Retirement...when, how old and how much??

[halfmist]

Woopy doo, fucking hell...

It’s just a figure in a bank account.
It’s not as though I carry it around in my back pocket and count it every hour.

 

[ganganvince]

Surely this can't be correct.
Between tax, national insurance and pension that's all we will come out with now.

You would pay tax on that

 

[denislawsbackheel]

The time value of money is the multiplier than created eye watering numbers!

As I mentioned, the company I work for went bankrupt in Dec 2002. I had about $170K in stock that became $2K, and my retirement annuity went from 50% of Final Average Earnings (Highest 12 of 36 mos) to a fixed snapshot of what it would be in 2004…24 yrs prior to my actual retirement date!

That meant I had to try and make up for that 50% annuity with an ISA type account on the market on 50% of my pre-bankruptcy pay. I was just starting to make a small dent in the nut after 6 years of struggle (while also funding 4 yrs of college for my 2 kids) when the 2008-09 financial crisis decimated it AGAIN! That now left 20 yrs to retirement and back to about where I was before the bankruptcy in ‘02!

Since then, things have been better, of course, but what’s amazing (and a little sickening) is that the younger guys I work with who got hired around that time have only seen up, up, and away! I did some volunteer union retirement & insurance work and regularly hear guys telling me they’re looking at a retirement nut of $10M and up!

Rule of 72 estimates you double your money every 7.5 years. That means $1 saved today is worth $2 in 7.5 yrs, $4 in 15 yrs, $8 in 22.5 yrs, $16 in 30 yrs and $32 in 37.5 yrs…which is about when most guys retire! Those doubling periods, especially that last one, can make you fabulously well off, if you don’t fuck it up!

My son, who is 24 and in flight school, saves like a miser…which we instilled in him early on. He already has over $100K put away from work he has done over summers and since he graduated Uni, plus us putting away 80% of any money he got for birthdays and Christmas, etc…

If he doesn’t put another penny towards that, and it earns 10% per year for the 43 years he will have to work until he’s pensionable, he will have 7 doubling periods.

100-200
200-400
400-800
800-1.6
1.6-3.2
3.2-6.4
6.4-12.8

That’s $12.8M

If he can save ANOTHER $100k in the next 7 yrs, that’s an additional $6.4M (1 less doubling period).

If he saves $100K every 7 yrs, that’d be another $3.2M, plus another $1.6M, plus another $800K, and so on!

It ends up being $25M!!!

THAT is what the time value of money can do!!! THE COMPOUNDING IS CRAZY!!!

Einstein was right about more than just relativity!!!

10% a year!
Dream on.
6% is too generous.

 

[mancity1]

10% a year!
Dream on.
6% is too generous.

CB is right about compound interest but its not amazing it just year 9 maths.

On the flip side inflation compounds identically and while markets grow overtime I fear that many hedge funds , shared equity firms and superannuation fund managers and the like particularly industry fund managers will get the go ahead from many governments of various persuasions to fund green projects that will not get anywhere near a market return and you would be better to keep any savings you have in a reputable bank that is government secured than have your savings in essentially borrowed or tax payer funded projects.

Look at just one project in OZ snowy hydro mark 2 , 20 billion wasted to date and on the verge of abandonment.

Look at the NBN rollout , 60 billion and rising and now technology has pushed it into the never never like dial up.

In most localities ADSL was as quick and more reliable and when the lights went out you could still use a landline.

These are the kinds of projects governments want investment savings of the taxpayer and the like to fund into the future (LOL) with their savings.

You can get lucky and pick stocks e.g if you invested 10k in two companies like REA and CSL from inception they would now be worth over 10 million over 39 years and 20 year investments respectively.

Conversely the ASX is only at the value it was in 2007 and that doesn't include inflation.

Most of the biggest ASX companies are cyclical and of course some fall well short of that but continue to trade until taken over and the odd one collapses.

The average amount held in super currently in OZ one of the ore affluent countries on the planet is 350k despite 9 per cent of salary for all PAYEE employees being delivered by law.

Most will still rely on a pension or part pension of sorts currently around $ 800 per week in total per couple.

Only around 5 per cent at best can afford a very comfortable retirement if that if you have worked 40 years on average weekly earnings and raised 2-3 children ands stayed in good health.

It would be similar in the UK only worse for the majority by say 10-15 per cent in dollar terms over the past 30 years.

 

[pride in battle]

The time value of money is the multiplier than created eye watering numbers!

As I mentioned, the company I work for went bankrupt in Dec 2002. I had about $170K in stock that became $2K, and my retirement annuity went from 50% of Final Average Earnings (Highest 12 of 36 mos) to a fixed snapshot of what it would be in 2004…24 yrs prior to my actual retirement date!

That meant I had to try and make up for that 50% annuity with an ISA type account on the market on 50% of my pre-bankruptcy pay. I was just starting to make a small dent in the nut after 6 years of struggle (while also funding 4 yrs of college for my 2 kids) when the 2008-09 financial crisis decimated it AGAIN! That now left 20 yrs to retirement and back to about where I was before the bankruptcy in ‘02!

Since then, things have been better, of course, but what’s amazing (and a little sickening) is that the younger guys I work with who got hired around that time have only seen up, up, and away! I did some volunteer union retirement & insurance work and regularly hear guys telling me they’re looking at a retirement nut of $10M and up!

Rule of 72 estimates you double your money every 7.5 years. That means $1 saved today is worth $2 in 7.5 yrs, $4 in 15 yrs, $8 in 22.5 yrs, $16 in 30 yrs and $32 in 37.5 yrs…which is about when most guys retire! Those doubling periods, especially that last one, can make you fabulously well off, if you don’t fuck it up!

My son, who is 24 and in flight school, saves like a miser…which we instilled in him early on. He already has over $100K put away from work he has done over summers and since he graduated Uni, plus us putting away 80% of any money he got for birthdays and Christmas, etc…

If he doesn’t put another penny towards that, and it earns 10% per year for the 43 years he will have to work until he’s pensionable, he will have 7 doubling periods.

100-200
200-400
400-800
800-1.6
1.6-3.2
3.2-6.4
6.4-12.8

That’s $12.8M

If he can save ANOTHER $100k in the next 7 yrs, that’s an additional $6.4M (1 less doubling period).

If he saves $100K every 7 yrs, that’d be another $3.2M, plus another $1.6M, plus another $800K, and so on!

It ends up being $25M!!!

THAT is what the time value of money can do!!! THE COMPOUNDING IS CRAZY!!!

Einstein was right about more than just relativity!!!

To be honest mate that sounds a bit money obsessed, smell the ******* roses

 

[ChicagoBlue]

10% a year!
Dream on.
6% is too generous.

I’m not sure who your advisor is, but…

The S&P 500 index has returned a historic annualized average return of around 11.88% since its 1957 inception through the end of 2021. (Investopedia)

The Stocks/Bonds 40/60 Portfolio is a Medium Risk portfolio and can be implemented with 2 ETFs. It's exposed for 40% on the Stock Market. In the last 30 Years, the Stocks/Bonds 40/60 Portfolio obtained a 6.80% compound annual return, with a 6.82% standard deviation. (Lazyportfolioetf.com)

 

[ChicagoBlue]

To be honest mate that sounds a bit money obsessed, smell the ******* roses

I used to be a financial analyst and have been helping pilots with Retirement & Insurance issues for the last 28yrs.

It’s not obsessed, it’s life.

I’m not sure what “smell the roses” means to you, but I’m not going to be looking for a florist any time soon! And, it’s not just about me, either. I have a wife whose genes suggest she’ll see 100, two kids I’d like to leave a butty, and some educational scholarships I’d like to fund with a legacy.

I live in an old house, drive a 2008 Subaru and have shoes older than my post-Uni kids! Different strokes…

 

[RadcliffeRick]

I could be wrong but I have found that most women are attracted to men who have big wallets and bank accounts rather than big penises. After all there is nothing worse than being labelled a loser magnate.

Edited for accuracy

 

[ChicagoBlue]

I could be wrong but I have found that most women are attracted to men who have big ambitions rather than big penises. After all there is nothing worse than being labelled a loser magnate.

I believe Darwin called it evolution.

 

[flook]

10% a year!
Dream on.
6% is too generous.

not sure about that tbh, pre 2022 my ISA was returning close to 11% PA and even now is averaged at about 8. Accepting if you will the current shitshow will end at some point in the not too distant future, I'm still working on a 7% average.

Oh and just so we're clear, I'm no expert :)