Mark Clattenburg

forensic onions said:
Where did I claim to be a City fan ? From my first post on here I've stated that I'm not.
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So if you're not a City fan, what are you here for ?
BrianW said:
Plus, the Sheikh badly needs to buy a newspaper and a TV station to counteract to endless negative propaganda.
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The only reason I can see for the Sheik to buy a newspaper would be to shut it down, I'd start with the mirror.
 
Dave Ewing's Back 'eader said:
There is genuine human error and there is the travesty of a refereeing decision we saw on Sunday. The two are a million miles apart. There is also the 'human error' that sees a genuinely honest guy who tries every single match to stay on his feet no matter how much ankle tapping goes on, calf raking, tackles from behind, being cautioned for diving! Some of the referees currently whistling their way across the nation's PL stadia have 'baggage' that doesn't belong on a football field. Just how many games has Corporal Jones seen of Aguero attempting to stay on his feet no matter what range of foul play he suffers? I suspect he came with the notion he was going to book somebody early on in the season for diving, and Sergio gave him the first opportunity.
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No argument from me, that Aguero booking was an absolutely diabolical mockery of three shams and I would hope the ref in question would be severely reprimanded. I also question the ability of some refs both in terms of competency and bias. Every fan of every team bar "one" has pretty much the same theories. On Spurs forums today they are livid that City got away with several perceived card fouls, and feel Yaya should have been off and then Dier gets booked for their first. They are also talking about last season at WHL against City when Rose was wrongly sent off (later rescinded) and Dawson's goal was wrongly disallowed in the same game.

I find it hard to believe that most of the errors are about bias or agenda though, there is so much scrutiny these days that every mistake, especially big ones just makes the ref look like a public chump and threaten his chance to ref at the top level surely ?

This is never going to change until the authorities do the sensible thing and minimise the human factor (be that error, bias or whatever) in major decision making.
 
forensic onions said:
The thing that is seriously amiss is mostly that we are expecting humans not to err, which is ridiculous. Offside for example, how an earth is a linesman meant to look in two places at exactly the same tim, to see the precise moment a ball leaves the passer's foot and the position of the recipient ? It's always going to be fallible.

There is the money and the technology to eradicate most of this silly bollocks from the sport at top level. They do it in other flowing sports (Rugby, American Football etc).

There is this spurious bullshit notion that adopting video evidence will slow the game down, but it stops with every contentious decision anyway as refs get surrounded and there's a fucking hand bag fest. With offsides you could just let the situation play out, if they score there is a massive delay while they celebrate and everyone slowly makes their way the re-start, easily enough time for the freeze frame to be checked and a decision to be made. If they don't it's irrelevant. With serious fouls that a ref or lino hasn't spotted, again, you just stop play 10-20 seconds after the incident and bring it back to where it took place, punish the offender accordingly and move on, no more delay than if the ref had seen it and stopped play.

They should also completely ban the ludicrous debacle of players approaching refs after decisions. Watching Rooney and Co ref games for years has been very frustrating.


As for yesterday, I really think 60 pages of conspiracy theory is daft, and I say the same about all clubs and my own club when we do it - with the obvious exception of when anyone played at OT over least couple of decades, as some seriously fucked up refereeing occurred there without any doubt - and maybe Anfield too going back. I think you could say it was harsh and I could easily understand why it wouldn't be given, but I think it was daft of Sterling to jump like that and I do think it hit part of his arm - just my honest opinion - so I don't think it was a controversial as some - Vardy hanging his left leg into Monreal for example against Arsenal yesterday.

I also don't understand the "it's OK for Clattenberg (or any ref) not to book players for clearly yellow card offences because it's early in the game" bollocks? What does it matter what minute it is, you're booking the offence not the time? And I think Yaya and City got away with 4 or 5 cardable offences before Clattenberg then booked Dier for probably tottenham's first cardable offence.

I'm not trying to WUM anyone up, I like being able to go on different forums and I hate the infantile tribalism that often exists the minute anyone who isn't a fan of that club appears - and believe me I see it on my own teams forum as well - I genuinely try to take a pragmatic and honest stance with regards to the game.

I've been a big defender of City elsewhere as I'm sure you are aware you are now perceived as a club who's bought their way to success unfairly - I think that's bollocks, in as much as all clubs buy their way to success and how are teams outside the old money uber club ever going to catch up without perfectly legal financial legs ups from generous benefactors. Why should the status quo be preserved just so the same clubs can reap the benefit and grow whilst the rest of us have to settle for being also rans with the odd 15 minutes of glory in a cup etc.

And while I'm at it I'd add that I was also fucking delighted that Pep chose ManC - I really didn't think he would - for exactly the same reason. I'm looking forward to having him in the Prem and the apoplectically suicidal reaction from ManU fans was priceless.
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From what I've seen over many seasons, it goes well beyond "expecting humans not to err" as you put it. Of course, everyone makes mistakes, me included, but the level of "inconsistencies" we are seeing, and I'm not just talking about City, is getting worse in most matches, apart from the selected few we all know about.

Take offside, for example. A "professional" linesman (I refuse to call them assistant referees, because they're not), should be able to see, with a reasonable degree of certainty, whether a player is beyond the line of the last defender AT THE TIME THE BALL IS PLAYED, by the simple expedient of glancing at the ball when it is played. If he is up with play (which he should be), whether the player is offside or not, is another glance along that line. IF he has ANY doubt, the advantage is with the forward, NOT the defender. (Gone are the days when half the Liverpool team put their arms in the air when an opposition player got past them, even if he dribbled past 4 defenders to do so, and still got the decision!) If he is not up with play, he isn't doing his job properly, and should hand in his flag and buy a trained labrador.

I agree with you entirely about using technology, but, as said previously, there is too much vested interest in maintaining the status quo. However, timekeeping should be independently controlled. Ball in play, clock on, out of play for any reason, clock stopped. After a few weeks, timewasting would cease, as it would be pointless as the clock is stopped, and we would get 90 minutes football, instead of the 35 - 40 we get now. Similarly dissent. The captain only should be allowed to speak to the referee, all others approaching booked. Any foul language to the officials an immediate red card. That's what the Law of the game states, so why not enforce it?

Whether or not the ball hit Sterling's arm is open to question - I didn't think so, but what do I know? According to the Laws of the game, for a penalty to be awarded the handball must be both deliberate and seen by the referee. If a player is jumping with his back to the ball to stop a cross, and, for arguments sake, it hit his arm after hitting his back, that cannot, ever, be construed as deliberate. Now to the second part. None of the officials, especially the referee, were in a position to see whether the ball hit his arm, yet it was still given. If the official was to "err", in this instance, then surely it should have been on the side of caution for those reasons?

You mentioned City could have had 4 or 5 yellow cards before Spurs got one. Did you notice in the first half that Toure played a one - two, and was taken out before he was in a position to receive the ball? Result? A free kick and no further action. Or when Walker loses the ball, his first action is always to grab the player (I've noticed that for a few years, and he rarely gets cautioned)? The thing, is, we can all see situations involving opposition players being treated leniently, but never our own. As you say, it's a tribal thing.

I don't think you'll ever find two sets of supporters agreeing at a match on what is and what isn't the right decision. Even home supporters can disagree about the same decision! It's human nature, I'm afraid (unless they're rags, when the word human doesn't come into it).
 
Just seen the this on face book don't know if true or not, but thought it worth posting, apologies if already posted I looked back and couldn't see it.

just been posted on another City site ................................

Richard Orpheus Rahl
8 mins
Yesterday Clattenburg was on the FA Website as down to referee Chelsea V City.
Today he has been removed from City match and replaced by Andre Marriner. Indeed Clats is not refereeing ANY FA Cup matches this weekend now.
He is being probed because of his conflicts of interest and accusations of bias towards clubs, one including City!!
So football is not corrupt eh?
Fifa, Uefa, now the FA match officials involvement in match fixing.... This is a fucking joke!!
 
bumbleblue said:
Just seen the this on face book don't know if true or not, but thought it worth posting, apologies if already posted I looked back and couldn't see it.

just been posted on another City site ................................

Richard Orpheus Rahl
8 mins
Yesterday Clattenburg was on the FA Website as down to referee Chelsea V City.
Today he has been removed from City match and replaced by Andre Marriner. Indeed Clats is not refereeing ANY FA Cup matches this weekend now.
He is being probed because of his conflicts of interest and accusations of bias towards clubs, one including City!!
So football is not corrupt eh?
Fifa, Uefa, now the FA match officials involvement in match fixing.... This is a fucking joke!!
Click to expand...

Same agent as some players.
 
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