More flat track bullying

[Prestwich_Blue]

I am sorry that is arrogance personified. Why should we expect to beat most teams. By that token so should Chelsea Liverpool United and Arsenal. Are you saying Leicester and Tottenham shouldnt win games becaus ethey havent spent as much money as us.

It fine you printing tables over a specified period to try and make some spurious point the truth is we are 4th and if we win our game in hand we will be 3rd its the reality

It's well established statistically that teams with higher wage bills will perform better over a season. Football is an uncertain game though so there will be results and outcomes that go against the general trend. In the last five seasons we've finished 3rd once, 2nd twice and won the title twice. To do that we've beaten most teams, albeit there have been slip ups on the way. So, on tht basis, I'd expect us to beat most teams.

 

[pardoeofftomexico]

Perhaps Prestwich Blue would like to publish another table showing results against the bottom half. If must be pretty impressive or I don't see how we could be so high up in the real table.

 

[chesterguy]

The problem is past trends are no real help in looking at shorter terms

On the basis of past trends City United Chelsea and Arsenal should be top four but this year is different and many city fans have not realised that and are looking back rather than at the here and now

What your table does show is that in the otehr 15 games we have taken 41 points which means we would be top of that table I would suggest

 

[KenTheLandlord]

This is the most bullshit, irrelevant argument ever used to justify our current position and form. Where we have come from is that we have seen hundreds of millions of pounds invested in the team since 2008. I think most of us know we'll have the odd bad game or that players will go through a loss of confidence or dip in form but there should be the expectation that we will be better than most other teams most of the time. That's not being arrogant or entitled - it's what we should expect.

The second bullshit argument is that the PL is more competitive. Maybe is it but that doesn't explain why we're playing well below expectation.

Here's the table showing results against the top half.

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Look where we are and tell me why we're down with the relegation contenders. Tell me why Norwich & Newcastle have done better than us.

If we had even 20 points, instead of the 9 we do have, we'd be top by one point with a game in hand. If we had the 23/24 that the top three clubs in that table have, we'd be cruising to the title.

It also points out that West Ham, man u, Spuds, Liverpool and L'Arse have been utter wank against bottom clubs where as we have have been consistently better, otherwise they would all be 10 points ahead of us. There is 3 points for a win whoever we play so what would it matter if Leicester beat us twice and lost to Villa twice whereas we beat Villa twice and lost to Leicester twice? Us and Leicester would still be on 6 points.

Deffo agree about the wages and it has a been consistent for a long time.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

However the wider context is absolutely that it's a more competitive league and whilst we can argue the toss over certain results, the truth is that the top 8 sides in the league are much tougher than in previous seasons. Doesn't excuse our record against them, but overall if we end the season in the top 3 i'm not sure it'll matter too much.

There's three teams - Leicester, West Ham and, to a slightly lesser extent, Spurs - who have performed better than expected. United and Chelsea ,who we'd have expected to be up there, have performed a lot worse. So in the overall scheme of things, I'd accept that as an argument to a degree.

But it certainly doesn't answer the question of why we are under-performing as a team and individuals. It doesn't account for Silva seemingly being unable to pass to a team-mate (although the pass for Aguero's second was him at his sublime best). It doesn't explain why our midfield and defence parts like the Red Sea when an opposing team run at it with purpose, like for Liverpool's first goal on Wednesday. Or why Hart stood rooted to the spot while Lallana's shot trickled past him from distance. It doesn't explain why Otamendi insists on diving in 40 yards up the field and leaving a huge hole behind him or why Demichelis couldn't be bothered jumping with Huth for Leicester's third.

So finishing 3rd in the context of a stronger league is acceptable. Finishing third because of individual mistakes or sustained under-performance as a team is less so.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Perhaps Prestwich Blue would like to publish another table showing results against the bottom half. If must be pretty impressive or I don't see how we could be so high up in the real table.

We've dropped just 4 points from our 15 games against the bottom half (home to Everton and away at Villa) so we've got 41 out of 45 or 2.93 points per game. That's more than any other team which reinforces the claim that we are flat-track bullies.

 

[franksinatra]

The only reason for the competitive league this season is the race to the bottom from the top by sides like City/Chelsea. It is not because of a rising standard across the board. Case in point how well the promoted sides of last year are doing. Bournemouth and Watford are already safe and we are only just in March.

Arsenal are suddenly title contenders but in reality they will struggle to match there 75 point total from last year. Since the fall of United there was a real opportunity for City to dominate and we (as the league stands) have failed to take this.

Season 2012 we amassed 89 points in a league competing with a Ferguson United side, Chelsea who won the Champs leg, a Spurs side with Modric, Bale, VDV, Arsenal side with Van Persie hitting 30 goals and a Pool side with Suarez. Now we are struggling to hit 80 points.

The side has regressed. It is indisputable. The fact that we are still completely reliant on Aguero, Silva, Kompany, Yaya players bought pre 2012 shows the failings in our transfer policy. Sadly those players are getting older,more injury prone and less driven and for all the money spent they have not been adequately replaced. Arguably we have not even managed to replace Joleon Lescott with both the signings of Mangala and Otamendi providing more questions than answers.

 

[Keepingthefaithsince1976]

I think I'll choose to enjoy today's win instead of fucking moaning.

Be careful...the moanaholics were out in force on the game thread.

 

[chesterguy]

It is not because of a rising standard across the board. Case in point how well the promoted sides of last year are doing.

How can you argue that standards have not risen. It is clear that other sides have progressed such as West Ham Tottenham and Leicester and Stoke

Since the fall of United there was a real opportunity for City to dominate

Why did we have this opportunity did not any other club? That is the arrogance of us City fans and whilst so many are upset that we are not winning the league by 10 points. As I say there is an arrogance by many on here which is based on the old adage that more money must therefore equal more success it has historically it hasnt this year who knows how things will pan out in the future

I think it may come down alot less to money as all clubs can compete and keep players due to the influx of cash it will down much more to team spirit, better coaching and those sides with a better balance between youth and experience

 

[kaz7]

I think I'll choose to enjoy today's win instead of fucking moaning.

If only more would appreciate a win

 

[Gorton_Tubster]

The fact that we havent beat the top 6 teams, very poor performances (across the board) when playing away is obviously a moral/confidence thing. That is what the manager is for, and he cant do it in the prem, never has been able to. He's good at tactics and the technical side, but as far as man management goes he hasnt got it.

I want to see more of this....

 

[cleavers]

How can you argue that standards have not risen. It is clear that other sides have progressed such as West Ham Tottenham and Leicester and Stoke



Why did we have this opportunity did not any other club? That is the arrogance of us City fans and whilst so many are upset that we are not winning the league by 10 points. As I say there is an arrogance by many on here which is based on the old adage that more money must therefore equal more success it has historically it hasnt this year who knows how things will pan out in the future

I think it may come down alot less to money as all clubs can compete and keep players due to the influx of cash it will down much more to team spirit, better coaching and those sides with a better balance between youth and experience

I'm glad its not only me that sees it this way, we should be doing better than we are, but not enough credit is given to others doing well.

 

[franksinatra]

How can you argue that standards have not risen. It is clear that other sides have progressed such as West Ham Tottenham and Leicester and Stoke



Why did we have this opportunity did not any other club? That is the arrogance of us City fans and whilst so many are upset that we are not winning the league by 10 points. As I say there is an arrogance by many on here which is based on the old adage that more money must therefore equal more success it has historically it hasnt this year who knows how things will pan out in the future

I think it may come down alot less to money as all clubs can compete and keep players due to the influx of cash it will down much more to team spirit, better coaching and those sides with a better balance between youth and experience

Tottenham are not a patch on the side from 2012 when they had two players who are now currently plying there trade for Real Madrid.

I can accept your point Stoke, West Ham, Leicester have improved but similarly sides like Newcastle Swansea, Villa have become much worse.

Only last year Chelsea won this league in a canter with 87 points so unless there has been a massive surge in quality over the past one year it is not arrogant to expect the club to be outperforming its current achievements and clubs like Leicester.

As for this arrogance rubbish do not be so ridiculous. We have had a perfect platform to dominate this league. We have the strongest squad, a core of successful players integrated, the largest transfer budget and an infrastructure second to none. Sadly we have not kicked on. It is the most natural thing in the world to analyse why other clubs have passed us by. Do you think the likes of Khaldoon are arrogant because you can rest assured he will be analysing this?

If your argument is other clubs have improved across the board it's still a valid argument to question why with the competitive advantage of our transfer budget and wage budget we have not matched this.

 

[KenTheLandlord]

The fact that we havent beat the top 6 teams, very poor performances (across the board) when playing away is obviously a moral/confidence thing. That is what the manager is for, and he cant do it in the prem, never has been able to. He's good at tactics and the technical side, but as far as man management goes he hasnt got it.

Absolutely bizarre.
Won the PL and Runners up and still in the running for winning it again, and you reckon he cannot do it.
He has done it. No question.

 

[prestonibbo_mcfc]

These days, we are a big scalp and EVERY TEAM will play their socks off against us.
Some might think all our players are shit, but those who play against us know what we are capable of.
We simply do not work hard enough (off the ball) and against lesser sides, get away with it.
It doesn't help that Manuel has the odd brain fart against the top sides and sets the team up for crucifixion.

 

[YaYa's Left Peg]

Tottenham are not a patch on the side from 2012 when they had two players who are now currently plying there trade for Real Madrid.

I can accept your point Stoke, West Ham, Leicester have improved but similarly sides like Newcastle Swansea, Villa have become much worse.

Only last year Chelsea won this league in a canter with 87 points so unless there has been a massive surge in quality over the past one year it is not arrogant to expect the club to be outperforming its current achievements and clubs like Leicester.

As for this arrogance rubbish do not be so ridiculous. We have had a perfect platform to dominate this league. We have the strongest squad, a core of successful players integrated, the largest transfer budget and an infrastructure second to none. Sadly we have not kicked on. It is the most natural thing in the world to analyse why other clubs have passed us by. Do you think the likes of Khaldoon are arrogant because you can rest assured he will be analysing this?

If your argument is other clubs have improved across the board it's still a valid argument to question why with the competitive advantage of our transfer budget and wage budget we have not matched this.

Got to agree with this, but the question is why we haven't kicked on? Can't be the infrastructure, so is it the manager? Player motivation? Injuries? The weather?

 

[squirtyflower]

Maybe the OP would prefer it if we had scraped a 1-0 win?

 

[kaz7]

The fact that we havent beat the top 6 teams, very poor performances (across the board) when playing away is obviously a moral/confidence thing. That is what the manager is for, and he cant do it in the prem, never has been able to. He's good at tactics and the technical side, but as far as man management goes he hasnt got it.

I want to see more of this....

I can't wait to see pep do that,constructive hystronics

 

[Exeter Blue I am here]

I'm glad its not only me that sees it this way, we should be doing better than we are, but not enough credit is given to others doing well.

I could run with that argument a little more easily had we been beaten by a spread of teams rather than just everyone in the top half of the table, and if we'd been on the receiving end of a number of 'unlucky' defeats rather than the reverse being true. Stoke, Leicester et al, are unquestionably better this season than in previous years, but the number of complete capitulations we have served up (littered with repeat errors, in terms of team selection, set up, tactics, attitude, the lot) against any team prepared to get stuck into us and with sufficient quality to punish us as well, has been nobody's business.

Teams like West Ham, Leicester and Southampton have never before had players of the quality of Payet, Mahrez, Kante, Sane and so on, so there is mitigation for us in that regard, but the fact that we haven't been trounced in the Chimps League, says to me there is something about Premier League football specifically that has exposed an underlying problem (or problems) with the City squad this season. Injuries have played a significant part, but for me the lack of steel and/or physicality has been equally important. Barry, De Jong, Garcia, Milner, even Dzeko, they all represented a physical presence that allowed Silva, Nasri & Co to work their magic, and they've all gone. I went to Klanfield on Wednesday and sat and watched in complete frustration as Liverpool swarmed all over Silva, Navas and Sterling and levered them off the ball repeatedly like they were little schoolboys. Ya Ya missing that game was crucial, and the loss of KDB has been a real kick in the nards in terms of support for Aguero, who cuts an isolated figure on such nights.

Key signings for me in the summer are some height, power and pace in the engine room, and a quality forward to support Aguero, not a big, immobile lummox completed unsuited to our style of play.

 

[Corky]

The track is flat for both sides, a stupid saying.