R.I.P Academy

[Zin 'messiah' Zimmer]

We've paraded 3/4 academy signings at half time this season... hardly the end looking at that. Perhaps Obeng stopped developing.

Lets see if he's picked up by utd this summer.

Ive seen plenty of Academy players paraded at some point over the past few years but never seen em make the 1st team starting line-up. All i am saying is that it will now get even harder to make the 1st team when we are buying in what we need and where we need them. Thats an almost certainty.

You concluded my point in one paragraph......... people will thank you. :)

 

[pee dubya]

The purpose of the Academy is to provide players for the first team, it's not specifically to provide local lads for the first team.

The added bonus of the Academy is of course that it will give local lads the chance to both make it at City, or make themselves a career in professional football.

The better and bigger the club gets, obviously fewer players will be good enough to break into our first team, but i'd bet that we also produce even more academy graduates who go onto make a successfull career for themselves, because they will be brought up in the same environment as some of the best players and coaches in the World. If the local kids are playing alongside some of the best young talent from around the World, it can hardly be detrimental for them.

The rags haven't had that many players break into their first team recently, but there's a very large number of players who couldn't make the grade there, that have gone on to play at decent Championship clubs or lower Premierleague teams.

 

[Zin 'messiah' Zimmer]

The purpose of the Academy is to provide players for the first team, it's not specifically to provide local lads for the first team.

The added bonus of the Academy is of course that it will give local lads the chance to both make it at City, or make themselves a career in professional football.

The better and bigger the club gets, obviously fewer players will be good enough to break into our first team, but i'd bet that we also produce even more academy graduates who go onto make a successfull career for themselves, because they will be brought up in the same environment as some of the best players and coaches in the World. If the local kids are playing alongside some of the best young talent from around the World, it can hardly be detrimental for them.

The rags haven't had that many players break into their first team recently, but there's a very large number of players who couldn't make the grade there, that have gone on to play at decent Championship clubs or lower Premierleague teams.

see reference to grass roots.......... your indeed right on a few points, but deluded if you think kids are not going to jump ship as the path to the 1st team is closed...... the academy will be made up of the worlds elite kids within 2 years, already 3 quarters there regarding nationals, i'll have a bet with you that it won't represent 10% of british kids in 2 years.

 

[r.soleofsalford]

Having said that, while a couple have made it biggish in the PL, i actually feel we over tout our Academy abit, a lot of the players who have made it to the 1st team have then dissapeared to the lower divisions all to quickly.

I agree, however being able to play the long game with a kid, think stevie Ireland, will no longer apply.
Example already being seen with such kids as Curtis Obeng, fantastic prospect, touted 12 months ago by baconface..fact, a little dip in form which all kids experience sees him released, even if it hasn't been in the public domain, he's looking for a club as we speak, a kid capped at all levels internationally and we have no place for him...... Sven was ready to offer him a 3 year deal before thickskin shinawatra put a block on all contracts, then sven is sacked, new manager takes a look and concludes differently, i'm not second guessing him but I can tell you for a fact that 90% of the academy are scared to death of Hughes philosophy on management and the exodus will begin sooner rather than later, closely followed by Cassell, no way he'l sit around and watch everything he has built get a fresh lick of paint.

i note with interest what you say, but city have been spreading there recruitment of young talent far and wide. over the past two months, we have signed up the french and spanish under 17`s captains, a german under 17`s goalie reported to be the best in europe for his age,
and nils zander another german who i think is 16 years and was on the verge of playing for the first team at shalke.

i think the old adage is going to be the same. if your good enough, your old enough. and if your good enough, you`ll be given a chance. i hope V.W. gets a good run this year, see what he can do, he looked good against bolton when he came on

 

[somervillain]

Being the best youth academy in the Northwest is an admirable thing, but if City have goals beyond being a mid-table Premier League club, they need to move in the direction they have been since the takeover and go get the best talent, regardless of where that talent is from. The City academy should end up being like the Barça academy, which is to say, turning out superstars on a consistent basis.

 

[Zin 'messiah' Zimmer]

Having said that, while a couple have made it biggish in the PL, i actually feel we over tout our Academy abit, a lot of the players who have made it to the 1st team have then dissapeared to the lower divisions all to quickly.

I agree, however being able to play the long game with a kid, think stevie Ireland, will no longer apply.
Example already being seen with such kids as Curtis Obeng, fantastic prospect, touted 12 months ago by baconface..fact, a little dip in form which all kids experience sees him released, even if it hasn't been in the public domain, he's looking for a club as we speak, a kid capped at all levels internationally and we have no place for him...... Sven was ready to offer him a 3 year deal before thickskin shinawatra put a block on all contracts, then sven is sacked, new manager takes a look and concludes differently, i'm not second guessing him but I can tell you for a fact that 90% of the academy are scared to death of Hughes philosophy on management and the exodus will begin sooner rather than later, closely followed by Cassell, no way he'l sit around and watch everything he has built get a fresh lick of paint.

i note with interest what you say, but city have been spreading there recruitment of young talent far and wide. over the past two months, we have signed up the french and spanish under 17`s captains, a german under 17`s goalie reported to be the best in europe for his age,
and nils zander another german who i think is 16 years and was on the verge of playing for the first team at shalke.

i think the old adage is going to be the same. if your good enough, your old enough. and if your good enough, you`ll be given a chance. i hope V.W. gets a good run this year, see what he can do, he looked good against bolton when he came on

Thats my point pal, spreading those networks is inevitable, as I alluded to, but it will have a undoubted effect on grass roots, that can't be hidden.

 

[pee dubya]

The purpose of the Academy is to provide players for the first team, it's not specifically to provide local lads for the first team.

The added bonus of the Academy is of course that it will give local lads the chance to both make it at City, or make themselves a career in professional football.

The better and bigger the club gets, obviously fewer players will be good enough to break into our first team, but i'd bet that we also produce even more academy graduates who go onto make a successfull career for themselves, because they will be brought up in the same environment as some of the best players and coaches in the World. If the local kids are playing alongside some of the best young talent from around the World, it can hardly be detrimental for them.

The rags haven't had that many players break into their first team recently, but there's a very large number of players who couldn't make the grade there, that have gone on to play at decent Championship clubs or lower Premierleague teams.

see reference to grass roots.......... your indeed right on a few points, but deluded if you think kids are not going to jump ship as the path to the 1st team is closed...... the academy will be made up of the worlds elite kids within 2 years, already 3 quarters there regarding nationals, i'll have a bet with you that it won't represent 10% of british kids in 2 years.

Of course some will, but then if the Academy keeps producing successfull players, then it will maintain it's reputation as one of the best around, and so shouldn't have a problem keeping hold of promising young players.

I doubt you get many youngsters turning down the chance to join Barca's academy just because the chance of breaking into the first team is very slim. They know that they will recieve the best coaching and be brought up to play particular brand of football and be looked after.

I don't see a problem with a 50:50 mix or 40:60, reducing it to 10% would be excessive though.

 

[Chippy]

it's not accurate to say that Hughes hasn't given youngsters a chance. Logan made it into the squad early in the season, Evans and Sturridge got games, Ned established himself as a regular and Weiss got on against Bolton.
Inevitably though, raising the standard of the first team squad will make it harder for the kids to get in. The days of challenging for the title with home-grown players are pretty much gone now, and once Gerrard, Carragher, Neville etc. have retired that'll probably be it.

 

[Rammyblues]

My view of the academy was to give youngsters the opportunity of having a career in the professional game, whether at City or elsewhere. If my understanding correct the academy is not their soley for City. However if there are good players of course our club cherry picks the best. The academy will continue in my view, the bar is raised if the academy players want to get in the first team squad they will have to improve, those that don't make it will be found clubs and a career elsewhere, but in my view that is a sucessful academy.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

I have a good source who has regular contact with, among others, the City & Arsenal academies. His view is that the City one was fine for what we needed a few seasons ago as a mid-table, financially strapped club, when we could take the best into the first team and sell the others. Basically it brought through technically skilled players but who weren't really physically or mentally equipped for life in the very physical Premiership. Players like Jordan, Flood, Croft, Sturridge and even Stevie Ireland, before he took matters into his own hands last summer.

However, it isn't right for where we need to be. Arsenal don't focus on technical skills once the players get to 16; they focus on taking them to the next level in terms of power, strength, vision, tactical awareness, decision making, etc. This is why they can put out a team of youngsters in the Carling Cup that can outplay our first team, as they did a few seasons ago.

United also had the same problem as us up to a few seasons ago, as their youngsters weren't good enough for the senior squad for many years, following the incredible youth team of Beckham, Giggs, Scholes. etc. They got a guy in to change it, then McCair took over and now Solskjaer and they've got kids like Evans, Macheda, Welbeck coming through.

The higher profile we are the better class of youngster we will be able to attract but it's no good doing that if we can't get them through into the first team successfully. So the academy certainly isn't dead but it will need to work differently from now on and we may have ot accept that Jim Cassell might not the man for that particular job.