President Joe Biden

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

Tbf, one of the problems with the unvaccinated, globally, is the availability of ready hosts for mutation.

Delta is just one that caught hold and was especially virulent, but there could be others. The “get vaxxed” crowd had actually shifted from “Save the NHS” to “Stop the Spread” by getting to herd immunity levels, where there are not enough people to continue the exponential spread.

Knowing that vaxxed people CAN get the virus, but it can be better controlled in most people, thus saving hospital beds and resources is, of course, an excellent outcome of being vaccinated against this novel virus. However, with literally BILLIONS of people in the world still unvaccinated, we are ALL EXPOSED TO MUTATIONS, and our vaccines may become less and less robust in dealing with the variants.

“Get vaxxed” is an excellent mantra for idiotic Americans who have easy, free access, but in most places it’s getting the vaccine itself that is proving difficult.

Without a global answer, global travel is going to continue to be difficult. With the global economy being adversely affected by that lack of movement of people, and goods and services, we are all vulnerable to far more than “just” the virus!

There is something seriously wrong with a society where people feel that they need to lie to family and friends about their vaccination status against a deadly virus.

 

[hilts]

Little bastard!

That made me giggle:-)

 

[ChicagoBlue]

There is something seriously wrong with a society where people feel that they need to lie to family and friends about their vaccination status against a deadly virus.

Now, now, don’t denigrate a whole society for the actions of the small, intellectually challenged, sub-human group of trolls within the society.

As with most issues, it says much about the individuals exercising their options.

 

[BlueMoonAcrossThePond]

Now, now, don’t denigrate a whole society for the actions of the small, intellectually challenged, sub-human group of trolls within the society.

As with most issues, it says much about the individuals exercising their options.

Whereas a substantial minority of the US population either feel the need to lie - or worse still - brazenly announce, as a badge of pride, that they are not vaccinated.

+1 Trevor Morley.

 

[ChicagoBlue]

Whereas a substantial minority of the US population either feel the need to lie - or worse still - brazenly announce, as a badge of pride, that they are not vaccinated.

+1 Trevor Morley.

The extrapolation of news in a time of extreme social media, especially when taken from a small sample, is amusing.

There are 330,000,000 people in America. Your sample size? The looney toons who protest and are outspoken! What’s that, a few hundred? A thousand? Thousands?

Tell you what, let’s call it 3.3MILLION for you…

A 1% “problem”!

Cunts to a person, but a very, very small fraction of people who jump up and down shouting about it!

 

[BlueMoonAcrossThePond]

The extrapolation of news in a time of extreme social media, especially when taken from a small sample, is amusing.

There are 330,000,000 people in America. Your sample size? The looney toons who protest and are outspoken! What’s that, a few hundred? A thousand? Thousands?

Tell you what, let’s call it 3.3MILLION for you…

A 1% “problem”!

Cunts to a person, but a very, very small fraction of people who jump up and down shouting about it!

Is this a 1% problem - inflated due to media coverage? Or a larger issue? In my post I stated that it was a "substantial minority" - not knowing with certainty how widespread this believe is.

Obviously, this sort of opinion is wildly popular among Fox News and other right-leaning media viewership - a huge chuck of Americans.

Do you have any evidence to back your claim that it's a "1% problem"? Polling data for example?

I've no data - but I'd put those who both refuse to be vaccinated and who openly brag/talk about their refusal - as 20% plus of the total American population now eligible to receive vaccination. This is a guess - but I'd be wildly surprised if the actual number of such Americans fitting this description is 1% or less.

My opinion, based simply on common sense reasoning, is that the "1% problem" guesstimate you've posited - is off by an order of magnitude - it's almost certainly 10% plus.
===
Further, this is not "amusing." It's alarming... dangerous... and unfortunately... a global phenomenon.

The same sort of idiotic failure to believe facts in evidence is rampant - perhaps the most dangerous of such reality denial is climate change.
===
I lack data about the prevalence of outspoken vaccination deniers - but common sense suggests that it's a substantial minority of the US population. Why? Because this sentiment is wildly popular among US conservatives - and this popularity is a feedback mechanism - cementing vaccination denial and encouraging vocal opposition.

Further - if this were a 1% problem - how then do you account for the fact that 40% or so of those eligible for vaccination in the US are in fact unvaccinated? In spite of the fact that vaccination is free and readily available?
===
Edit - given that roughly 40% of the US population eligible to receive vaccination are unvaccinated, my claim above that 20% of Americans are vocal anti-vaccers seems off. Laziness, worried about vaccination safety and other irrational behaviors obviously account for some of that 40% - probably most.

At any rate, given how strong the far right narrative is, especially in rural/southern USA - and given that this is where the majority of that 40% reside - I'll revise my 20% estimate down to say 10%.

 

[FogBlueInSanFran]

Is this a 1% problem - inflated due to media coverage? Or a larger issue? In my post I stated that it was a "substantial minority" - not knowing with certainty how widespread this believe is.

Obviously, this sort of opinion is wildly popular among Fox News and other right-leaning media viewership - a huge chuck of Americans.

Do you have any evidence to back your claim that it's a "1% problem"? Polling data for example?

I've no data - but I'd put those who both refuse to be vaccinated and who openly brag/talk about their refusal - as 20% plus of the total American population now eligible to receive vaccination. This is a guess - but I'd be wildly surprised if the actual number of such Americans fitting this description is 1% or less.
===
This is not "amusing." It's alarming... dangerous... and unfortunately... a global phenomenon.

The same sort of idiotic failure to believe facts in evidence is rampant - perhaps the most dangerous of such reality denial is climate change.
===
TL/DR - I lack data about the prevalence of outspoken vaccination deniers - but common sense suggests that it's a substantial minority of the US population. Why? Because this sentiment is wildly popular among US conservatives - and this popularity is a feedback mechanism - cementing vaccination denial and encouraging vocal opposition.

Further - if this were a 1% problem - as you imply - how then do you account for the fact that 40% or so of those eligible for vaccination in the US - are in fact unvaccinated? In spite of the fact that the vaccine is free and readily available - we're not talking about a few percentage of those who are unable to take a day off work - if that's even necessary - to receive vaccination... we're talking 40% or so of the US population eligible to receive vaccination.

I have no idea of the prevalence of whacked belief structures though inherently I do believe it is over 1%, but re: the vaccine -- I wouldn't be surprised if half the 40% who are unvaxxed aren't out of laziness, a sense of invulnerability, lack of time, fear of needles, or some other non-political reason. I have no data to back up my claim. I will say though that when I had to go to the doc a month or so ago for something and was waiting, the number of young, seemingly healthy people who walked in for a vax appointment was really surprising to me. 5 folks in 15 mins of waiting. I got mine literally the first day I was eligible (I'm 56) -- same with my wife and kids. These folks had waited for several weeks after they were first eligible before doing so.

 

[BlueMoonAcrossThePond]

I have no idea of the prevalence of whacked belief structures though inherently I do believe it is over 1%, but re: the vaccine -- I wouldn't be surprised if half the 40% who are unvaxxed aren't out of laziness, a sense of invulnerability, lack of time, fear of needles, or some other non-political reason. I have no data to back up my claim. I will say though that when I had to go to the doc a month or so ago for something and was waiting, the number of young, seemingly healthy people who walked in for a vax appointment was really surprising to me. 5 folks in 15 mins of waiting. I got mine literally the first day I was eligible (I'm 56) -- same with my wife and kids. These folks had waited for several weeks after they were first eligible before doing so.

Yes - perhaps it's laziness - or other factors.

And I suppose that my guesstimate that it's basically 1/2 of those not vaccinated who are vocal anti-vaccers is off.

But it's not 1%. It's 10% plus I think.
===
I live in Washington State, near Seattle. No one I know of here is a vocal anti-vaccer.

But in rural USA? And in the South? Where peer pressure alone drives sentiment, belief, and vocal opposition? In short, where the unvaccinated are most prevalent?

It's a cinch that the vocal anti-vaccers are most abundant in rural USA, in the South and so on - where you and I do not live. Watching the behavior of young folks in San Francisco - I would suggest - is unlikely to be at all representative of the sentiment/behavior and tendency to be strongly anti-vaccination in rural/southern USA.
===
Impressions/opinions/and so-called "common sense" though are no substitute for data.

One would think that there's some sort of data relevant to this issue somewhere. I freely admit that I could be 100%, dead wrong.

 

[FogBlueInSanFran]

Yes - perhaps it's laziness - or other factors.

And I suppose that my guesstimate that it's basically 1/2 of those not vaccinated who are vocal anti-vaccers is off.

But it's not 1%. It's 10% plus I think.
===
I live in Washington State, near Seattle. No one I know of here is a vocal anti-vaccer.

But in rural USA? And in the South? Where peer pressure alone drives sentiment, belief, and vocal opposition? In short, where the unvaccinated are most prevalent?

It's a cinch that the vocal anti-vaccers are most abundant in rural USA, in the South and so on - where you and I do not live. Watching the behavior of young folks in San Francisco - I would suggest - is unlikely to be at all representative of the sentiment/behavior and tendency to be strongly anti-vaccination in rural/southern USA.
===
Impressions/opinions/and so-called "common sense" though are no substitute for data.

One would think that there's some sort of data relevant to this issue somewhere. I freely admit that I could be 100%, dead wrong.

I'm lucky in that in both SF and the county I live in (Marin), vax rates are unbelievably high. 90% of kids aged 12-17 in the city of SF are vaxxed -- not a single COVID outbreak at any school in the city thus far this school year. Marin is 90% fully vaxxed county-wide with an incredible 97% of all eligible residents with at least one dose. I know only one conscientious objector to the vax of all my friends (which include some mighty right-leaners) -- and she and her husband moved to Nashville a few days after her youngest graduated high school!

 

[ChicagoBlue]

And I suppose that my guesstimate that it's basically 1/2 of those not vaccinated who are vocal anti-vaccers is off.

But it's not 1%. It's 10% plus I think.

I have no idea what the actual number is, but I do think small % in the US means an extraordinarily high number of actual people.
You think over 33-35M people are anti-vaxxers, I think it is less. Either way, it’s a “modern” problem borne of too much poor information sloshing around in their ether, and that can’t be good!

I'm lucky in that in both SF and the county I live in (Marin), vax rates are unbelievably high. 90% of kids aged 12-17 in the city of SF are vaxxed -- not a single COVID outbreak at any school in the city thus far this school year. Marin is 90% fully vaxxed county-wide with an incredible 97% of all eligible residents with at least one dose. I know only one conscientious objector to the vax of all my friends (which include some mighty right-leaners) -- and she and her husband moved to Nashville a few days after her youngest graduated high school!

Those numbers are crazy good. Educated, urban areas are BY FAR the highest vaccination rates, and Marin, while I couldn’t classify it as “urban,” is as close as possible to an educated urban area one can find.

I also think that people who value money and business understand the imperative to get the economy back on track, knowing there is serious money to be made from pent up demand and current levels of scarcity. In poorer, less educated, more rural areas, this is most probably not a major issue, due the more subsistence nature of life there.