply can't afford the time off work for what they will pay is all as ill still have my normal over heads.

My situation was different though. I received full pay for the duration of the service, and I got to do quite a bit of reading during the quiet times (of which there were many). There are plenty in my situation, which should mean the self-employed and business owners have plenty of scope for being excused.

 

[scall11]

I was self employed and did it. Cost me a lot of money and caused me loads of mother.

But I did it because it was my duty to do it.

 

[mackenzie]

I'm sure other self employed people have. Not every company and situation is the same though.

Would you really do jury service if it was going to cost you the neck end of £5k? Especially if you were not exactly rolling in cash at any rate? I doubt it.

Just tell them the truth then.

 

[denislawsbackheel]

If I was called rather than use that excuse, I would go and hope that some of the solicitors and Barristers I know from work would be defending the case, "Guilty to all charges, and here are some more the CPS might have overlooked M'lud"

Seems strange that some people complain about the legal system, but when asked to participate, then decide they cant afford it.

Not strange in the slightest. Try working for yourself rather than being moddy coddled in the public sector and you may then understand business overheads and the cost/damage to ones business that being away not working can do.

So clarify, do you not want to carry out your civic duty at this time due to it being the busiest time of the year, or do you feel that you should be above carrying out your civic duty?

Spot on. What a selfish whiner he is!

 

[SWP's back]

Lol at the perfect civic pillars. Funny they are in the comfort of employment.

(Not including Mackenzie in this)

And yes, if its a choice between continuing trading and doing "my civic duty", I'm sure HMRC would rather I continued trading and paid tax.

 

[SWP's back]

So clarify, do you not want to carry out your civic duty at this time due to it being the busiest time of the year, or do you feel that you should be above carrying out your civic duty?

I would happily do my civic duty if I was adequately reimbursed for it.

As I have said, my overheads will not cease during this period and my clients will still need servicing.

Would you honestly agree to do it if it was going to cost you circa £5k? Especially if you were not cash rich?

 

[law74]

So the "twelve good men and true" should be drawn exclusively from those in employment and those that spend their days in the pyjamas watching Jeremy Kyle, but those that are self employed should be exempt.

at least that is how I read the situation.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

So the "twelve good men and true" should be drawn exclusively from those in employment and those that spend their days in the pyjamas watching Jeremy Kyle, but those that are self employed should be exempt.

at least that is how I read the situation.

No. He's saying that as his income depends on actually being in work then that ceases if he isn't and with no other income coming in £65 per day is completely inadequate to over the overheads he still has to pay like rent, council tax, heat & light, etc.

Why should doing your civic duty leave you sick with worry about how you will pay the bills?

 

[SWP's back]

So the "twelve good men and true" should be drawn exclusively from those in employment and those that spend their days in the pyjamas watching Jeremy Kyle, but those that are self employed should be exempt.

at least that is how I read the situation.

No, not at all. But my company is still in it's growth phase and without boring you with my business model, the overheads are huge due to the nature of buying client banks (practices). I am the sole "earner" (ie the one that makes the deals), my staff are admin, solely admin and not qualified to write business. I am not in a position to pay my overheads if I am not working.

This is why I am insured to the hilt in case I fall ill and am unable to work and only take holidays during my quietest times and only if I can afford it.

I would love to do the actual jury duty as I am a busy ****, as well everyone knows. But not at the expense of going into the red. I work in a tough enough market as it is.

 

[anyoneforacuppa]

I haven't done it but my Dad got called up to it last year. He's a self-employed milkman (quite rare these days) and he had to write to them to explain the situation. He explained that he's a one man business, that the majority of home customers are elderly, he delivers to the local shops and he couldn't afford to take 2 weeks off as he'd lose contracts etc.

He managed to get off it (essential to the community or words to that affect apparently) but I know of electricians who are one men businesses and they have tried it and it hasn't worked out. Guess it's the luck of the draw.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

So the "twelve good men and true" should be drawn exclusively from those in employment and those that spend their days in the pyjamas watching Jeremy Kyle, but those that are self employed should be exempt.

at least that is how I read the situation.

No, not at all. But my company is still in it's growth phase and without boring you with my business model, the overheads are huge due to the nature of buying client banks (practices). I am the sole "earner" (ie the one that makes the deals), my staff are admin, solely admin and not qualified to write business. I am not in a position to pay my overheads if I am not working.

This is why I am insured to the hilt in case I fall ill and am unable to work and only take holidays during my quietest times and only if I can afford it.

I would love to do the actual jury duty as I am a busy ****, as well everyone knows. But not at the expense of going into the red. I work in a tough enough market as it is.

You can legitimately ask to defer it to a time when you know it's going to be quiet.

 

[SWP's back]

So the "twelve good men and true" should be drawn exclusively from those in employment and those that spend their days in the pyjamas watching Jeremy Kyle, but those that are self employed should be exempt.

at least that is how I read the situation.

No, not at all. But my company is still in it's growth phase and without boring you with my business model, the overheads are huge due to the nature of buying client banks (practices). I am the sole "earner" (ie the one that makes the deals), my staff are admin, solely admin and not qualified to write business. I am not in a position to pay my overheads if I am not working.

This is why I am insured to the hilt in case I fall ill and am unable to work and only take holidays during my quietest times and only if I can afford it.

I would love to do the actual jury duty as I am a busy ****, as well everyone knows. But not at the expense of going into the red. I work in a tough enough market as it is.

You can legitimately ask to defer it to a time when you know it's going to be quiet.

Or if you could just send me someone with a million to invest so I can take 4 or 5 months off to do jury duty if they wish.

 

[law74]

So the "twelve good men and true" should be drawn exclusively from those in employment and those that spend their days in the pyjamas watching Jeremy Kyle, but those that are self employed should be exempt.

at least that is how I read the situation.

No, not at all. But my company is still in it's growth phase and without boring you with my business model, the overheads are huge due to the nature of buying client banks (practices). I am the sole "earner" (ie the one that makes the deals), my staff are admin, solely admin and not qualified to write business. I am not in a position to pay my overheads if I am not working.

This is why I am insured to the hilt in case I fall ill and am unable to work and only take holidays during my quietest times and only if I can afford it.

I would love to do the actual jury duty as I am a busy ****, as well everyone knows. But not at the expense of going into the red. I work in a tough enough market as it is.

So write to them and tell them that you are a sole operator in a business venture that is still in its formative stage and towards the end of the fiscal reporting period you would fear for the future of the venture if you were unable to carry out your financial tasks, however after the year end rush, you would be more than willing to carry out your civic duty.

 

[SWP's back]

So the "twelve good men and true" should be drawn exclusively from those in employment and those that spend their days in the pyjamas watching Jeremy Kyle, but those that are self employed should be exempt.

at least that is how I read the situation.

No, not at all. But my company is still in it's growth phase and without boring you with my business model, the overheads are huge due to the nature of buying client banks (practices). I am the sole "earner" (ie the one that makes the deals), my staff are admin, solely admin and not qualified to write business. I am not in a position to pay my overheads if I am not working.

This is why I am insured to the hilt in case I fall ill and am unable to work and only take holidays during my quietest times and only if I can afford it.

I would love to do the actual jury duty as I am a busy ****, as well everyone knows. But not at the expense of going into the red. I work in a tough enough market as it is.

So write to them and tell them that you are a sole operator in a business venture that is still in its formative stage and towards the end of the fiscal reporting period you would fear for the future of the venture if you were unable to carry out your financial tasks, however after the year end rush, you would be more than willing to carry out your civic duty.

Will probably do so.

 

[paphos-mcfc]

Thank God I was exempt.

 

[Crouchinho]

Just say you either believe in discrimination, are a xenophobe or a right wing extremist. They will just find another sucker then