Keir Starmer

expatblue said:
It has been flogged to everyone that it can be flogged to and now another American is "Interested", it's losing money hand over fist and first and foremost the government need to find out how to make it profitable.

And then when and if it becomes profitable which friend they can sell it to on the cheap like they always seem to do.
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We don’t actually use much of it ourselves do we ? compared to when we had a manufacturing base in cars.
 
Kirkstall Blue said:
We don’t actually use much of it ourselves do we ? compared to when we had a manufacturing base in cars.
Click to expand...

I don't really know but I do know that if we can't manufacture it cheaply enough to compete with China, India and the rest of the chasing pack all this amounts to is keeping a living museum open.

The focus will be more on producing steel that heals the planet rather than making any kind of profit.
 
Chippy_boy said:
It's not as simple as that mate. As a fervent lefty you no doubt drunk in with unquestioning glee the narrative that Truss trashed the bond markets.

The facts do not actually bear that out however. The bond markets were in a precarious state before the mini budget and it was the incompetence of the bank of England in failing to properly regulate things called "LDI funds" in the first place, followed by some decisions immediately *before* the mini budget. Truss and Kwartang had no visibility of this because no-one at the BoE at the time has bothered to tell anyone of the impending crisis. The crisis was well underway before the mini budget and in fact it's hard to even say the mini budget made it worse. Arguably it did not.

I hope you may have an open mind here, rather than ignore it because it doesn't fit your desired narrative.

You can read a very good explanation here if you are minded to:

capx.co

Did Liz Truss really cause the bond market rout?

The widely approved narrative of Liz Truss’ demise is that she and Kwasi Kwarteng triggered a collapse in the bond markets with an ideologically-driven, economically ignorant mini budget. It’s a comforting story to tell, particularly for those who always opposed Truss and her attempts to shake...
capx.co capx.co
Click to expand...
Yeah, sure, just dead unlucky.

Kwarteng had refused to allow independent assessments from the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) on the potential impacts of the tax cuts on the economy—something which Truss’s successor and current Prime Minister Rishi Sunak described as necessary to “provide reassurance and confidence to international markets and investors”.

But with this “reassurance and confidence” not forthcoming, the UK bond market plummeted. The crash triggered multiple margin calls on UK defined benefit (DB) pension funds, which invest heavily in gilts (gilt-edged securities) and use liability-driven investment (LDI) strategies—mainly derivative contracts—to help their asset holdings generate enough money to match their liabilities in the form of payouts to pensioners. Such LDI products have surged in popularity in the UK—valued at around £400 billion in 2011, they had grown to a whopping £1.6 trillion by 2021, according to the Investment Association. But LDI pension plans were forced to sell their assets, including gilts, which only exacerbated the bond market’s sell-off and lifted bond yields even higher. Indeed, 10-year gilt yields surged to a 14-year high of 4.5 percent on September 27 from 3.2 percent just one week earlier. The pound’s value also tumbled, hitting a 37-year low of $1.0327 against the US dollar.

internationalbanker.com

Why the Bank of England Intervened in the UK Bond Market

The government of Liz Truss was fleeting, but its actions sent markets into a tailspin, forcing the Bank of England to buy government bonds worth billions of pounds. With markets calm, this intervention seems a success. But with the bank signalling that the longest recession on record looms...
internationalbanker.com internationalbanker.com
 
Kirkstall Blue said:
We can’t compete with other countries for British anything anymore, cars knives and forks etc it’s all been sold off.
Small niche companies is all we have.
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Farming manufacturing out to circumvent fairer wages shouldn't even be a thing, we can't pay our workers less than a starvation wage and sell the goods a company makes but we can ship the manufacturing out and pay another company to pay their employees a starvation wage whilst importing those goods to sell here like our shit doesn't stink.
 
Chippy_boy said:
It's not as simple as that mate. As a fervent lefty you no doubt drunk in with unquestioning glee the narrative that Truss trashed the bond markets.

The facts do not actually bear that out however. The bond markets were in a precarious state before the mini budget and it was the incompetence of the bank of England in failing to properly regulate things called "LDI funds" in the first place, followed by some decisions immediately *before* the mini budget. Truss and Kwartang had no visibility of this because no-one at the BoE at the time has bothered to tell anyone of the impending crisis. The crisis was well underway before the mini budget and in fact it's hard to even say the mini budget made it worse. Arguably it did not.

I hope you may have an open mind here, rather than ignore it because it doesn't fit your desired narrative.

You can read a very good explanation here if you are minded to:

capx.co

Did Liz Truss really cause the bond market rout?

The widely approved narrative of Liz Truss’ demise is that she and Kwasi Kwarteng triggered a collapse in the bond markets with an ideologically-driven, economically ignorant mini budget. It’s a comforting story to tell, particularly for those who always opposed Truss and her attempts to shake...
capx.co capx.co
Click to expand...
If Truss was right why did the Tories kick her out? It wasn’t Jeremy Corbyn, the Pope, the King, the mythical “blob” or uncle tom cobbly who kicked her out, it was her own Brexit friendly MPs. Was she just a very unlucky lettuce?
 
He doesn't get it. "Incremental change won't cut it" so here are a list of Incremental changes and waffle. How about policy that will give people hope. Re hashed re announced policy is not positive.

How about these policies/ambitions as a fag packet musing?

1. Nationalise the failed water industry
2. Bring Burnham in to advise on a national program to end the homeless epidemic
3. Have an ambition to make renewable energy free via huge storage battery investment
4. Bring in PR and end lifetime peerages
5. Bring in free public transport for young people
6. Tax the Billionaires and drive forward an international agreement on tax levels
7. Make all sports, arts and educational groups free
8. Bring in anti lobby laws
9. Minimalise the Royal Family
10. Bring in more direct voting. Let MPs constituency directly advise on MPs voting direction made on their behalf.
 
Norbert D said:
If Truss was right why did the Tories kick her out? It wasn’t Jeremy Corbyn, the Pope, the King, the mythical “blob” or uncle tom cobbly who kicked her out, it was her own Brexit friendly MPs. Was she just a very unlucky lettuce?
Click to expand...
I suspect they all believed the market crash was all her fault. This LDI stuff is highly technical and unless you are a finance guru, probably beyond the average MP's understanding. And that's if it was even known immediately afterwards. Plus they needed a scapegoat to distance the Tory Party from any whiff of economic mismanagement, so blaming it all on Liz, was pragmatic at the time. I think they'd wanted Sunak in the first place as well, so that fits too.
 
Vic said:
Yeah, sure, just dead unlucky.

Kwarteng had refused to allow independent assessments from the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) on the potential impacts of the tax cuts on the economy—something which Truss’s successor and current Prime Minister Rishi Sunak described as necessary to “provide reassurance and confidence to international markets and investors”.

But with this “reassurance and confidence” not forthcoming, the UK bond market plummeted. The crash triggered multiple margin calls on UK defined benefit (DB) pension funds, which invest heavily in gilts (gilt-edged securities) and use liability-driven investment (LDI) strategies—mainly derivative contracts—to help their asset holdings generate enough money to match their liabilities in the form of payouts to pensioners. Such LDI products have surged in popularity in the UK—valued at around £400 billion in 2011, they had grown to a whopping £1.6 trillion by 2021, according to the Investment Association. But LDI pension plans were forced to sell their assets, including gilts, which only exacerbated the bond market’s sell-off and lifted bond yields even higher. Indeed, 10-year gilt yields surged to a 14-year high of 4.5 percent on September 27 from 3.2 percent just one week earlier. The pound’s value also tumbled, hitting a 37-year low of $1.0327 against the US dollar.

internationalbanker.com

Why the Bank of England Intervened in the UK Bond Market

The government of Liz Truss was fleeting, but its actions sent markets into a tailspin, forcing the Bank of England to buy government bonds worth billions of pounds. With markets calm, this intervention seems a success. But with the bank signalling that the longest recession on record looms...
internationalbanker.com internationalbanker.com
Click to expand...
If you'd read my post where I said "her gross error was not selling her vision to the bond markets" (i.e. just dropped it on them) then you could have saved yourself the time rummaging around to find the above.

That said, I'm sure you'd manage to find something else to argue with.
 
expatblue said:
Farming manufacturing out to circumvent fairer wages shouldn't even be a thing, we can't pay our workers less than a starvation wage and sell the goods a company makes but we can ship the manufacturing out and pay another company to pay their employees a starvation wage whilst importing those goods to sell here like our shit doesn't stink.
Click to expand...

In other countries the cost of living is cheaper so they can pay subsistence wages, here young people can’t even pay the rent or get on the property ladder.

Lessons should be learned we have mothballed some of our oil and gas fields and we buy it from Norway instead, Norway are expanding/opening up more oil and gas.

It still affects the carbon emissions by transporting goods from all over the planet
 
philfodenswristsock said:
He doesn't get it. "Incremental change won't cut it" so here are a list of Incremental changes and waffle. How about policy that will give people hope. Re hashed re announced policy is not positive.

How about these policies/ambitions as a fag packet musing?

1. Nationalise the failed water industry
2. Bring Burnham in to advise on a national program to end the homeless epidemic
3. Have an ambition to make renewable energy free via huge storage battery investment
4. Bring in PR and end lifetime peerages
5. Bring in free public transport for young people
6. Tax the Billionaires and drive forward an international agreement on tax levels
7. Make all sports, arts and educational groups free
8. Bring in anti lobby laws
9. Minimalise the Royal Family
10. Bring in more direct voting. Let MPs constituency directly advise on MPs voting direction made on their behalf.
Click to expand...

You could try putting that as a manifesto to the people. Corbyn did in some guise or other and it had a ceiling of acceptance with the general voting population.

In other words radical reversal of policy pledges during an election must be dealt with a the ballet box. If he wants to rejoin the EU for example a new referendum must be sort. This is all fantastic for stability.

What a cluster fuck these adults in charge are.
 
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