Russian invasion of Ukraine

MichaelBBack said:
Always saw this thread popping up and avoided clicking on it until today, for some reason. Wish I hadn't bothered.

I'm in Russia right now. Married to a Russian woman, who was born in Ukraine and has family dotted all over the place, all against what's happening and desperate for it to be over. Her dad's a military veteran, and he's the sweetest guy I've ever met, a wonderful person who makes wooden toys in his spare time for local kids and brings us homemade soup each week. I've seen Russian soldiers, too, a shocking majority of whom are frightened or naive young men, barely out of their teens, with minimal training, pushed into the military life by the macho culture that prevails over here and the utterly in-tatters economy, most of whom hadn't got a clue where they were even being sent when all this kicked off and/or had been brainwashed into thinking they were helping people. And I've seen parents here who are broken and don't even know that their sons are in Ukraine until they get a call saying that they've been killed.

The whole thing is an atrocity, do not get me wrong, and I am in no way defending any of Russia's actions. I also agree that any scum, soldier or not, that goes around raping, murdering, or torturing people deserves whatever comes to them.

But for me, directing anger at the people at the top who kicked this off and control it is perfectly normal, directing anger at the concept of what's happening is fine, and directing anger at the absolute worst of the worst who have committed rapes and murders during these recent months, absolutely. And of course our thoughts and cares have to be with Ukraine and its people right now. Again, I don't want this at all to sound like "Oh won't someone please think of the poor Russians!"

But to blindly condemn the entire country and to find some kind of joy in seeing people blown to bits, to be unable to think of the human beings, the people who were born and raised here and joined the army thinking they were doing something good and are now caught up in this whole thing, well that's pretty damn sick, too... But to each his own I suppose.

All I hope for is that this ends as soon as possible.

Wouldn't bother replying to this as I won't return to the thread.
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Do you not think then that the fate of those Russian soldiers is in the hands of the Russian people?
 
flook said:
Anyone who thought before this that scrapping our nuclear deterrent was an optimistic idiot at best. Anyone who now thinks scrapping our nuclear deterrent is just plain stupid
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Interesting site here shows how the stockpiles built up and then reduced.
www.visualcapitalist.com

Animated Chart: Nuclear Warheads by Country (1945-2022)

Nine countries currently possess all the world's nuclear warheads. This animation visualizes how the global nuclear arsenal has changed since 1945.
www.visualcapitalist.com www.visualcapitalist.com
 
It’s the first thing I asked when he invaded Ukraine do we still have the ultimate deterrent ? and I’ve been assured we have. So let’s bolster our armed forces the numbers have dwindled since the Falklands and pray we never need to send young men to die on the battlefield.
I was so proud of our lads holding the fort In Afghanistan but there didn’t seem enough of them. We are lucky that Biden is on our side but being Reliant on the US for our defence needs our armed forces to be strengthened just in case they have someone less committed to nato.

Michael………. no one enjoys seeing young lads of any country being blown to bits but this thread is really about Putin‘s decision to invade Ukraine we all know there are a few bad eggs in any force it’s not a personal attack on decent Russians. Take care
 
If you enter the battlefield arena, then expect the possibility of being taken out with extreme prejudice. Maybe the nicer Russian combatants that don't rape/torture and just spend their time carving nice wooden toys for the children could wear rainbow armbands for safety. Sorry to burst your balloon Michael but those fuckers are all fair game.

As for the boys born and raised in the motherland just joining the army thinking they were a force for good in the world, then one has to beware of wolves in sheeps clothing (Matthew 7:15) Not many people working for the forces of good tend to approach you whilst sat in the turret of a tank.

I understand the layers Michael's talking about, but sadly the die is cast and the Russians will remain a pariah in the hearts and minds of people for many more years to come. Such a shame the Russian people cannot see what we can see due to the censorship of their maniacal leadership.
 
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Fode N The Hole said:
That isn't might is right. It is the opposite.
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I’d be interested to understand how it’s the opposite. My interpretation is to go to war over the question of being morally right (moral certainty is just a way to justify the cost of that) is to prove you are right. To only do so if you have the power to prove you are right is exactly the same premise as “might is right”.
 
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