President Trump

[KS55]

I agree with Trump get rid of the illegals who are criminals, people with very violent criminal records, known members of gangs etc, however he has gone much further than this with this one glove fits all, also breaking the law in doing so as well, no paperwork etc. I don’t think anyone would complain if there were a bunch of violent Albanians rounded up here and turfed out.

In the US Immigrants are far less likely to indulge in criminal activities than native born Americans. Trump speaks from ignorance or in a demagogic appeal to US audiences. “They are emptying their gaols and asylums into the US” is just a lie. What a surprise.

 

[KS55]

Should we ask Australia to stop poaching our bright young people such as doctors? The problem for the UK is that for every Nigerian doctor that comes here there are 10 deliveroo riders and 10 car washers.

We could ask the Aussies, you know what the answer would be. It is different, though, because we have the ability to pay doctors as well as Australia does, but Nigeria cannot. One relationship is of economic equals, the other is not.
We already have plenty of brits who could do menial jobs, but they don’t.

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

I'm terribly confused.

I keep being told how socio-economically valuable these migrants are to the countries they flock to, including here in the UK.

And yet the leaders of the migrant's home countries throw foot stamping tantrums on having those highly valued migrants repatriated back to their home countries.

It's almost as though those migrants are actually the dregs of society and their home countries were glad to see the back of them, but that surely can't be right. Can it?...

In 2022 it was estimated that undocumented migrants contributed 11 billion Dollars to the US economy.

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

Easy to say behind a keyboard, but when you are a PM and have a economy to think about it's a different matter -


Dame Harriett Baldwin, the shadow business minister, has urged the government to "lean into" the friendly relationship it has with US President Donald Trump.
Asked about Mr Trump's call with Sir Keir Starmer, she told Sky News Breakfast: "I'm glad they had a friendly and constructive call.
"I think it's really important that they have a good relationship, a good call.
"I would like to hear that positivity taken on board in terms of working out how we can do even more business together, even more trade together, because I am very concerned about the UK's growth at the moment.
"I think that the ramifications from the budget that the chancellor made back in October are feeding through into a very worrying picture of the UK economy.
"Its of importance that the government takes steps not only to lean into this positive relationship with the US, but also learn the lessons of what's gone wrong with the budget."
it is important to create a "better environment" for investors in the UK, alleging that the budget was "very damaging for growth".

Just seems to have a bit of a whiff of Neville Chamberlain about it.

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

Nope, getting the illegals out of States, well done Donald.

That just shows you have no idea about undocumented migrants in the USA.

Illegal they may be, but always harder working and often way more educated than the US citizens who employ them.

 

[Mr Kobayashi]

In the US Immigrants are far less likely to indulge in criminal activities than native born Americans. Trump speaks from ignorance or in a demagogic appeal to US audiences. “They are emptying their gaols and asylums into the US” is just a lie. What a surprise.

It sounds like he's just watched the opening of Scarface (1983) and applied it to all countries in the real world. Complete nutter.

 

[jacko74]

In 2022 it was estimated that undocumented migrants contributed 11 billion Dollars to the US economy.

Just like our very own Office for National Propaganda Statistics keeps on claiming how migrants are net contributors to the UK tax take.

I'm sure there's some phrase about Lies, Damned Lies and Statistics.

Just sticking with the UK, what is is it do you think has enabled labour to be devalued to such an extent that theres been effectively no wage growth for the the last 25 years, particularly in the unskilled employment sector?

Such prolonged wage stagnation has never seen been before prior to the last 25 years.

What else has happened in the last 25 years that has occurred on a scale absolutely unprecedented in this countries history?

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

Toe.

Perhaps he thinks they can tow Greenland to America?

 

[Gremlin]

the UK has done more than it's fair share helping people.

Actually, we are 5th in Europe in terms of total number of asylum seekers accepted and 19th per head of the population.

How many people claim asylum in the UK?

www.gov.uk

 

[threespires]

What else has happened in the last 25 years that has occurred on a scale absolutely unprecedented in this countries history?

The complete capitulation to large corporations and the wholesale abandonment of the concept that staggeringly rich people should pay their way and not try and squeze every last penny out of the rest of society?

 

[jacko74]

Not silly at all .The point was to elicit your response to the question of whether you objected to highly skilled immigrants especially when their presence was beneficial to you personally. I could have asked it that way, but it would have been extremely boring: a real example is always the best way to gather views. Here endeth the lesson!
Now then, the NHS has on numerous occasions promised Nigeria and others not to continue to import their doctors and nurses but they still do of course. We get the benefit, the exporting country pays for their training. So they object strongly.
The second part of your answer suggests that your objection is really economic. Should we force the feckless Brits to go to work by withholding benefits? I think we should and it is worth thinking about the effect that would have on immigration. I don’t know, would the low skilled stop coming here if such jobs were filled by Brits or would they continue to come and work in the black economy? The law of unexpected consequences looms.

I have had no personal need whatsoever for an architect, an engineer or a surgeon for well over 20 years so they're of no obvious or direct benefit to me personally but I've still ostensibly got no objection to those type of skilled migrants coming here.

Although again there is the wider question of why are we poaching these types of people from countries that are in far more need of them and why aren't we training people already resident in the UK to fill these roles.

At least we agree that there are a huge proportion of the working age population that are choosing to live a life that is at least partially funded by what is now a ruinously profligate and not fit for purpose benefits system.

 

[jacko74]

The complete capitulation to large corporations and the wholesale abandonment of the concept that staggeringly rich people should pay their way and not try and squeze every last penny out of the rest of society?

Yes very true, but what you've identified there is the end result, what has caused that end result to come about?

What has been one of the prime determining factors in allowing those corporations and wealthy rentier classes to gain so much power and control over the population?

What has been one of the key determining factors that has allowed the corporations to devalue labour so greatly and caused the cost of accommodation to rise so much?

 

[KS55]

I have had no personal need whatsoever for an architect, an engineer or a surgeon for well over 20 years so they're of no obvious or direct benefit to me personally but I've still ostensibly got no objection to those type of skilled migrants coming here.

Although again there is the wider question of why are we poaching these types of people from countries that are in far more need of them and why aren't we training people already resident in the UK to fill these roles.

At least we agree that there are a huge proportion of the working age population that are choosing to live a life that is at least partially funded by what is now a ruinously profligate and not fit for purpose benefits system.

Ah, but for entertainment purposes you did need the services of a great striker!

 

[DelToro]

Yes very true, but what you've identified there is the end result, what has caused that end result to come about?

What has been one of the prime determining factors in allowing those corporations and wealthy rentier classes to gain so much power and control over the population?

What has been one of the key determining factors that has allowed the corporations to devalue labour so greatly and caused the cost of accommodation to rise so much?

Market deregulation and the dismantling of the collective labour movement?

 

[Dax777]

Some of the posts on the last 10 to 12 pages have been fantastically informative. :)

More of such please!!!

Not silly at all .The point was to elicit your response to the question of whether you objected to highly skilled immigrants especially when their presence was beneficial to you personally. I could have asked it that way, but it would have been extremely boring: a real example is always the best way to gather views. Here endeth the lesson!
Now then, the NHS has on numerous occasions promised Nigeria and others not to continue to import their doctors and nurses but they still do of course. We get the benefit, the exporting country pays for their training. So they object strongly.
The second part of your answer suggests that your objection is really economic. Should we force the feckless Brits to go to work by withholding benefits? I think we should and it is worth thinking about the effect that would have on immigration. I don’t know, would the low skilled stop coming here if such jobs were filled by Brits or would they continue to come and work in the black economy? The law of unexpected consequences looms.

Send some of your lazy cunts to Nigeria. We'll shape them up quickly and send them back to you :)

 

[jacko74]

Market deregulation and the dismantling of the collective labour movement?

And has that deregulated labour market been allowed to find its own level in terms of the value of labour?

Or has something occurred on an utterly unprecedented scale in the last 25 years that has had a huge impact on the value of labour in an unregulated market? The same something that has also enabled the dismantling of the collective labour movement and the effective neutering of Trade Unions?

 

[DelToro]

And has that deregulated labour market been allowed to find its own level in terms of the value of labour?

Or has something occurred on an utterly unprecedented scale in the last 25 years that has had a huge impact on the value of labour in an unregulated market? The same something that has also enabled the dismantling of the collective labour movement and the effective neutering of Trade Unions?

The Tories introduced the first of 4 major pieces of employment legislation in 1980, way before freedom of movement.

Those 4 acts, all completed in the 80s, significantly altered the balance of power.

 

[jacko74]

The Tories introduced the first of 4 major pieces of employment legislation in 1980, way before freedom of movement.

Those 4 acts, all completed in the 80s, significantly altered the balance of power.

Well in terms of the impact of those changes to legislation it took over 20 years and the introduction of mass immigration for those changes to have any noticeable effect.

 

[roman totale]

The US, at least, is running backwards, headlong into the days of The East India Company and other, Empire-ruling, public/ state enterprises from three hundred years ago. This is all entirely deliberate, of course. I’m awaiting the day Amazon, X etc have their own security forces that morph into armies. That said, I’d point out that companies like Blackwater already exist and others, like Halliburton, are already well down the path.

 

[DelToro]

Well in terms of the impact of those changes to legislation it took over 20 years and the introduction of mass immigration for those changes to have any noticeable effect.

Employment legislation, market deregulation, globalization, freedom of movement, 2008 economic meltdown, migration due to global conflict (often facilitated by the west) etc have all played a part in where we are at today. It’s not as simple as pointing at a group of people and saying “they’re to blame.”