Pay to listen to Corbyn speak

[bluemoonmatt]

Is he paying us. It’ll have to be a princely sum for me to sit thru so much as a sentence that man can muster.

 

[inchy14]

It's true. A major British political party committing racist acts and people defending racism as "no big deal" seems to be my button.

Who knew that systematically designed inequality could infuriate a left winger huh?



Bollocks. If the races were reversed, or more likely this was UKIP or the Tories rather than Labour, you'd be going off your rocker.

And rightfully so.

Because it's racist by design.

And racism is bad.




I can't stand "the likes of you" because you're apologists for terrible behaviour both within the Party and outside of it. It doesn't matter what the Party does or says or acts or votes or anything. All that matters is that as long as your unpopular and unelectable agenda is being served then you defend, defend, defend. And after some of your posts since Corbyn has been elected towards me, @blueinsa, and many other traditionally Labour voters about how we're unwelcome you can stick your new "we're all on the same side" narrative. It's yet another ridiculously transparent attempt to snidely remark how dissent isn't welcome in "your" Labour Party. Fuck "your" Labour Party and the people in it who are driving it into the ground.

I'm a member of the Labour Party because I want to get the Labour Party elected in order to help people right now. Not fight an ideological war which does nothing but serve a few selfish interests.

You're a member of the Labour Party because you want to be a member of a club and here's the biggest thing, you don't care about the people who most proclaim to be helping. It's all about you and YOUR membership.. You sit there and watch as a Leader that failed to win an election and much of the country just won't vote for takes another go at it. We have the most disorganised and suicidal Tory party in modern history, an NHS and social safety net under siege in cutbacks, a monumental fuck up of Brexit both in vote and handling, the scandal of Government handing billions in contracts to companies that can't afford to complete it, an actual cartoon character in the White House bloviating every day, and a massive groundswell of anger from the working classes towards the establishment. The Labour leader should be at the dispatch box every Wednesday savaging May and her team. They should have one of the largest leads anywhere such is the epic fuck up that the Tory party exists in a constant state of. They should be BEGGING for an election in order to win a landslide not seen since Blair.

So where are they? THEY'RE 1 POINT AHEAD. INSIDE THE MARGIN OF ERROR. PEOPLE EVEN THINK MAY IS A BETTER PM. MY DOG WOULD BE A BETTER PM THAN HER AND CORBYN STILL TRAILS HER. AND MY DOG CAN'T SPEAK ENGLISH, IS INCONTINENT AND ALSO DEAD.. Jesus fucking Christ.

This isn't even a football match that you have to win. It's not even that you have to score a penalty. The ball is on the line and Labour keep banging it right against the post. Then a bunch of knobheads come onto social media and say "Oh wow! Did you see how close he came to scoring there? I can't wait until 10 years down the line when all of his practice pays off and he manages to put it over the line!".

In complete seriousness, here's my legitimate problem with the current direction of Labour. People are dying. Not in the conceptual sense where they're struggling hard but physically expiring unjustly due to underfunded services. And they're dying because of policies enacted by the current Tory Party who, I believe, see them as collateral damage for a financial security in the same way that soldiers dying in wars are collateral damage for security of the country. We're not in 2005 where we can have long intellectual discussions about the state of the Party and what 21st Century socialism should look like to be electable and how it can be marketed correctly to a public that doesn't seem to understand its virtues due to gross mismanagement in the past. That's a worthy goal but it's not a goal in 2018. The goal here above all else is electability because we need to stop people from dying and we need to re-institute a social safety net that is growing weaker every day and we can't DO THAT with 260 MPs.

So yes, of course I'm angry with Labour. I think you're not only sat around philosophising about the Party direction and attempting to purge impurity but much, much more importantly than that, I think you're hypocrites who claim that you care for the working classes and the extreme poor but aren't willing to sacrifice an inch of ideology in order to attract the voters that will put us in a position where we can stop it. Your ideology is more important to you than the people. You're in this for the wrong reasons.

Quality rant mate.

I don’t often post in the political threads because a) I think they’re mostly in it for themselves and b) because it bores the tits off me as they all act like a bunch of twats in the Houses of Parliament and I find none of them worthy of the roles they have.

However that rant has a hell of a lot of truth in it.

 

[Blue Mist]

And the Rooney rule?

Eh ? that is being inclusive not exclusive. It is to stop white bosses interviewing only white applicants. It is an attempt to ensure everyone is treated as equal whereas this arguement is about treating people differently based on the colour of their skin. What happened was a silly mistake and has died a death in every other corner of society but you seem to insist it stays alive on here.

 

[Ghandi's Flip Flops]

I can't stand "the likes of you" because you're apologists for terrible behaviour both within the Party and outside of it. It doesn't matter what the Party does or says or acts or votes or anything. All that matters is that as long as your unpopular and unelectable agenda is being served then you defend, defend, defend. And after some of your posts since Corbyn has been elected towards me, @blueinsa, and many other traditionally Labour voters about how we're unwelcome you can stick your new "we're all on the same side" narrative. It's yet another ridiculously transparent attempt to snidely remark how dissent isn't welcome in "your" Labour Party. Fuck "your" Labour Party and the people in it who are driving it into the ground.

I'm a member of the Labour Party because I want to get the Labour Party elected in order to help people right now. Not fight an ideological war which does nothing but serve a few selfish interests.

You're a member of the Labour Party because you want to be a member of a club and here's the biggest thing, you don't care about the people who most proclaim to be helping. It's all about you and YOUR membership.. You sit there and watch as a Leader that failed to win an election and much of the country just won't vote for takes another go at it. We have the most disorganised and suicidal Tory party in modern history, an NHS and social safety net under siege in cutbacks, a monumental fuck up of Brexit both in vote and handling, the scandal of Government handing billions in contracts to companies that can't afford to complete it, an actual cartoon character in the White House bloviating every day, and a massive groundswell of anger from the working classes towards the establishment. The Labour leader should be at the dispatch box every Wednesday savaging May and her team. They should have one of the largest leads anywhere such is the epic fuck up that the Tory party exists in a constant state of. They should be BEGGING for an election in order to win a landslide not seen since Blair.

So where are they? THEY'RE 1 POINT AHEAD. INSIDE THE MARGIN OF ERROR. PEOPLE EVEN THINK MAY IS A BETTER PM. MY DOG WOULD BE A BETTER PM THAN HER AND CORBYN STILL TRAILS HER. AND MY DOG CAN'T SPEAK ENGLISH, IS INCONTINENT AND ALSO DEAD.. Jesus fucking Christ.

This isn't even a football match that you have to win. It's not even that you have to score a penalty. The ball is on the line and Labour keep banging it right against the post. Then a bunch of knobheads come onto social media and say "Oh wow! Did you see how close he came to scoring there? I can't wait until 10 years down the line when all of his practice pays off and he manages to put it over the line!".

In complete seriousness, here's my legitimate problem with the current direction of Labour. People are dying. Not in the conceptual sense where they're struggling hard but physically expiring unjustly due to underfunded services. And they're dying because of policies enacted by the current Tory Party who, I believe, see them as collateral damage for a financial security in the same way that soldiers dying in wars are collateral damage for security of the country. We're not in 2005 where we can have long intellectual discussions about the state of the Party and what 21st Century socialism should look like to be electable and how it can be marketed correctly to a public that doesn't seem to understand its virtues due to gross mismanagement in the past. That's a worthy goal but it's not a goal in 2018. The goal here above all else is electability because we need to stop people from dying and we need to re-institute a social safety net that is growing weaker every day and we can't DO THAT with 260 MPs.

So yes, of course I'm angry with Labour. I think you're not only sat around philosophising about the Party direction and attempting to purge impurity but much, much more importantly than that, I think you're hypocrites who claim that you care for the working classes and the extreme poor but aren't willing to sacrifice an inch of ideology in order to attract the voters that will put us in a position where we can stop it. Your ideology is more important to you than the people. You're in this for the wrong reasons.

Wow. Top rant.
So much in there that I can relate to

 

[happy daze]

This has been shown as an absolute lie being pushed by the Tory party......could they sink any lower?

No it isn't,sure the mail is a rag but that doesn't mean everything it publishes is a lie.
The labour party has long departed and barely hid its contempt for its tradiional supporters,what is proposed is nothing other than a monumental cock up and an attempt to look good to bames,do they imagine this has made them all feel good about themselves?

 

[The perfect fumble]

It's true. A major British political party committing racist acts and people defending racism as "no big deal" seems to be my button.

Who knew that systematically designed inequality could infuriate a left winger huh?



Bollocks. If the races were reversed, or more likely this was UKIP or the Tories rather than Labour, you'd be going off your rocker.

And rightfully so.

Because it's racist by design.

And racism is bad.




I can't stand "the likes of you" because you're apologists for terrible behaviour both within the Party and outside of it. It doesn't matter what the Party does or says or acts or votes or anything. All that matters is that as long as your unpopular and unelectable agenda is being served then you defend, defend, defend. And after some of your posts since Corbyn has been elected towards me, @blueinsa, and many other traditionally Labour voters about how we're unwelcome you can stick your new "we're all on the same side" narrative. It's yet another ridiculously transparent attempt to snidely remark how dissent isn't welcome in "your" Labour Party. Fuck "your" Labour Party and the people in it who are driving it into the ground.

I'm a member of the Labour Party because I want to get the Labour Party elected in order to help people right now. Not fight an ideological war which does nothing but serve a few selfish interests.

You're a member of the Labour Party because you want to be a member of a club and here's the biggest thing, you don't care about the people who most proclaim to be helping. It's all about you and YOUR membership.. You sit there and watch as a Leader that failed to win an election and much of the country just won't vote for takes another go at it. We have the most disorganised and suicidal Tory party in modern history, an NHS and social safety net under siege in cutbacks, a monumental fuck up of Brexit both in vote and handling, the scandal of Government handing billions in contracts to companies that can't afford to complete it, an actual cartoon character in the White House bloviating every day, and a massive groundswell of anger from the working classes towards the establishment. The Labour leader should be at the dispatch box every Wednesday savaging May and her team. They should have one of the largest leads anywhere such is the epic fuck up that the Tory party exists in a constant state of. They should be BEGGING for an election in order to win a landslide not seen since Blair.

So where are they? THEY'RE 1 POINT AHEAD. INSIDE THE MARGIN OF ERROR. PEOPLE EVEN THINK MAY IS A BETTER PM. MY DOG WOULD BE A BETTER PM THAN HER AND CORBYN STILL TRAILS HER. AND MY DOG CAN'T SPEAK ENGLISH, IS INCONTINENT AND ALSO DEAD.. Jesus fucking Christ.

This isn't even a football match that you have to win. It's not even that you have to score a penalty. The ball is on the line and Labour keep banging it right against the post. Then a bunch of knobheads come onto social media and say "Oh wow! Did you see how close he came to scoring there? I can't wait until 10 years down the line when all of his practice pays off and he manages to put it over the line!".

In complete seriousness, here's my legitimate problem with the current direction of Labour. People are dying. Not in the conceptual sense where they're struggling hard but physically expiring unjustly due to underfunded services. And they're dying because of policies enacted by the current Tory Party who, I believe, see them as collateral damage for a financial security in the same way that soldiers dying in wars are collateral damage for security of the country. We're not in 2005 where we can have long intellectual discussions about the state of the Party and what 21st Century socialism should look like to be electable and how it can be marketed correctly to a public that doesn't seem to understand its virtues due to gross mismanagement in the past. That's a worthy goal but it's not a goal in 2018. The goal here above all else is electability because we need to stop people from dying and we need to re-institute a social safety net that is growing weaker every day and we can't DO THAT with 260 MPs.

So yes, of course I'm angry with Labour. I think you're not only sat around philosophising about the Party direction and attempting to purge impurity but much, much more importantly than that, I think you're hypocrites who claim that you care for the working classes and the extreme poor but aren't willing to sacrifice an inch of ideology in order to attract the voters that will put us in a position where we can stop it. Your ideology is more important to you than the people. You're in this for the wrong reasons.

You create a fantasy about me and others like me which exists entirely in your head, but perhaps most significantly you see me as the enemy within, ripping the Labour Party to pieces and making it unelectable, removing any hope of power, effectively doing the Tories work for them by destroying any possibility of ousting them.

You despise my rigid adherence to doctrine, believing it betrays the people the Labour Party is supposed to represent. You hate how I love to wallow in identity politics, fiddling as Rome burns, more interested in being right on about disabled West Indian females in Haringey than the de-industrialisation of the north and bread and butter issues important to ordinary men and women like jobs, wages, childcare, education and the NHS.

You get angry about this rally because you see it as symptomatic of a cancer in the Party and that cancer is people like me.

 

[stonerblue]

I knew it.

You waited 4 hours and that's all you can come up with?

 

[Ancient Citizen]

No it isn't,sure the mail is a rag but that doesn't mean everything it publishes is a lie.
The labour party has long departed and barely hid its contempt for its tradiional supporters,what is proposed is nothing other than a monumental cock up and an attempt to look good to bames,do they imagine this has made them all feel good about themselves?

This is true, many, many people I know have become disillusioned with Labour because of stunts like this.
The current leadership, promoted ( successfully ) by Momentum, appears to have accepted the fact that their far left agenda will
never gain traction amongst its traditional base and is going hell for leather at motivating the youth vote.
Whether there can be an eventual election victory with this stance will be evident in a few years. Personally, I don't think so,
as to win elections you have to win over many Conservative voters, something Blair did to brilliant effect.

 

[Damocles]

You create a fantasy about me and others like me which exists entirely in your head, but perhaps most significantly you see me as the enemy within, ripping the Labour Party to pieces and making it unelectable, removing any hope of power, effectively doing the Tories work for them by destroying any possibility of ousting them.

You despise my rigid adherence to doctrine, believing it betrays the people the Labour Party is supposed to represent. You hate how I love to wallow in identity politics, fiddling as Rome burns, more interested in being right on about disabled West Indian females in Haringey than the de-industrialisation of the north and bread and butter issues important to ordinary men and women like jobs, wages, childcare, education and the NHS.

You get angry about this rally because you see it as symptomatic of a cancer in the Party and that cancer is people like me.

I don't see you as the enemy within though I do think that the hard left, which you have come to symbolise through your posting over many years, are more interested in getting an ideologically perfect Labour Party than they are in actually winning elections. They want to win elections on their terms, not the country's terms.

I don't get angry about this because I'm worried about the soul of the Labour Party. The Labour Party is a multimillion pound organisation with tons of members. They'll be fine. They'll piss about with NEC elections and internal squabblings and Len McCluskey. I get angry about this because the state of public services in our country is abysmal and people actually now need the Labour Party in ways that they didn't previously need them. I'm angry at the hard left because they're rejecting the core function of the Party. Labour doesn't exist for the sake of Labour Party officials, it exists to serve a purpose for the people of this country.

Me and you can sit here and argue about privatisation, the merits of systemic inequality, European federalisation and national identity for as long as we want. That's a privilege that we have. Others who are caught in desperate poverty because of Tory cuts, the type of people who are relying on the Labour Party to save them from failed austerity policies and make their lives better, do not.

And easier way of summing this up is that politics is a game of compromise on a macro scale. I don't see the Momentum zealots sat willing to compromise on ideology in order to win the white working classes, who seem to be deserting Labour based on my experiences and national polling, nor compromise to win the ambitious middle classes who want to be rewarded for their hard work and get on in life. Your "West Indian families in Haringey" example is offensive, but this whole incident is a perfect example of what I mean. Instead of thinking "well how is this going to look to voters in Wigan or voters in Surrey?", they think "how is this going to look to BAME members?"

Labour currently exists in its own space and not in a national space. That internalisation is the very thing that's making us unelectable.

Question for you - say by some miracle that young Tony Blair just appeared in 2018 like he did after the death of John Smith. Same fresh face, unknown to the general public outside of the political sphere, extolling soft left policies to the world. Do you think he would be within 1 point of the the Tories and seen as a secondary choice to May?

Me neither. That's half of my problem. The Party LOVE Corbyn - hell, I like Corbyn. The public don't. We're not put into Government by the Party, we're put into Government by the public. They are our ultimate Lord and Masters. He had his shot at an election which he fully deserved and the plots to oust him angered me even more than this angers me. But the public saw him, digested him and his ideas, then chose to vote for Mrs BumbleFuck and her Merry Band of Morons instead.

Then instead of mass annoyance about how we fucked up an open net, all we hear from the hard left is about how he "almost won". I'm sure Bob down the road who can't pay his gas bill and is waiting 6 hours for an ambulance to the hospital will be delighted to hear that he's fucked for another half decade but that a certain side of the Labour Party didn't fail quite as badly as people expected.

 

[SWP's back]

You waited 4 hours and that's all you can come up with?

Are you still drunk?

You posted at 7:22pm and I replied at 7:29pm.

That's four hours?