skrtels goal, offside?

[Skashion]

where did i say he was obstructing his view?, just his very positioning was where my arguement lie, and by being where he was may just have played a part in harts decision making. It was a thread about the nuances of the offside law, and in "some instances" the flag could and has been raised, some articulate posters have recognised this, and others have not.

In your OP you said stood on Hart's toes, surely interfering - as he clearly didn't interfere with play I take that to mean interfering with an opponent. In the context of offside, obstructing a view is pretty much the offence that occurs. The other is making a movement (or gesture) towards the ball AND which distracts or deceives a player from playing the ball as they would do if there was no offside offence.

Hart is not supposed to take an offside player's movements into his decision-making. FIFA assumes officials will do their jobs correctly and will rule them offside if they score after gaining an advantage.

See page 106 - 108 on FIFA's Laws of the Game: <a class="postlink" href="http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/affederation/generic/81/42/36/lawsofthegame_2011_12_en.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/affeder ... _12_en.pdf</a> It has some illustrations. It's not scenario 6, and it's clearly not scenario 9 as Bolini's movements did not prevent Hart having the space to make a save and thus play the ball. It's scenario 7 or 8.

 

[fathellensbellend]

where did i say he was obstructing his view?, just his very positioning was where my arguement lie, and by being where he was may just have played a part in harts decision making. It was a thread about the nuances of the offside law, and in "some instances" the flag could and has been raised, some articulate posters have recognised this, and others have not.

In your OP you said stood on Hart's toes, surely interfering - as he clearly didn't interfere with play I take that to mean interfering with an opponent. In the context of offside, obstructing a view is pretty much the offence that occurs. The other is making a movement (or gesture) towards the ball AND which distracts or deceives a player from playing the ball as they would do if there was no offside offence.

Hart is not supposed to take an offside player's movements into his decision-making. FIFA assumes officials will do their jobs correctly and will rule them offside if they score after gaining an advantage.

See page 106 - 108 on FIFA's Laws of the Game: <a class="postlink" href="http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/affederation/generic/81/42/36/lawsofthegame_2011_12_en.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/affeder ... _12_en.pdf</a> It has some illustrations. It's not scenario 6, and it's clearly not scenario 9 as Bolini's movements did not prevent Hart having the space to make a save and thus play the ball. It's scenario 7 or 8.

fifa assumes the officials will do there job correctly, but you and i know that isn't strictly the case, interpretation comes into it, and goals have been disallowed for less, and i am not stating it should have been disallowed, i just thought i was worth a discussion. The fact it was a brilliant header certainly leans towards a goal, but in the time span of the corner being swung in, borini moving and skrtel heading it, we are talking fractions of a second.

anyhow surely time to put it to bed.

 

[chesterblue]

The point everybody is overlooking is the new interpretation of active or non-active. When Skirtle makes the header Borini is not active (ie he is not taking part in that particular passage of play). If, however, Hart had parried the ball or it an upright and Borini then knocked it over the line, the Assistant Referee should then have flagged for offside as the player in question had now become active.

 

[wilf9]

Lets be clear. You can't be offside if you are behind the ball. Therefore unless borini is off the pitch he can stand wherever he likes. For him to become active there needs to be a flick on from a Liverpool head which there isn't!!

 

[Mr Ed (The Stables)]

You can't be offside if you're behind the ball

Agreed you can't be offside from a corner....simples!!

However Kolerov was allowed to challenge for the ball and head the ball away.....but he was having a fag or an afternoon nap at the time!

 

[fathellensbellend]

no-one is suggesting you can be offside from the corner.

 

[Dubai Blue]

Probably a legitimate goal however I can see a scenario where that happens against the rags and it's ruled offside. I can also imagine the media backing them up as they usually do.

That's the fundamental problem with the vagaries of the offside rule and those in the media who choose not to understand it. As much as we can all argue about this particular scenario on here, I think we can all agree that such a goal could well be flagged offside (wrongly) and just brushed under the carpet after seeing a replay that shows Borini stood in an offside position.

I can even hear some knobhead like Trevor Francis or Ray Wilkins saying "Didn't look to be anything wrong with that on first viewing, but my word I must say that is a terrific spot by the linesman; Borini is clearly stood in an offside position when Skrtel heads the ball. An excellent call and Liverpool can have no complaints."

The rest of the sheep would then accept this as gospel and it would never be questioned ever again, with every know-nowt knobhead in the pub declaring what a good job the linesman had done.

And for what it's worth, I understood what the OP meant right from his first post even though I don't agree with him. I was a bit confused when people started berating him as it hadn't even occurred to me that he meant he was offside from the corner.

 

[bernabias home shirt]

Good post Dubai.
That was thing that got me,i don't think many others got the op's point.
I said earlier in the thread I could relate to his post,however he was wrong.

Good debate though.

 

[SWP's back]

You can't be offside if you're behind the ball

Agreed you can't be offside from a corner....simples!!

However Kolerov was allowed to challenge for the ball and head the ball away.....but he was having a fag or an afternoon nap at the time!

Ermmm only a weirdo would say that (and Skashion). Ofcourse you can when the ball is in second phase after a second attacker has touched the ball. The OP was more than clear enough, though it would have been wrong to disallow the goal.

 

[Deleted member 14625]

The point everybody is overlooking is the new interpretation of active or non-active. When Skirtle makes the header Borini is not active (ie he is not taking part in that particular passage of play). If, however, Hart had parried the ball or it an upright and Borini then knocked it over the line, the Assistant Referee should then have flagged for offside as the player in question had now become active.

Spot on!