Middle East Conflict

mexico1970 said:
That is quite frankly an appalling video and whoever that staffer is they need to be sorted, but everyone knew Israel has always interfered with our politics haven't we?

The next video shows a Hamas leader calling for the death of Israel, not just the occupied lands but the actual removal of it, we are never going to solve it or agree to solve it IMHO.

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It’s horrendous with atrocities and corruption led by Hamas and the Israeli Government. RIP the 3 hostages.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
I don't have anyone on Ignore, though in this thread there are a few candidates (not including yourself though). The problem is that I have a life and a very demanding full time job. Seemingly unlike many posting in here, who seem to spend all their waking hours either looking for videos that confirm their prejudices or posting the same thing ad nauseam in this thread.

I'm also, while very critical of the Israeli government, not obsessed by Israel's existence and actions. Unlike some in here.

Nor am I a latent antisemite. Unlike some in here.

Hope that answers your question.
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I don’t think I asked you a question. I just tried to respond to a couple of your comments, which to me are worth responding to. I tend not to agree with you overall, but you make interesting comments and engage in good faith which isn’t true of everyone - a comment which isn’t directed at any ‘side’.
 
The Future’s Blue! said:
I am neither side and have not seen what you state. This is about the rights and wrongs of what we are seeing on a daily basis. Are you trying to close people down?

Unless the Mod’s have deleted a load of stuff, any chance it could be confirmed?
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If you check the agreed IHRA definition of antisemitism there’s a few posters that blatantly meet that definition with some of their comments. Obviously they don’t agree with the definition but that’s not enough to make their comments not antisemitic unless someone comes up with an alternative definition that is widely agreed.
 
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west didsblue said:
If you check the agreed IHRA definition of antisemitism there’s a few posters that blatantly meet that definition with some of their comments. Obviously they don’t agree with the definition but that’s not enough to make their comments not antisemitic unless someone comes up with an alternative definition that is widely agreed.
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Antisemites disagree with a definition of antisemitism and tell Jews that they're imagining antisemitism. It wouldn't be allowed in any other context on this forum and proves (if it ever needed proving) that David Baddiel is right that "Jews Don't Count".

@Moderating Team There also seems to be a recurrence of videos being posted of dubious provenance. I thought you'd clamped down on this?
 
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Prestwich_Blue said:
Antisemites disagree with a definition of antisemitism and tell Jews that they're imagining antisemitism. It wouldn't be allowed in any other context on this forum and proves (if it ever needed proving) that David Baddie is right that "Jews Don't Count".
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Pretty much anybody who is an antizionist is labelled as an antisemite, so it kind of loses its zing when it’s being used to shut down discourse.

Of course this happens the other way too, but people don’t seem to care as much about being labelled islamophobic.

That care is equalising now though and that’s why there is this debate at what should be allowed and what shouldn’t.
 
west didsblue said:
If you check the agreed IHRA definition of antisemitism there’s a few posters that blatantly meet that definition with some of their comments. Obviously they don’t agree with the definition but that’s not enough to make their comments not antisemitic unless someone comes up with an alternative definition that is widely agreed.
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I suspect you're including the "examples" in the "definition". The preamble makes plain how much effort went into agreeing the definition, but then the examples were tacked on, and it was inevitably going to be contentious to link a definition of antisemitism to the policy of the Israeli state.

Take "Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination, e.g., by claiming that the existence of a State of Israel is a racist endeavor." I may misunderstand the intent behind that, but how is the concept of a "Jewish state" not an endeavour based on race? (That's without the current situation where all Israelis are equal but some are more equal than others.) But is that different from Kurds wanting a Kurdish state? Or "England for the English"? Maybe not, but Israel was of course based on endeavouring to create a Jewish state.

In "The Jewish state" Herzl seems to think Anti-Semitism got worse when Jews were emancipated as people didn't like Jews entering professions from which they'd previosusly been excluded. And if Jews didn't join the Zionist project, either because they wanted to assimilate where they are or just didn't agree with founding a new Jewish state, then if not actually Anti-Semitic they were partially causing Anti-Semitism. And that puts a question mark over another example of AS, to say that Jews (any Jew?) are more loyal to Israel than the "nationality".
 
Alan Harper's Tash said:
Pretty much anybody who is an antizionist is labelled as an antisemite, so it kind of loses its zing when it’s being used to shut down discourse.

Of course this happens the other way too, but people don’t seem to care as much about being labelled islamophobic.

That care is equalising now though and that’s why there is this debate at what should be allowed and what shouldn’t.
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The fact is that they haven't even been honest in their posts about the IHRA. It's disputed by many Jewish academics and organisations, including Israeli human rights organisations.

Which tells you all you need to know about them. Two liberal apologists for racial supremacy.
 
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