PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules

As a former auditor, albeit many years ago and probably out of touch with modern practice, I'd like to clarify something. Our accounts do have to give a 'true and fair view' of our financial transactions and situation. But there's no definitive answer to, or statutory definition of, what 'true and fair' is.

But generally, for an auditor not to confirm that accounts were true and fair, there would have to be a material issue, not a few quid here or there. So even if the auditors knew about the alternative Mancini contract and felt that it should have been reported by City, in their accounts, I very much doubt they would qualify the accounts. I doubt they'd even know about it though, because it was a personal contract between Mancini and an unconnected third-party.

For a company like City, or an even bigger one, the auditors won't check every single transaction. They might satisfy themselves as to the adequacy of the financial systems for accurately recording income and expenditure and would examine relevant financial controls. A key one is whether an individual could both initiate, authorise and receive a large payment, without a second or multiple persons checking.

They most likely would (certainly in my day) have checked the larger items and that would include Etihad's sponsorship. So if our accounts showed £50m revenue from Etihad, they'd probably check that £50m was actually received. That might a single payment, or multiple payments. As long as they could track that £50m from the bank statements to the P&L account, I doubt they'd enquire much further.

But if they could only see £10m of that claimed £50m, they'd ask questions. The answer from the CFO might be that we're waiting for the other £40m,which was due shortly. I suspect they'd want to see that £40m come in before they expressed an opinion, or at the very least, have assurances from Etihad that this payment was due, relates to the period under review and a good idea of when it was due to be paid. They'd then have to make a decision as to whether the accounts were 'true and fair' (because £40m would be material) and even if they did sign the accounts off, they'd probably demand evidence of it arriving and maybe make some comment, or insist City made a relevant comment in those accounts.

Another scenario might be Etihad paying us £10m and the other £40m being from ADUG. They would presumably then question whether that was equity funding, and should therefore go into the balance sheet, rather than the P&L account. That would be subject to discussions with City senior management but I'd say the likelihood is that they would insist on it being reclassified, as it's material.

I think someone said earlier in this thread that it wasn't necessarily what was done, but what the intent was that would determine fraud. The valuation of stock affects profit. This has to be valued at the lower of cost or net realisable value, but cost may have a number of different components. It may be a very subjective judgement on what NRV is but it could be that a company is valuing stock, which it knows is completely worthless, at cost. That's likely to be fraudulent. There have been many cases where revenue from contracts signed or meant to be signed with customers has been knowingly overstated.

A high-profile case involves the software company Autonomy, who used to sponsor Spurs. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47691083. I think Mike Lynch is still fighting extradition but the UK courts have broadly supported HP's view that he and his CFO were guilty of fraud.

So just because a set of accounts aren't correct to the nearest pound, doesn't mean they aren't showing a true and fair view. And even if they're held not to be a true and fair view, there could be other reasons beyond a deliberate fraud why they might not be.

I have commented on true, fair and accurate before on this thread but I will repeat some of that in a moment.

For context, I started out in audit in what is now part of one of the big four accounting firms but swiftly moved out of practice after qualifying; albeit initially into internal audit. Since then I have worked in senior finance roles for many years in businesses of varying size and been to subjected to many audits.

I have little doubt that you are correct about how city's auditors would have dealt with sponsorship income, they would have been all over anything that material.

My previous comments:
The distinction between fair and accurate is very important and I am not going to get into a long discussion of that as it will bore but - odd as it may seem to laymen - there is no requirement under law to file totally accurate accounts. In fact, it's almost fucking impossible with any sizeable business.

Fair does though mean that accounts should be materially correct - and materiality varies depending on circumstances.

Fair also means that transactions have been reported appropriately and that is where trouble might arise for City, as I guess the EPL are going to try and argue that transactions not in City's books, and which legally were not required to be, should have been reported - at least in some way - to the EPL.

Good luck with proving such a thing (obviously I don't actually wish the EPL anything but the worst of fortune). I very much doubt that all the various auditors involved have not done sufficient work to ensure that their clients' account were not true and fair under the relevant laws of the land.

The EPL look like they may be wishing to redefine the meaning of true and fair and other accepted accounting terms such as related party.
 
I have commented on true, fair and accurate before on this thread but I will repeat some of that in a moment.

For context, I started out in audit in what is now part of one of the big four accounting firms but swiftly moved out of practice after qualifying; albeit initially into internal audit. Since then I have worked in senior finance roles for many years in businesses of varying size and been to subjected to many audits.

I have little doubt that you are correct about how city's auditors would have dealt with sponsorship income, they would have been all over anything that material.

My previous comments:
The distinction between fair and accurate is very important and I am not going to get into a long discussion of that as it will bore but - odd as it may seem to laymen - there is no requirement under law to file totally accurate accounts. In fact, it's almost fucking impossible with any sizeable business.

Fair does though mean that accounts should be materially correct - and materiality varies depending on circumstances.

Fair also means that transactions have been reported appropriately and that is where trouble might arise for City, as I guess the EPL are going to try and argue that transactions not in City's books, and which legally were not required to be, should have been reported - at least in some way - to the EPL.

Good luck with proving such a thing (obviously I don't actually wish the EPL anything but the worst of fortune). I very much doubt that all the various auditors involved have not done sufficient work to ensure that their clients' account were not true and fair under the relevant laws of the land.

The EPL look like they may be wishing to redefine the meaning of true and fair and other accepted accounting terms such as related party.
Redifining the meaning of true and fair, what so 'its blue and so unfair'.

I jest of course
 
Source? Claimed by whom - you?
The only thing I could find from a quick search was from Der Spiegel https://www.spiegel.de/internationa...osed-chapter-4-a-global-empire-a-1236622.html

Strangely (or not) they don't bother to reproduce any of the hacked documents or emails but just ask us to trust them, it's not like they've ever made anything up is it?

Most of it seems to be just bitter little digs based on the PL being more successful than the German league anyway. They do claim that his "second salary" was paid through ADUG to Al Jazira to Sparkleglow Holdings (presumably Mancini's company). Is there anyone who thinks our higher ups are stupid enough to do this through ADUG?
 
The only thing I could find from a quick search was from Der Spiegel https://www.spiegel.de/internationa...osed-chapter-4-a-global-empire-a-1236622.html

Strangely (or not) they don't bother to reproduce any of the hacked documents or emails but just ask us to trust them, it's not like they've ever made anything up is it?

Most of it seems to be just bitter little digs based on the PL being more successful than the German league anyway. They do claim that his "second salary" was paid through ADUG to Al Jazira to Sparkleglow Holdings (presumably Mancini's company). Is there anyone who thinks our higher ups are stupid enough to do this through ADUG?
Ah. So all of the Cockney’s info & claims are from DS. What a joke he is. He basically has no new information on the whole issue apart from his own prejudiced views
 
As a former auditor, albeit many years ago and probably out of touch with modern practice, I'd like to clarify something. Our accounts do have to give a 'true and fair view' of our financial transactions and situation. But there's no definitive answer to, or statutory definition of, what 'true and fair' is.

But generally, for an auditor not to confirm that accounts were true and fair, there would have to be a material issue, not a few quid here or there. So even if the auditors knew about the alternative Mancini contract and felt that it should have been reported by City, in their accounts, I very much doubt they would qualify the accounts. I doubt they'd even know about it though, because it was a personal contract between Mancini and an unconnected third-party.

For a company like City, or an even bigger one, the auditors won't check every single transaction. They might satisfy themselves as to the adequacy of the financial systems for accurately recording income and expenditure and would examine relevant financial controls. A key one is whether an individual could both initiate, authorise and receive a large payment, without a second or multiple persons checking.

They most likely would (certainly in my day) have checked the larger items and that would include Etihad's sponsorship. So if our accounts showed £50m revenue from Etihad, they'd probably check that £50m was actually received. That might a single payment, or multiple payments. As long as they could track that £50m from the bank statements to the P&L account, I doubt they'd enquire much further.

But if they could only see £10m of that claimed £50m, they'd ask questions. The answer from the CFO might be that we're waiting for the other £40m,which was due shortly. I suspect they'd want to see that £40m come in before they expressed an opinion, or at the very least, have assurances from Etihad that this payment was due, relates to the period under review and a good idea of when it was due to be paid. They'd then have to make a decision as to whether the accounts were 'true and fair' (because £40m would be material) and even if they did sign the accounts off, they'd probably demand evidence of it arriving and maybe make some comment, or insist City made a relevant comment in those accounts.

Another scenario might be Etihad paying us £10m and the other £40m being from ADUG. They would presumably then question whether that was equity funding, and should therefore go into the balance sheet, rather than the P&L account. That would be subject to discussions with City senior management but I'd say the likelihood is that they would insist on it being reclassified, as it's material.

I think someone said earlier in this thread that it wasn't necessarily what was done, but what the intent was that would determine fraud. The valuation of stock affects profit. This has to be valued at the lower of cost or net realisable value, but cost may have a number of different components. It may be a very subjective judgement on what NRV is but it could be that a company is valuing stock, which it knows is completely worthless, at cost. That's likely to be fraudulent. There have been many cases where revenue from contracts signed or meant to be signed with customers has been knowingly overstated.

A high-profile case involves the software company Autonomy, who used to sponsor Spurs. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47691083. I think Mike Lynch is still fighting extradition but the UK courts have broadly supported HP's view that he and his CFO were guilty of fraud.

So just because a set of accounts aren't correct to the nearest pound, doesn't mean they aren't showing a true and fair view. And even if they're held not to be a true and fair view, there could be other reasons beyond a deliberate fraud why they might not be.

This is all correct, and I would add that, as long as all the sponsorship payments came from Etihad, the auditors wouldn't look at how Etihad sourced its funds to pay the sponsorship, and, in fact, have no requirement to do so as it wouldn't affect the accounting treatment of the sponsorship needed to give a true and fair view in the signed, audited annual accounts.
 
The only thing I could find from a quick search was from Der Spiegel https://www.spiegel.de/internationa...osed-chapter-4-a-global-empire-a-1236622.html

Strangely (or not) they don't bother to reproduce any of the hacked documents or emails but just ask us to trust them, it's not like they've ever made anything up is it?

Most of it seems to be just bitter little digs based on the PL being more successful than the German league anyway. They do claim that his "second salary" was paid through ADUG to Al Jazira to Sparkleglow Holdings (presumably Mancini's company). Is there anyone who thinks our higher ups are stupid enough to do this through ADUG?
Last time I posted on this was in this link when the routing of funds according to the big Mancini file drop was:

MCFC>ADUG>AL Jazira for payment to Mancini's Sparklegrow company.

Link here. Scroll down a couple of posts:


EDIT: I've re-read the file drop from a year ago.

The first contract between Al Jazira and Sparklegrow was terminated in July 2011 and a new one was entered into between Al Jazira and Italy International Services.

The first payments to Sparklegrow were made in March and April 2011:
£1,805,137 for the period 19/12/09 to 31/12/10
£ 437,500 for the period 1/1/11 to to 31/3/11
According to the documentation payment was sent direct from account name "MCFC Stadium Oper" to "Roberto Mancini Sparkleglow" at an Italian Bank.

There were further payments to tie up the agreement up to 30/06/11 and these included extra amounts to cover Manini's tax liability in Italy.

Payments after July 11 to IIS were routed MCFC/ADUG/Al Jazira according to the emails..
 
Last edited:

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