Liverpool thread

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Matty said:
Having read the thread related to Heysel I find it absolutely astounding how little of the blame each and every commenter seemed willing to place on the Liverpool fans themselves. Yes, there are others who should shoulder responsibility too. The Juve fans were peppering the Liverpool fans with fireworks and missiles, so were hardly blameless, UEFA scheduled a major final in a stadium woefully ill equipped to deal with it. The Belgian Football authorities allowed Heysel to become a crumbing mess of a stadium yet were still happy to "take the cash" for hosting a final they must have known it wasn't suitable for. The Belgian police for failing to even attempt to control the crowd, and for allowing anyone who wanted to enter the ground. Whoever (football authorities/police etc) organised the attempts to segregate the two groups of fans with a flimsy wire barrier clearly incapable of stopping any form of pressure. However, the lions share of the blame must be placed squarely at the feet of those Liverpool fans who piled through the barrier and then charged at the Juve fans, intent on reaching them and fighting them. Some of those whose comments form part of the lengthy article still, without saying it explicitly, are trying to cast the blame on fans of other clubs. Talk of "neutral" fans and "dull looking heads" which I can only assume, from context, means "not in club colours so clearly not Liverpool fans" being the main protagonists is clearly bullshit, but its bullshit perpetuated by Liverpool fans to deflect the blame. Obviously the majority of Liverpool fans who attended that day had nothing to do with what happened, they were just in the same stadium. That doesn't negate the actions of those Liverpool fans who were there, who did charge the Juve fans, and who lead to 39 people being crushed to death. They might actually gain a modicum of respect from other people within football if they held their hands up and accepted some responsibility. It's a damning indictment of their fans that the most accepting statement comes from former player Alan Hansen, when attempts to compare Heysel and Hillsborough are made:-

It is incongruous to attempt to draw a parallel between the two disasters, given that the cause of Heysel was hooliganism and that Liverpool supporters were the perpetrators. At Hillsborough, they were the innocent victims.

At least Hansen has the common decency to accept that it was Liverpool fans who were directly responsible for the deaths, in the case of Heysel.
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People conflating Heysel and Hillsborough is one of the most egregious and unreasonable errors in football. They were utterly unrelated and were caused by entirely different factors.
 
The simple fact is that Sterling wanted to leave Liverpool and some of their idiotic fans can't deal with that. The abuse and threats given to Raheem's family by Liverpool fans is a disgrace and must be a source of real embarrassment to their proper fans.
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
For an alcoholic, reaching rock bottom is something like waking up in a police cell covered in bruises and having soiled yourself.

For a football fan, it's boasting about your club's attendance at a friendly.
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Boasting about your club's attendance at a friendly. Over 10,500 miles away from home. On a Tuesday.
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
People conflating Heysel and Hillsborough is one of the most egregious and unreasonable errors in football. They were utterly unrelated and were caused by entirely different factors.
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You could argue that hooliganism played a part in both disasters but an indirect one as far as Hillsborough is concerned. Without the huge hooligan problems of the time, there would have been no fences and nothing to stop the fans from spilling onto the pitch to escape the crush.
 
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More unrepresentative posts from the scumbags
 
Matty said:
Having read the thread related to Heysel I find it absolutely astounding how little of the blame each and every commenter seemed willing to place on the Liverpool fans themselves. Yes, there are others who should shoulder responsibility too. The Juve fans were peppering the Liverpool fans with fireworks and missiles, so were hardly blameless, UEFA scheduled a major final in a stadium woefully ill equipped to deal with it. The Belgian Football authorities allowed Heysel to become a crumbing mess of a stadium yet were still happy to "take the cash" for hosting a final they must have known it wasn't suitable for. The Belgian police for failing to even attempt to control the crowd, and for allowing anyone who wanted to enter the ground. Whoever (football authorities/police etc) organised the attempts to segregate the two groups of fans with a flimsy wire barrier clearly incapable of stopping any form of pressure. However, the lions share of the blame must be placed squarely at the feet of those Liverpool fans who piled through the barrier and then charged at the Juve fans, intent on reaching them and fighting them. Some of those whose comments form part of the lengthy article still, without saying it explicitly, are trying to cast the blame on fans of other clubs. Talk of "neutral" fans and "dull looking heads" which I can only assume, from context, means "not in club colours so clearly not Liverpool fans" being the main protagonists is clearly bullshit, but its bullshit perpetuated by Liverpool fans to deflect the blame. Obviously the majority of Liverpool fans who attended that day had nothing to do with what happened, they were just in the same stadium. That doesn't negate the actions of those Liverpool fans who were there, who did charge the Juve fans, and who lead to 39 people being crushed to death. They might actually gain a modicum of respect from other people within football if they held their hands up and accepted some responsibility. It's a damning indictment of their fans that the most accepting statement comes from former player Alan Hansen, when attempts to compare Heysel and Hillsborough are made:-

It is incongruous to attempt to draw a parallel between the two disasters, given that the cause of Heysel was hooliganism and that Liverpool supporters were the perpetrators. At Hillsborough, they were the innocent victims.

At least Hansen has the common decency to accept that it was Liverpool fans who were directly responsible for the deaths, in the case of Heysel.
Click to expand...

How long would anyone offering a different perspective on Heysel (to that of the official party line) last on a forum like RAWK? In fairness to the saner Liverpool fans that may explain why there's only 9 posts on the subject.
 
stony said:
You could argue that hooliganism played a part in both disasters but an indirect one as far as Hillsborough is concerned. Without the huge hooligan problems of the time, there would have been no fences and nothing to stop the fans from spilling onto the pitch to escape the crush.
Click to expand...

Yes and one of the reasons the police refused to open the gates in the fence and were beating back people trying to climb over to escape the crush.They were so used to violence and therefore treated fans like shit at the time and people died because of this mentality and slow reaction to accept there was a problem and it was not hooliganism.
 
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