Russian invasion of Ukraine

Gorton_Tubster said:
Same here. It was, is, a bit of a pipe dream to think Ukraine could beat the superpower on their doorstep.

Shit I know but people dying for a mostly lost cause is so wasteful of life.

I too am fed up of news and social media feeds proclaiming Russia to be in their knees. Its western clickbait bullshit mainly.
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The problem with your post is that you’re applying the same motivations to the Ukrainians and Russians.

Ukraine didn’t want or start the conflict. For them, it’s a war of survival not simply a fight to beat Russia.

Other than surrendering their sovereignty, there was simply no other option Ukraine could have taken. In my option, they’ve done incredibly well to limit Russian advances.

The fact Russia needs support from two other superpowers in China and America to defeat Ukraine speaks volumes about this conflict.

If you cannot surrender and are fighting an enemy you cannot defeat, you make sure any victory for the aggressor is pyrrhic. That in itself could be advantageous for Ukraine in the long term.
 
I feel that Ukraine are too nice and are trying to appease the west.I actually want to see Russians lined up and shot.Because in all honesty no Russian is ever going to stand trial for any war crime..Start flattening the Russian cities starting at moscow and St Peterburg.. What ive witnessed of the so called world courts are a total waste of anyone's money..
 
daztrueblue91 said:
The problem with your post is that you’re applying the same motivations to the Ukrainians and Russians.

Ukraine didn’t want or start the conflict. For them, it’s a war of survival not simply a fight to beat Russia.

Other than surrendering their sovereignty, there was simply no other option Ukraine could have taken. In my option, they’ve done incredibly well to limit Russian advances.

The fact Russia needs support from two other superpowers in China and America to defeat Ukraine speaks volumes about this conflict.

If you cannot surrender and are fighting an enemy you cannot defeat, you make sure any victory for the aggressor is pyrrhic. That in itself could be advantageous for Ukraine in the long term.
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If Russia stops fighting it simply means they go home, if Ukraine stops fighting then it will be overwhelmed, conquered and subjugated.
 
I don't know what the best thing for Ukraine to do in these circumstances is, though plenty others seem to.

I just think we should support then whatever they choose.

For those who think they should accept this deal, consider this: Ukraine is not a viable country under the terms we've seen. Russia gets to prevent it having a viable defensive army and a land settlement that opens the route to Kjiv.

So one way or another, likely sooner than later, Ukraine will be another Belarus.
 
Scottyboi said:
Yet they have been, destroyed a navy without having their own. Forced russia to depend on north korea for ammunition and to help them take back Kursk. Depleted all their Soviet stocks, now struggle to have an artillery advantage. russia have been broken in Ukraine you have to be a thick **** to not realise that.

Fighting for the survival of your nation isn't a lost cause, or were our soldiers in ww2 fighting a lost cause as they evacuated at Dunkirk against a greater foe? And ultimately it is up to Ukrainians to decide what is a lost cause not you or I. If they want peace on the terms offered then who am I to judge I'm not the one sat underground most nights praying my home is still in one piece.

Only because you're clueless to how it all works.
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Oh god. OK. It was only an opinion. Sorry you are upset
 
roubaixtuesday said:
For those who think they should accept this deal, consider this: Ukraine is not a viable country under the terms we've seen. Russia gets to prevent it having a viable defensive army and a land settlement that opens the route to Kjiv.

So one way or another, likely sooner than later, Ukraine will be another Belarus.
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I think there would be a lot more insurrection in Ukraine and there is no way Russia or its puppet government would be able to seize overall control of military production in Ukraine. That may have been possible in 2022, but it’s gone way beyond that point now.

The outcome you predict will prove a pyrrhic victory for Russia. This will not end well for them, and as I posted earlier they’ve got a number of other serious issues to face as a nation, and cannot afford to spare the energy that this will sap from them, given what it has taken already.
 
This plan is all about driving a wedge between Ukraine and USA to try and make the war easier for russia. Alot rests of Merz and Co making Trump see it for what it is like last time.
 
There’s got to be a chance that even if Zelensky agrees to this deal, a sizeable number of Ukrainians simply won’t accept it and will continue fighting, albeit in unconventional ways. Think the drone attacks on oil facilities would likely continue.

This whole thing is insanely complex, whichever way you slice and dice the outcome.
 
Strange sense of humor from trump offering
Ukraine's territory and future to putin for Thanksgiving...

USA won't be part of the so-called security guarantees for UA. Squeezing Europe and UK is the plan.

The most important point is though, international law goes down the drain as usual while law of the jungle prevails.

I don't even understand the debate, unless you love the law of the jungle where the stronger takes what he wants giving a shite on the rest.
 
BlueAnorak said:
Hiszanswer will be to surrender. It always is.
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I mean, much as it would kill me, if I had the power to click my fingers and the fighting would stop immediately and Russia got to keep what has stolen then I would. But it would be on the proviso that they would be prevented from coming back again. That is the only way this can work. They won’t stop coming unless prevented. It’s as simple as that. Anyone who thinks otherwise is an idiot.
 
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