Rags caught lying about attendances (merged)

Re: Rags caught lying

Pigeonho said:
Skashion said:
Pigeonho said:
I've not commented on the article, I was pointing out how quick you are to jump on people who appear to defend United in what they say, even though that won't actually be their intention.
If that were true I'd be your worst enemy but I'm not. Actually, it seems to be you who's got a bee in your bonnet about me, even though I know at least three mods who suspect you're a rag. I don't actually think you are but I'm sure you'll write me another nice PM about it...
I'd say it's the other way round, but hey ho.
I know one of the mods does, he PM'd me to tell me, which I thought was nice of him.
Anyway back on track, I was referring to your 'disgustingly quick to defend the rags' comment, something i'm sure didn't even enter the heads of those posting what they posted. Just because everything that doesn't come out of certain posters mouths doesn't slag United off as much as possible, it doesn't mean they're defending them.
Why did those people sooner retort the OP, a presumed blue, than think for a minute and think it's not actually whether we both sell seats that end up empty but about whether the rags are hypocritical in singing about ours when they have thousands upon thousands of their own?

Perhaps I'm wrong, perhaps it has nothing to do with the rags at all, and everything to do with wanting so badly to present themselves as fair and neutral in all circumstances that they unwittingly do otherwise...
 
Re: Rags caught lying

Skashion said:
Pigeonho said:
Skashion said:
If that were true I'd be your worst enemy but I'm not. Actually, it seems to be you who's got a bee in your bonnet about me, even though I know at least three mods who suspect you're a rag. I don't actually think you are but I'm sure you'll write me another nice PM about it...
I'd say it's the other way round, but hey ho.
I know one of the mods does, he PM'd me to tell me, which I thought was nice of him.
Anyway back on track, I was referring to your 'disgustingly quick to defend the rags' comment, something i'm sure didn't even enter the heads of those posting what they posted. Just because everything that doesn't come out of certain posters mouths doesn't slag United off as much as possible, it doesn't mean they're defending them.
Why did those people sooner retort the OP, a presumed blue, than think for a minute and think it's not actually whether we both sell seats that end up empty but about whether the rags are hypocritical in singing about ours when they have thousands upon thousands of their own?

Perhaps I'm wrong, perhaps it has nothing to do with the rags at all, and everything to do with wanting so badly to present themselves as fair and neutral in all circumstances that they unwittingly do otherwise...
Isn't that just banter though between 2 clubs, much like how we take the piss out of how none of them come from Manchester when the truth is we know many of them do?
 
Rag season tickets are automatically allocated cup tickets but every season ticket holder can opt out of the league cup and under 16 season ticket holders can opt out of all of the cups. I think they have also had trouble selling season tickets this campaign too.

The fact that they sing about our empty seats is more than comical

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.redcafe.net/f6/now-fascinating-369013/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.redcafe.net/f6/now-fascinating-369013/</a>

They have more than noticed the drop in attendances. Oh they have excuses but those fans were packing out that ugly tub in years gone by ? Are we even sure they sold all the season tickets ? And where are those fully paid up match goers ? Thailand I suspect not arsed enough to hop on an air Asia flight to see the most massivist team in the galaxy. Where are the fans scrambling to buy the tickets from those who "can't attend" because there brothers,cousins,aunties grandmas dog died ? Aren't there 300 billion waiting on the list for tickets ? Maybe they aren't as massive as they thought, maybe nobody wants to watch their turgid shit excuse for football

42 thousand empty seats LOL time to downgrade I think ;)
 
Re: Rags caught lying

Pigeonho said:
Isn't that just banter though between 2 clubs, much like how we take the piss out of how none of them come from Manchester when the truth is we know many of them do?
Banter has to have an element of truth to it, even if it becomes highly exaggerated. Match-going City fans are more local, that's a proven fact. The fact is their seats are probably far more empty than ours. That article said up to 24,000 seats at times have been over-declared. There has never been a City match where we've over-declared by 24,000 seats. I'm quite sure of that. It's hypocrisy plain and simple.
 
Re: Rags caught lying

Skashion said:
Pigeonho said:
Isn't that just banter though between 2 clubs, much like how we take the piss out of how none of them come from Manchester when the truth is we know many of them do?
Banter has to have an element of truth to it, even if it becomes highly exaggerated. Match-going City fans are more local, that's a proven fact. The fact is their seats are probably far more empty than ours. That article said up to 24,000 seats at times have been over-declared. There has never been a City match where we've over-declared by 24,000 seats. I'm quite sure of that. It's hypocrisy plain and simple.
Imagine that, hypocrisy in football ;-)
 
But the media never report anything negative about United.
 
Paulpowersleftfoot said:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/apr/12/manchester-united-attendances-police-figures

Manchester United are adding as many as 24,000 fans on to crowd attendances compared with the actual number of people watching games at Old Trafford, according to police data.

Sir Alex Ferguson's team have not had a single crowd over 70,000 for a league match, police say, not taking in Monday's game against Manchester City. The club, in contrast, recorded attendances in excess of 75,000 every time. Instead Greater Manchester police's figures claim the average crowd for league matches, excluding City, is 10,000 below what the club say. The police records state it is 65,601 rather than the official figure of 75,527. In all competitions it is 61,739 rather than the club's 73,653.

United are still the best-supported club in England by some distance but the new set of figures claim Old Trafford was not even half-full for the Capital One Cup tie against Newcastle in September. The police recorded the number of people who passed through the turnstiles at 33,409. United gave the crowd as 46,358. In the next round, against West Ham, the disparity was even bigger. The police put down the crowd as 51,724, whereas United recorded it as 71,081.

When United played Cluj in the Champions League in December, having qualified for the knockout stages, the crowd was announced as 71,521. In fact, the police say it was 46,894.

The disparity is because United, in common with other clubs, release the number of people who bought tickets, whether or not they attend. The police keep their own record of actual match-goers for safety purposes and have released the data to the Redsaway fans' website under the Freedom of Information Act.

The figures show the high number of supporters who will buy tickets for matches without going. Arsenal are among the clubs who suffer the same problem on a large scale.

United's largest crowd of the season for a league match, according to the police, was 69,933 for Liverpool's visit in January (the club put it at 75,501). The lowest was against Southampton later that month. On that occasion the official attendance was given at 75,600 when, according to the police, the genuine figure was 59,766. In other words, almost 16,000 ticket-holders stayed away.

The Real Madrid match in the Champions League attracted the one 70,000-plus attendance at Old Trafford this season, in the data. The police recorded it at 72,299 whereas United declared it was 74,959, lower than any domestic league match because of Uefa's seating restrictions.

comment by Paulpowersleftfoot (U1037)
posted 3 minutes ago
Date Opponents Actual attendance given by GMP Official attendance given by MUFC
25-Aug-12 Fulham 66,005 75,352
15-Sep-12 Wigan Athletic 66,686 75,142
29-Sep-12 Tottenham Hotspur 68,072 75,566
20-Oct-12 Stoke City 64,722 75,585
03-Nov-12 Arsenal 69,077 75,492
24-Nov-12 Queens Park Rangers 64,452 75,603
28-Nov-12 West Ham United 62,304 75,572
15-Dec-12 Sunderland 64,294 75,582
26-Dec-12 Newcastle United 64,996 75,596
29-Dec-12 West Bromwich Albion 66,847 75,595
13-Jan-13 Liverpool 69,933 75,501
30-Jan-13 Southampton 59,766 75,600
10-Feb-13 Everton 68,123 75,525
02-Mar-13 Norwich City 66,238 75,586
16-Mar-13 Reading 62,493 75,605

UEFA Champions League
Date Opponents Actual attendance given by GMP Official attendance given by MUFC
19-Sep-12 Galatasary 61,111 74,653
23-Oct-12 S.C. Braga 56,452 73,195
05-Dec-12 CFR 1907 Cluj 46,894 71,521
05-Mar-13 Real Madrid 72,299 74,959

Domestic cups
Date Opponents Actual attendance given by GMP Official attendance given by MUFC
26-Sep-12 Newcastle United 33,409 46,358
16-Jan-13 West Ham United 51,724 71,081
26-Jan-13 Fulham 55,080 72,596
18-Feb-13 Reading 57,172 75,213
10-Mar-13 Chelsea 63,582 75,196

Would that be the same greater Manchester police who said the scum had 250,000 at their parade.. :)
 
samharris said:
Paulpowersleftfoot said:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/apr/12/manchester-united-attendances-police-figures

Manchester United are adding as many as 24,000 fans on to crowd attendances compared with the actual number of people watching games at Old Trafford, according to police data.

Sir Alex Ferguson's team have not had a single crowd over 70,000 for a league match, police say, not taking in Monday's game against Manchester City. The club, in contrast, recorded attendances in excess of 75,000 every time. Instead Greater Manchester police's figures claim the average crowd for league matches, excluding City, is 10,000 below what the club say. The police records state it is 65,601 rather than the official figure of 75,527. In all competitions it is 61,739 rather than the club's 73,653.

United are still the best-supported club in England by some distance but the new set of figures claim Old Trafford was not even half-full for the Capital One Cup tie against Newcastle in September. The police recorded the number of people who passed through the turnstiles at 33,409. United gave the crowd as 46,358. In the next round, against West Ham, the disparity was even bigger. The police put down the crowd as 51,724, whereas United recorded it as 71,081.

When United played Cluj in the Champions League in December, having qualified for the knockout stages, the crowd was announced as 71,521. In fact, the police say it was 46,894.

The disparity is because United, in common with other clubs, release the number of people who bought tickets, whether or not they attend. The police keep their own record of actual match-goers for safety purposes and have released the data to the Redsaway fans' website under the Freedom of Information Act.

The figures show the high number of supporters who will buy tickets for matches without going. Arsenal are among the clubs who suffer the same problem on a large scale.

United's largest crowd of the season for a league match, according to the police, was 69,933 for Liverpool's visit in January (the club put it at 75,501). The lowest was against Southampton later that month. On that occasion the official attendance was given at 75,600 when, according to the police, the genuine figure was 59,766. In other words, almost 16,000 ticket-holders stayed away.

The Real Madrid match in the Champions League attracted the one 70,000-plus attendance at Old Trafford this season, in the data. The police recorded it at 72,299 whereas United declared it was 74,959, lower than any domestic league match because of Uefa's seating restrictions.

comment by Paulpowersleftfoot (U1037)
posted 3 minutes ago
Date Opponents Actual attendance given by GMP Official attendance given by MUFC
25-Aug-12 Fulham 66,005 75,352
15-Sep-12 Wigan Athletic 66,686 75,142
29-Sep-12 Tottenham Hotspur 68,072 75,566
20-Oct-12 Stoke City 64,722 75,585
03-Nov-12 Arsenal 69,077 75,492
24-Nov-12 Queens Park Rangers 64,452 75,603
28-Nov-12 West Ham United 62,304 75,572
15-Dec-12 Sunderland 64,294 75,582
26-Dec-12 Newcastle United 64,996 75,596
29-Dec-12 West Bromwich Albion 66,847 75,595
13-Jan-13 Liverpool 69,933 75,501
30-Jan-13 Southampton 59,766 75,600
10-Feb-13 Everton 68,123 75,525
02-Mar-13 Norwich City 66,238 75,586
16-Mar-13 Reading 62,493 75,605

UEFA Champions League
Date Opponents Actual attendance given by GMP Official attendance given by MUFC
19-Sep-12 Galatasary 61,111 74,653
23-Oct-12 S.C. Braga 56,452 73,195
05-Dec-12 CFR 1907 Cluj 46,894 71,521
05-Mar-13 Real Madrid 72,299 74,959

Domestic cups
Date Opponents Actual attendance given by GMP Official attendance given by MUFC
26-Sep-12 Newcastle United 33,409 46,358
16-Jan-13 West Ham United 51,724 71,081
26-Jan-13 Fulham 55,080 72,596
18-Feb-13 Reading 57,172 75,213
10-Mar-13 Chelsea 63,582 75,196

Would that be the same greater Manchester police who said the scum had 250,000 at their parade.. :)


Must've counted the tumbleweed down Deansgate as rags
 

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