Nicola Sturgeon

[sd92]

I voted No last time, any next time depends on Brexit I'll decide if and when. It's not that unusual. If every SNP voter had voted Yes last time it would have been much closer, it would probably have won with Yes voters that voted for other parties.

Ah fair enough.

I never realised people vote SNP but were anti Indy.

Every day is a school day...

 

[sd92]

“Getting into bed with the Tories” is a nonsense way of describing what happened, it’s pure hyperbole and it’s not relevant now.

You’re getting what you want from voting Labour, apparently, but as I say, it’s not enough.

Well how would you describe it?

Whatever way you want to describe it, it has hurt labour hugely up here.

Fwiw I voted yes and voted for corbyn last time around.

 

[blueparrot]

Ah fair enough.

I never realised people vote SNP but were anti Indy.

Every day is a school day...

Anti would be a bit strong, weighing up last time it was the currency and EU membership that brought me down on the No side probable by about 60/40. Brexit makes it more 50/50 at the moment. The thing is though independence aside. Anyone wanting a left of centre sensible party in Scotland that can win, will vote SNP, an option centrist voters in England wish they had.

 

[Saddleworth2]

Brexit was always going to be a huge thing for the Indy movement.

I tend to frequent scottish forums, but find it hard to locate A) tories and B) those that are anti Indy, which is why I wanted to come on this.

I may take a look at the brexit thread. But I can imagine what it is like.

No. You can’t possibly. In terms of Indy ref 2, I do hope that wee Nicky learns from Brexit and tries to take the country with her. An implementation plan would be good and a clear answer on currency, central bank, and some of the big stuff that wasn’t addressed properly in Indy ref 1. Mind you, another term of Liar Johnson and his misfits may well have us building a bloody wall.

 

[Cheesy]

I know a lot of Scots from my time in the Armed Forces and I also know quite a few who live in England.

Genuine question.... why does not one of these want Scottish independence?

 

[TheRemainsOfTheDave]

Ah fair enough.

I never realised people vote SNP but were anti Indy.

Every day is a school day...

Surely someone can be pro independence AND realise that now might not be the right time and so vote for the nationalists in order to maintain the right amount of control within devolved government.

I'm not a financial expert, and so take my information from those that are and most I have found suggest an independent Scotland could face a prolonged period of austerity. The problem is that there are so many unknowns (such as which currency you would use, whether you could even join the EU, what percentage of UK debt you would be facing and how the rest of the UK will be trading with the EU dictating how you trade with your traditional market south of the border) that it's evidently a more risky step than Brexit. It seems on the face of it that the attitude to Scottish independence is remarkably similar to the attitude from those wanting a No Deal Brexit, the very same attitude that the SNP have been accusing people of with regard to falsehoods and optimistic outcomes.

I think it is right to point out the similarities in support of fellow UK nationals living in Scotland who may not want independence as they don't appear to have much of a political voice at the moment. As someone who would prefer the union to remain intact but understands the will of the people, surely waiting to see how Brexit unfolds would be much wiser.

 

[Coatigan]

Labour haven’t been in power since and the year following this, the party changed leadership.

I think to distil labour's demise in scotland purely down to the vow or backlash for their part in indyref is a bit naive imho.

Played a big part, certainly, but ultimately, they have shown to be a party of self-preservation first and foremost, and to put party interests ahead of Scotland's. And to be a poor opposition party. On top of that, the SNP showing they can be a credible alternative both in government locally and at westminster, the greens likewise locally only, people have gone where they feel momentum. I can't see a way back for them im a while.

 

[Coatigan]

I know a lot of Scots from my time in the Armed Forces and I also know quite a few who live in England.

Genuine question.... why does not one of these want Scottish independence?

I think that is a question for them, i don't think you'd expect someone here to be ablexto answer that?

 

[Coatigan]

This election is about gaining the mandate for Indy 2. Nobody will vote for the SNP who don't back that. That's why it's so important. To think anyone who is against Indy will vote SNP, is as mental as me buying shares in The Rangers. This vote will show wether we have a democratic right to determine our own future. If we get 40 seats or more there is no way we can be refused unless we are now in a juanta situation. Let's wait and see how Scotland votes. Latest polls suggest Scottish Labour will win 1 seat. 1 seat in a country that hasn't voted for the Tories in nearly 70 years. That's how much Labour shat the bed up here. They are finished. Corbyn and Bawbag talking about what they will allow us to do, like a couple of colonial overlords has fucked so many people off. We expect that off Tories, but Corbyn once again misjudges our hatred of people trying to take the **** out of us. He will soon find out how that manifests itself.

In many ways, i can't disagree with that. Which is why the SNP will do worse than they did in 2015, by nailing themselves to that mast. The no voters, or even the yes voters that see it as a premature re-run will vote against them. For the time being at least.
Which is why the Tories in Scotland are polling only slightly less than in 2017, despite Ruth's stepping down, and are reportedly likely to retain 12 of the 13 seats. Which, should suggest the appetite for independence has not increased substantially, or as significantly as the snp would need.

That wasn't my point btw, it was purely that there are SNP 'no' voters, in noticeable numbers. It us a bit more toned and dimensional than the single issue politics that brexit is all about. That was it.

 

[Coatigan]

A scottish unionist defending Sturgeon and the Indy movement and Scottish voters that vote SNP but don’t want Indy.

What is this world I have stepped into? Haha.

A multi-dimensional one where multiple lateral ungeometric thoughts can occur simultaneously, where not everything is black or white, and ambition covers more than one single issue.