Just spoken to a councillor who said his constituency membership went up from 300 to 700 - and it was still the same loyal people who turned out to campaign in the May local elections. But a lot of the missing 34% did turn out in the referendum... to vote against the official Labour stance. (Some people went to the local school here to vote, and it was last used as a polling station 15 years ago.)
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Labour / Tory Party meltdown Referendum fallout
- Thread starter whp.blue
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Helmet Cole
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Because they know the coup has failed, and anyone associated with trying to oust corbyn may be looking at a stretch in the political wilderness or perhaps becoming conservative party MP's where sure they would be welcome as center right moderates.Reading between the lines, both candidates were shite and simply fulfilled the "anyone but Corbyn" criterion.
WTF does nobody with substance step forward? Do they want to remain in the wilderness?
I actually quite like the 'sticks and stones' approach of corbyn. All the career politicians that thought they could pressurise and spin a change of leader through the media are now faced with the uncomfortable prospect of debating actual ideas and policy in a leadership election.
I have a feeling that Hilary Benn's shadow still looms large, and eagle and perhaps smith are just willing sacrifices in an effort to destabilize corbyn.
Who did you have in mind? Andy Burnham's probably the only one with any street cred, after Hillsborough. Not exactly the "big beasts" of old are they? - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35239660 Compare with http://www.politicsresources.net/area/uk/cab97.htmReading between the lines, both candidates were shite and simply fulfilled the "anyone but Corbyn" criterion.
WTF does nobody with substance step forward? Do they want to remain in the wilderness?
So Owen Smith's as good a bet as anyone - and will make his pitch as equally lefty as Corbyn, but credible as a PM. And next election most of the Tory gerontocracy will be looking old and haggard. in fact May already looks a year older from last week.
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remember arthur mann
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sir baconface
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Who did you have in mind? Andy Burnham's probably the only one with any street cred, after Hillsborough. Not exactly the "big beasts" of old are they? - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35239660 Compare with http://www.politicsresources.net/area/uk/cab97.htm
So Owen Smith's as good a bet as anyone - and will make his pitch as equally lefty as Corbyn, but credible as a PM. And next election most of the Tory gerontocracy will be looking old and haggard. in fact May already looks a year older from last week.
I'm a RWNJ, not a Lab voter, so I'm only bothered in the sense that a feeble opposition isn't good for democracy. All the more so at the moment, when there is discontent all over the place.
Since you ask, I think Burnham's a dead parrot from the last Lab government and someone who just twists in the wind. Fcukin useless, and that's on a good day. I'd never heard of Owen Smith until last week and know nothing about him. Corbyn's a decent guy but not a credible leader, nor saleable to enough electors. Hillary Benn seems personable and a man of integrity (like his dad) and maybe a potential contender. I like him, even though I don't agree with his politics. Alan Johnson always struck me as reasonably heavyweight.
Next election: Boris Johnson for PM if he makes a good fist of it in the meantime. (Big if.)
Smith is far from as good as anybody and his murky past with the drugs company will see him pull out once public scrutiny kicks in, shame as Smith is a nice fella who said at the Scottish labour conference he owed everything to Corbyn, what a fecking rat !Who did you have in mind? Andy Burnham's probably the only one with any street cred, after Hillsborough. Not exactly the "big beasts" of old are they? - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35239660 Compare with http://www.politicsresources.net/area/uk/cab97.htm
So Owen Smith's as good a bet as anyone - and will make his pitch as equally lefty as Corbyn, but credible as a PM. And next election most of the Tory gerontocracy will be looking old and haggard. in fact May already looks a year older from last week.
The perfect fumble
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Smith is far from as good as anybody and his murky past with the drugs company will see him pull out once public scrutiny kicks in, shame as Smith is a nice fella who said at the Scottish labour conference he owed everything to Corbyn, what a fecking rat !
I just about got through this duplicitous horse shit....
Paul Lake's Left Knee
Well-Known Member
Alan Johnson would have been a far better bet than anyone in the Labour party. Credible, experienced, respected and comes as a decent bloke unlike the rest of the career politicians and cunts in both of the major parties. Shame he couldnt be convinced to stand.
marco
Well-Known Member
he's got to much dirt on him to make that step up, i knew him back in the 80s when he was one of the top men in the UCW, great guy by the way and he knows his stuffAlan Johnson would have been a far better bet than anyone in the Labour party. Credible, experienced, respected and comes as a decent bloke unlike the rest of the career politicians and cunts in both of the major parties. Shame he couldnt be convinced to stand.
M
M
mat
Guest
He's a self serving ****. Just ask members of the union he used to lead.Alan Johnson would have been a far better bet than anyone in the Labour party. Credible, experienced, respected and comes as a decent bloke unlike the rest of the career politicians and cunts in both of the major parties. Shame he couldnt be convinced to stand.
urban genie
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I'm a RWNJ, not a Lab voter, so I'm only bothered in the sense that a feeble opposition isn't good for democracy. All the more so at the moment, when there is discontent all over the place.
Since you ask, I think Burnham's a dead parrot from the last Lab government and someone who just twists in the wind. Fcukin useless, and that's on a good day. I'd never heard of Owen Smith until last week and know nothing about him. Corbyn's a decent guy but not a credible leader, nor saleable to enough electors. Hillary Benn seems personable and a man of integrity (like his dad) and maybe a potential contender. I like him, even though I don't agree with his politics. Alan Johnson always struck me as reasonably heavyweight.
Next election: Boris Johnson for PM if he makes a good fist of it in the meantime. (Big if.)
Hillary Benn isn't a leader, he has ducked out of respobsibility several times in the past, bar the syria vote speach, which was more about sticking it the corbyn he says very little of substance or show no integrity, also he is tainted as the coup leader in members eyes, would never get voted in as leader for being a disloyal tosser.
on the credible leader, non of the coup lot, along with tristram, cooper or kendal etc are liked and come across as new labour drones. Chukka had a chance but he bottled it for some unknown reason. They need to stop pining for a member of the elite club of centre right labour lot and look for one of the new intake from last 2 election not tainted by years in government, clive lewis or dan jarvis, Owen smith comes under this, but after him and eagles sillyness he seems as self interested as the others listed and his nhs dodgy past taints him.
Corbyns issue hasn't been about reaching out, the engagement with young voters (which momentum is made up a lot from) and surge in membership, shows the message he put across at the last leadership election energised those likely to vote labour, with full support from day one by the PLP (and a fair media) then maybe that ability to reach people with his positive, kinder politics message may well have swayed some, conjecture, but the chance has not yet been given to find out.
Owen smith says the policies are right but the leader isn't, all nonsense, the coup lot in the PLP and ex mininsters from browns time problem isn't his leadership it's that he won't bend to the way they want the party run, led by suggestion from the tory-lite progress group.
Sad really as this tory government has been useless at times and not been called into account for itself.
malg
Well-Known Member
I think there's some fear because it will be a dangerous move for someone high profile challenging him did to grass roots support for him, and maybe even the unions. I'm just guessing here, but maybe they're keeping their power dry and letting someone lower down the food chain weaken Corbyn, then move in. I personally thinks it's all a shambles, and rather than Corbyn ruin the Labour Party, the ridiculous Blairites have undermined him at every step. Personally I hope Corbyn wins.Reading between the lines, both candidates were shite and simply fulfilled the "anyone but Corbyn" criterion.
WTF does nobody with substance step forward? Do they want to remain in the wilderness?
Just heard that the bloke running against him was previously a lobbyist for Pfizer - fuck me, if that was a Tory there'd be hell to play.
Because they know the coup has failed, and anyone associated with trying to oust corbyn may be looking at a stretch in the political wilderness or perhaps becoming conservative party MP's where sure they would be welcome as center right moderates.
I actually quite like the 'sticks and stones' approach of corbyn. All the career politicians that thought they could pressurise and spin a change of leader through the media are now faced with the uncomfortable prospect of debating actual ideas and policy in a leadership election.
I have a feeling that Hilary Benn's shadow still looms large, and eagle and perhaps smith are just willing sacrifices in an effort to destabilize corbyn.
Corbyn will win this challenge, as all the main candidates know. This is just about "one final attempt" before the party splits. Its a necessary process to persuade the waverers that Labour is a lost cause. Benn, Umunna & Co are saving their leadership bids for when the breakaway party is formed.
whp.blue
Well-Known Member
In all fairness that accusation could be levelled at every trade union leader ever, they all end up on grossly inflated salaries travel first class and stay in top hotels hardly men of the people!He's a self serving ****. Just ask members of the union he used to lead.
gordondaviesmoustache
Well-Known Member
Why shouldn't a person running a union with tens, or even hundreds of thousands of members, be paid a good salary ?In all fairness that accusation could be levelled at every trade union leader ever, they all end up on grossly inflated salaries travel first class and stay in top hotels hardly men of the people!
kas_tippler
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Shouldn't the thread be renamed as 'Labour in Meltdown'?
urban genie
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I wouldn't trust Corbyn to run a church jumble sale, never mind give him the keys to Number 10. He seems like a nice fella and all but a leader? Not in a million years.
Well neither is smith, a duplicitous man and opportunist, his labour credentials are worse than eagles, but he is more comfortable in front of camera than her.
Corbyn has invigerated the membership and others, but as a socialist and he said from the start, he didn't want it to be a one man leadership but a cabinet that led together. If the PLP had actually come on board maybe a strong shaddow bench working as a team would have made a difference. The coup lot have proved though that even as a 'unity' team they will stab each other in the back
stonerblue
Well-Known Member
I wouldn't trust Corbyn to run a church jumble sale, never mind give him the keys to Number 10. He seems like a nice fella and all but a leader? Not in a million years.
Why not?
I think the mess in the Labour party is just great. Only outcome can be that the Labour party splits and we end up with two left-leaning parties meaning the left vote will be divided between the two and Conservatives in government for the next 20+ years. Great news :-)