Mancini

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robbieh said:
Dear oh dear. Pelligrini or de Boer. How far have the outers expectations fallen. While there may have been some logic behind replacing Mancini with Mourinho or Guardiola, replacing him with guys who have won nothing of any note, well frankly it defies belief.

What had Rijkaard and Pep won before the same men appointed them at Barcelona? What had Wenger won before Arsenal appointed him? What had Klopp won before Dortmund appointed him? Barcelona had Mourinho there begging for the job and turned him down. These are very smart men who look beyond trophy hauls but rather at how a manager might perform in the club's ethos and with the extra resources they might not have had before (Pellegrini has Malaga in the last 8 of the Champions League on a budget of £0. ZERO).
 
larderland said:
mancinis record in europe is nothing short of horrific, if ppl look at that and still think he's the man for the future they're deluded.

We got very very very fortunate winning the league last year.

I love him for what he did but hes not the man to make us world dominators

Fortunate you say ??
 
BobKowalski said:
BillyShears said:
Andouble said:
I kind of talked and read myself into wanting DeBoer more than Pellegrini now.


I know what you mean. This is a really fantastic read for anyone who's interested in De Boer.

<a class="postlink" href="http://jouracule.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/the-evolution-of-frank-de-boer_12.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://jouracule.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12 ... er_12.html</a>

But to be honest MP certainly isn't someone who I'd fear is going to take us two steps backwards. He's shown what he can do in the CL, and in La Liga, with decent teams. Be a brave move by Txiki and co considering how popular Mancini is but I guess that's why they get paid the big bucks.

Well I am...fearful that is

Pellegrini took over Madrid after they spent an unprecedented amount of money on fake Ronnie, Kaka, Alonso et al. After losing in the Copa Del Rey to some second tier outfit the press never got off his back largely by taking the piss. The President criticised the style of play as too negative and losing to Lyon in the CL was the end. There were also many reports of players being disrespectful which given that even Jose has struggled to keep them in line its not that surprising Pellegrini was often ignored by them.

Pellegrini has done an excellent job at Malaga but there is a world of difference between coaching a team where not much is expected and outperforming expectations and coaching a team that is not just expected to do well but is required to do well not just with results but performances.

That is my concern. Pellegrini is not someone I have confidence can handle the job expectations at a top tier club. If it was Ancelotti or Mourinho or Van Gaal I would not have that concern.

I worry too. Whatever his pedigree, his record on this continent, going back to 2004, is nothing to talk about. His best season came with his year at Real when they finished as second to Barca, but any other manager worth his salt should have done likewise. But if we are really after a manager who holds the ethos that we are now seeking, one who can find young players at reasonable cost and to develop them to Champions League standards, a manager who would be happy to work behind Txiki and to leave that person to do all the negotiations, and a manager who has a long career in the Premier League, one who gets his club into Pot One of the Champions League year on year, then Arsene Wenger ticks all the boxes.
 
BillyShears said:
BobKowalski said:
Well I am...fearful that is

Pellegrini took over Madrid after they spent an unprecedented amount of money on fake Ronnie, Kaka, Alonso et al. After losing in the Copa Del Rey to some second tier outfit the press never got off his back largely by taking the piss. The President criticised the style of play as too negative and losing to Lyon in the CL was the end. There were also many reports of players being disrespectful which given that even Jose has struggled to keep them in line its not that surprising Pellegrini was often ignored by them.

Pellegrini has done an excellent job at Malaga but there is a world of difference between coaching a team where not much is expected and outperforming expectations and coaching a team that is not just expected to do well but is required to do well not just with results but performances.

That is my concern. Pellegrini is not someone I have confidence can handle the job expectations at a top tier club. If it was Ancelotti or Mourinho or Van Gaal I would not have that concern.

Petrusha posted this the last time you voiced concern about Pellegrini. I can't better it so I'll just post it again.

With respect, I disagree that Bob K is on the money. He dismisses Pellegrini's stint at Real in a single sentence, saying it "doesn't inspire confidence". In fact, while Real may have failed in the Cups in Pellegrini's only season there, they gained what at the time was the club's record points haul in La Liga. They lost out on the title because what was rated by many as the best club team ever did slightly better. I'd suggest that in terms of showing his ability to handle the spotlight and the pressure, he actually came out of it very well.

In my opinion, it's disingenuous to characterise him as someone who can run a corner shop while Mancini can run Tesco. It's worth noting that he's taken charge of big teams in different South American leagues and won trophies with them all. And let's put his time at Real into some kind of perspective: if Barca had been forcibly relegated for breaches of the rules and Real awarded the title after that season, then been able to buy two top Barca players on the cheap to reinforce their new found dominance, maybe we'd be speaking of his record at Real in the same terms as posters on here laud Mancini's successes at Inter.

I appreciate that Mancini had improved Inter before that first title was awarded. But then Pellegrini in his only season improved Real's points haul by 18 points compared to the previous year, moulding into an effective team a disparate, unbalanced squad full of big egos that resulted from a ridiculously haphazard recruitment policy beyond his control.

So Pellegrini is a coach who's performed well (or better than that) wherever he's been, has a reputation for playing attractive football and for being a highly astute tactician. He has experience of being at probably the biggest club in the world. I'm not arguing that he's in the same league as Mourinho or would give us the same trophy-winning potential that Jose would, but he deserves a bit more respect than he's being shown on here, in my view.

I always think if you have to base your arguments on 'what if' to make the guy look better then I kind of lose interest. Whats with the Barca nonsense? Its a bit like saying what if Taggart got done for influencing refs and had points deducted and we picked up RVP on the cheap we could retain the title...its pointless.

Pellegrini with an expensively assembled squad got dicked by a second tier club in the cup, finished second in the league and got knocked out by Lyon in the last 16 of the CL. The press didn't take him seriously nor did the players. When he was sacked by Madrid the general verdict was he wasn't up to managing the expectations and ego's at a top tier club.

It is what it is.
 
BobKowalski said:
Pellegrini with an expensively assembled squad got dicked by a second tier club in the cup, finished second in the league and got knocked out by Lyon in the last 16 of the CL. The press didn't take him seriously nor did the players. When he was sacked by Madrid the general verdict was he wasn't up to managing the expectations and ego's at a top tier club.

It is what it is.

You cannot compare Real Madrid to any other club. Javi Garcia said not long ago that City is pure harmony in the dressing room compared to Real. It's the most political and dramatic club in the world, Mourinho has lost half of the dressing room this season. The Spaniards think they run the club, even after he managed to get Raul and Guti out.

Considering his apparent failure, Pellegrini got Real Madrid their highest points total in history at the time. At any other club he'd have been given a second season after 96pts and a 75% win rate (the highest of any Real Madrid manager in history, Mourinho included).
 
tumblr_ls7kwt4v6w1qecsaao1_400.jpg
 
BillyShears said:
Andouble said:
I kind of talked and read myself into wanting DeBoer more than Pellegrini now.


I know what you mean. This is a really fantastic read for anyone who's interested in De Boer.

<a class="postlink" href="http://jouracule.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/the-evolution-of-frank-de-boer_12.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://jouracule.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12 ... er_12.html</a>

But to be honest MP certainly isn't someone who I'd fear is going to take us two steps backwards. He's shown what he can do in the CL, and in La Liga, with decent teams. Be a brave move by Txiki and co considering how popular Mancini is but I guess that's why they get paid the big bucks.
Exactly. They don't make popular decisions, they make the right ones.
 
LoveCity said:
robbieh said:
Dear oh dear. Pelligrini or de Boer. How far have the outers expectations fallen. While there may have been some logic behind replacing Mancini with Mourinho or Guardiola, replacing him with guys who have won nothing of any note, well frankly it defies belief.

What had Rijkaard and Pep won before the same men appointed them at Barcelona? What had Wenger won before Arsenal appointed him? What had Klopp won before Dortmund appointed him? Barcelona had Mourinho there begging for the job and turned him down. These are very smart men who look beyond trophy hauls but rather at how a manager might perform in the club's ethos and with the extra resources they might not have had before (Pellegrini has Malaga in the last 8 of the Champions League on a budget of £0. ZERO).

Wenger had won the French League title and was actively sought by Bayern when at Monaco. Pellegrini has got further with Malaga then he did with Madrid with Ronaldo. Kaka et al in the side. Maybe Pellegrini is best suited to a club with smaller budgets and smaller expectations. Who knows. But the point is valid. We are either shopping for a top tier manager or we are not. If not then you have to trust that Txiki and co get it right. I am actually comfortable about that but lets not pretend that are not some risks in shopping at a lower level for our next coach.
 
LoveCity said:
BobKowalski said:
Pellegrini with an expensively assembled squad got dicked by a second tier club in the cup, finished second in the league and got knocked out by Lyon in the last 16 of the CL. The press didn't take him seriously nor did the players. When he was sacked by Madrid the general verdict was he wasn't up to managing the expectations and ego's at a top tier club.

It is what it is.

You cannot compare Real Madrid to any other club. Javi Garcia said not long ago that City is pure harmony in the dressing room compared to Real. It's the most political and dramatic club in the world, Mourinho has lost half of the dressing room this season. The Spaniards think they run the club, even after he managed to get Raul and Guti out.

Considering his apparent failure, Pellegrini got Real Madrid their highest points total in history at the time. At any other club he'd have been given a second season after 96pts and a 75% win rate (the highest of any Real Madrid manager in history, Mourinho included).

According to the BBC Gossip Column, "Real Madrid are facing an investigation by the European Commission over allegations it received illegal state funds in a property deal it struck with Madrid City Council for land around the Bernabeu Stadium." Political, no doubt, and FFP busting probably.
 
Anyone who wanted step-by-step on Mario had it on here from November onwards;)

This Italian guy is a chancer. If I didn't know any better would state he was lifting right off here, like some others I could mention.

Pellegrini has been the lead horse for weeks and even yesterday, was told Mancini is toast as things stand.

My radar will also not dismiss Simon Mullock's piece on De Boer last weekend.
 
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