Manuel Pellegrini (cont)

[OB1]

It works when a club has access to players like Real and Barca do. If it isn't painfully obvious to everyone, we don't.

Isco forsakes his "football father" at the first whiff of interest from Real. Alexis Sanchez turns us down cold for Barca. Even Chelsea, who aren't on that level, took Hazard from us.

We have tried to build a squad that can go blow for blow with those clubs and we can't. We just don't have the pull. So we end up with second choice players like Jovetic, who is useless against a squad of vastly superior footballers like Isco.

The sheikh can continue with this model, but until we can attract high level players consistently, we will always be bringing a smaller gun to a gunfight, and we will need a heavy dose of fortune to win over 2 legs.

So until our academy starts producing players like Iniesta and Schweinsteiger, and until players are begging to sign for us, we have a choice, I think. More pretty football, good league performance, and poor European results, or something else. You have to wonder if at some point the sheikh will get fed up and acquiesce to a more pragmatic approach.

And second choice players like Silva, Aguero, Kompany and Toure!

No one is suggesting that we do not face barriers in recruitment that Barca and Real don't have but we can buy quality. We are also working hard to recruit the very best young players. The fact is some patience may be required to succeed in achieving the club's aims and to fully implement its chosen strategy. The point though is the club has a strategy and to go for someone like Simeone would be to throw it out rather than take the time and effort to make it work.

I hate to say this but apart from Silva the players you listed were very much second choice at the time we signed them:-

Aguero was our second choice after Sanchez chose Barcelona over us. Him moving directly to Real was never a realistic option.

Kompany was Vincent Who? when we signed him in terms of the very top teams in the world. We even initially played him in midfield.

Toure was sold to us by Barcelona. Great player that he is he was nowhere near good enough to displace Xavi as their main play maker
and Busquets is a better defensive midfield player.

Where we have done well is retaining all these players.

I agree we are unlikely to change our current strategy in the short term but it could be a minimum of 5 years until we can compete
with Real Madrid on a level footing financially. Will our owner wait that long for European success or will he be pragmatic at some
point? I honestly don't know either way.

You can put them down if you wish but the players I listed are top class players as far as I am concerned and they play for City so we can recruit at a high level. I have acknowledged that there are barriers that mean it is far from easy to do what Real Madrid do but Doertmund proved that you can go to the UCL final by playing attractive football and without spending silly money.

Also, the team do not have go balls out in every game in Europe, they can be pragmatic upon occasion without abandoning the whole strategy. Whether Pellers will show that sort of pragmatism is another question but he has done it elsewhere. What City do not need to do though is go fro a manager who is pragmatism first.

 

[cleavers]

There it is again. I'm sick of people saying those who don't agree with the way things are going are inpatient like we all think it's a game of football manager. You can give Pellegrini 10 seasons at this club and he will not win us the Champions league. Why? Because the guy is stubborn and inflexible tactically, can't organise a defence to save his life and as others have said on this thread City aren't able to compete with the other clubs for the top bracket players. This is not simply a case of be patient for 5 years and it will magically all click into place like you think. Yes you need to be patient but you also need to make sure you have the right guy in charge and that is not Pellegrini.

Maybe he is the "right guy in charge" for now, because the owners patience knows that we are not going to win the champions league at this stage of the plan, perhaps the plan to have the right guy in charge at the right time, is actually part of the plan ?

This part of the plan is to play attractive football anyway, and build towards having the right players coming through, and win it that way, by which time they will have the coach to do the job, can keep playing attractive football, and do it the 'City way'.

I'd suggest the owner has quite a bit more patience than most fans on this forum.

Thankfully.

 

[OB1]

So a very small subset of what most people call counter attacks then.

You have evidence to support that claim do you?

And don't you think Opta might just have canvassed expert opinions when establishing definitions like counter attack?

Watch the video!
On at least 37 occasions the opposition have clearly lost the ball in our half while attacking us. We win the ball and we pass less than 3 times (and run with the ball on occasion) up the pitch and the ball is in the back of the opposition net. Now that includes EC , LC & FA Cup games. The above definition seems to indicate that the opposition formation clearly has to be broken in some way. So not in the real world then...
Oh and by the way I am a statistician by qualification.

You might be a statistician but that does not qualify you to define a counter attack and winning the ball back in our half and then going on the attack does not in of itself make for a counter attack; nor does it make it a counter attack just because there are only three passes.

Anyhow, this has become a pointless debate because it won't change the fact that we are not playing as well this season as last but I'd also say teams are giving us less space to play.

 

[OB1]

There it is again. I'm sick of people saying those who don't agree with the way things are going are inpatient like we all think it's a game of football manager. You can give Pellegrini 10 seasons at this club and he will not win us the Champions league. Why? Because the guy is stubborn and inflexible tactically, can't organise a defence to save his life and as others have said on this thread City aren't able to compete with the other clubs for the top bracket players. This is not simply a case of be patient for 5 years and it will magically all click into place like you think. Yes you need to be patient but you also need to make sure you have the right guy in charge and that is not Pellegrini.

Maybe he is the "right guy in charge" for now, because the owners patience knows that we are not going to win the champions league at this stage of the plan, perhaps the plan to have the right guy in charge at the right time, is actually part of the plan ?

This part of the plan is to play attractive football anyway, and build towards having the right players coming through, and win it that way, by which time they will have the coach to do the job, can keep playing attractive football, and do it the 'City way'.

I'd suggest the owner has quite a bit more patience than most fans on this forum.

Thankfully.

I'd agree. However, if Pellers is deemed not to be the guy, he will have to go but his replacement will not be Diego fucking Simeone unless the club changes its strategy. And I have no more to say about him so "goodnight".

 

[Wilf Wild 1937]

And second choice players like Silva, Aguero, Kompany and Toure!

No one is suggesting that we do not face barriers in recruitment that Barca and Real don't have but we can buy quality. We are also working hard to recruit the very best young players. The fact is some patience may be required to succeed in achieving the club's aims and to fully implement its chosen strategy. The point though is the club has a strategy and to go for someone like Simeone would be to throw it out rather than take the time and effort to make it work.

I hate to say this but apart from Silva the players you listed were very much second choice at the time we signed them:-

Aguero was our second choice after Sanchez chose Barcelona over us. Him moving directly to Real was never a realistic option.

Kompany was Vincent Who? when we signed him in terms of the very top teams in the world. We even initially played him in midfield.

Toure was sold to us by Barcelona. Great player that he is he was nowhere near good enough to displace Xavi as their main play maker
and Busquets is a better defensive midfield player.

Where we have done well is retaining all these players.

I agree we are unlikely to change our current strategy in the short term but it could be a minimum of 5 years until we can compete
with Real Madrid on a level footing financially. Will our owner wait that long for European success or will he be pragmatic at some
point? I honestly don't know either way.

You can put them down if you wish but the players I listed are top class players as far as I am concerned and they play for City so we can recruit at a high level. I have acknowledged that there are barriers that mean it is far from easy to do what Real Madrid do but Doertmund proved that you can go to the UCL final by playing attractive football and without spending silly money.

Also, the team do not have go balls out in every game in Europe, they can be pragmatic upon occasion without abandoning the whole strategy. Whether Pellers will show that sort of pragmatism is another question but he has done it elsewhere. What City do not need to do though is go fro a manager who is pragmatism first.

I'm definitely not putting down the players listed : they've all been great for us. I'm merely pointing out that they
weren't top of the European elite's wishlist when we signed them. The elephant in the room is Mourinho. We are now up against a highly
pragmatic manager in the PL as well as in Europe. If Txiki can deliver Pep this Summer or even next Summer fine but if not I'd personally be
tempted to go for Simeone and fuck the strategy.

 

[Bill]

pellers could fuck bournmouth up.

 

[cookster]

pellers could fuck bournmouth up.

I'm not Pellegrini's biggest fan but the shit he is getting is way over the top. He has a higher points per game average than Mancini.

BTW Bournemouth are not guaranteed of promotion.

 

[phil31]

When i see Pellegrini interviews on the tv, i don't even listen to them any more, he bores the life out of me. Im saying this as a middle aged man, id hate to think how it must be for a 20 something pro footballer, who has to listen and see his demeanour every single day.

 

[Silva_Spell]

If Pep isn't available in the summer the only way back for Pellegrini imo (assuming we don't win the PL) is if he goes to Barca and basically masterminds a win. If he takes the team to the Nou Camp and has them playing in an uncharacteristic formation, eg. 3-6-1, 5-4-1 or a 4-6-0, and manages to smother Barca and utilise Aguero's pace over the top, I'd have no qualms with him seeing out his contract .

I want to see him not relying on the individuals of the team to do something brilliant, because that won't work most of the time when playing against top teams, and instead make the team greater than its parts.


I watched the Barca-Malage game a few weeks ago and Barca were very vulnerable to a simple boot up the field. With better finishers and decision makers, which we have,, Malaga could have won 3 or 4 or even 5-0

 

[Lancet Fluke]

pellers could fuck bournmouth up.

I'm not Pellegrini's biggest fan but the shit he is getting is way over the top. He has a higher points per game average than Mancini.

BTW Bournemouth are not guaranteed of promotion.

I'm no huge lover of Mancini or indeed a hater of Pellegrini but if you mean comparing their overall average points whilst at City then I think that would be absolutely meaningless. One took over a club that hadn't finished in the top 4 for about 20 years, the other took over a club who had recently won the league and then finished second. I suppose if you compare this season to Mancini's final season then it is arguably a more fair comparison. In which case it is currently pretty much even. Mancini got us to 75 points from 36 games that season prior to being sacked at an average of 2.08 and this season we have an average of 2.07.