Stop the War

urban genie said:
I would say the shots of cumbrians having their light festival despite the government not givinf a shit about them shows a people with pride in theor comunity and could be classed as national pride, one thing us brits do well is to use a cliche keep calm and carry on.

waving a saint george and singing a shit anthem isn't showing pride in my mind going back to normal the day after a tragerdy like the recent floods, manchesters bombing, 7/7 etc show a proud nation

sorry for spellingg in big hands after watching the superb high gig at accademy so fingers are not so dexturous
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Fuck knows how this has gone to national pride but that just sums up why the English(of today)are so pissed off at being labeled
 
-nibz- said:
Fuck knows how this has gone to national pride but that just sums up why the English(of today)are so pissed off at being labeled
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because the right wing hijacked such things in the late 70's stigmatising them and because unlike other countries we are more reserved, go around germany, france ,thailand etc they will have their flag flying in general residential areas or individuals houses, the fuckwits on the right ruined the saint george and we are too polite a nation to wrestle it back except for sporting events. As for the national anthem ... It's shite
 
avgvePR.jpg



RAF lads of the Second World War.
 
urban genie said:
because the right wing hijacked such things in the late 70's stigmatising them and because unlike other countries we are more reserved, go around germany, france ,thailand etc they will have their flag flying in general residential areas or individuals houses, the fuckwits on the right ruined the saint george and we are too polite a nation to wrestle it back except for sporting events. As for the national anthem ... It's shite
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Your'e brainwashed to be apposed to 'the other side' yet you can't see it.
 
Ban-jani said:
Holier-than-thou types who fall over themselves trying to appear as the nicest, liberal, tree hugger. Who are against all violence, despite a murderous cult trying to kill them and everyone else on the planet.

Fucking idiots. They don't care about Civilians in the Middle East, they're just always looking to criticise our government and as long as it's not a stray British bomb which accidentally kills a civilian, then they're happy to bury their heads in the sand.
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All of these have done more in one day to 'defend their country' than you have in a lifetime i'd guess.
http://www.stopwar.org.uk/index.php...en-british-soldiers-met-ex-members-of-the-ira
 
Ban-jani said:
Or you can listen to the people fighting IS on the ground?

http://blogs.new.spectator.co.uk/2015/12/for-us-kurds-western-intervention-is-a-lifeline/
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The Kurds have been killing IS in some numbers, apparently, aided to a great extent by allied bombing.
We should tell them to stop it immediately, as all they're doing is radicalising everyone.
Best just to allow IS to continue their beheading, raping, burning alive, and hurling gays off buildings.
Otherwise, they may get radicalised.
Stop the war.
 
Ancient Citizen said:
The Kurds have been killing IS in some numbers, apparently, aided to a great extent by allied bombing.
We should tell them to stop it immediately, as all they're doing is radicalising everyone.
Best just to allow IS to continue their beheading, raping, burning alive, and hurling gays off buildings.
Otherwise, they may get radicalised.
Stop the war.
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You see there are many here happy to bury their heads about what's going on and not get involved.

To me they're like the shithouse at school who walks past the bully who's giving the nerd another kicking.
 
I was on the railway pickets when the SWP tried to muscle in. At first they offered support and collected money. They then tried to force strikers to attend their meetings. Those who refused were bullied and hassled. Most strikers were just out to increase a very meagre wage, and to try and improve conditions and our future pension. The SWP wanted us to stand with them on all world issues, and couldn't understand most of us were not interested. It became obvious they had no interest in our cause, and just wanted to have a go at any authority and world powers, and to further their own cause. The amount of misinformation they were happy to circulate if it helped their cause was mindboggling. This lead to them turning on us. It got quite nasty in the end.

Current anti war protesters think anybody who supports the bombing campaign are warmongers or misinformed morons. They smugly assume they are right and anybody who thinks otherwise have been brainwashed by the government. It would never occur to them that they might be the ones brainwashed by the various left wing protester groups.
The current situation in the middle east doesn't compare to previous problems. Mainly because, previous conflicts were against people who just wanted us out. Isis, not only want us out, but are also intent on expanding and dominating other countries. Simply ignoring the problem, or doing nothing will not work/help this time.

It is too simple to say we/Americans have caused this problem in the first place, as the region has always been very unstable and would have had these problems regardless. I would agree that our previous actions have not made things any better though. It is just too easy to just blame the government for everything they do, when we have enjoyed the fruits of that labour for decades. We rely on oil as a developed nation for example. Somebody has had to get their hands dirty to keep it flowing. Yet some criticise from the comfort of there keyboards, when the truth is nobody knows what is really going on over there apart from the people there...
 
fulabeer said:
I was on the railway pickets when the SWP tried to muscle in. At first they offered support and collected money. They then tried to force strikers to attend their meetings. Those who refused were bullied and hassled. Most strikers were just out to increase a very meagre wage, and to try and improve conditions and our future pension. The SWP wanted us to stand with them on all world issues, and couldn't understand most of us were not interested. It became obvious they had no interest in our cause, and just wanted to have a go at any authority and world powers, and to further their own cause. The amount of misinformation they were happy to circulate if it helped their cause was mindboggling. This lead to them turning on us. It got quite nasty in the end.

Current anti war protesters think anybody who supports the bombing campaign are warmongers or misinformed morons. They smugly assume they are right and anybody who thinks otherwise have been brainwashed by the government. It would never occur to them that they might be the ones brainwashed by the various left wing protester groups.
The current situation in the middle east doesn't compare to previous problems. Mainly because, previous conflicts were against people who just wanted us out. Isis, not only want us out, but are also intent on expanding and dominating other countries. Simply ignoring the problem, or doing nothing will not work/help this time.

It is too simple to say we/Americans have caused this problem in the first place, as the region has always been very unstable and would have had these problems regardless. I would agree that our previous actions have not made things any better though. It is just too easy to just blame the government for everything they do, when we have enjoyed the fruits of that labour for decades. We rely on oil as a developed nation for example. Somebody has had to get their hands dirty to keep it flowing. Yet some criticise from the comfort of there keyboards, when the truth is nobody knows what is really going on over there apart from the people there...
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Some really interesting points being made there, a refreshing read.

However, towards the end you made a point about us enjoying the fruits of our government's labour. I'm sorry but, unless I've misunderstood your point, that's total cat shit. That would be like saying that American's fighting for the abolition of slavery should have been greatful for all the cotton shirts hanging in their wardrobe.

The reward for obliterating villages of human beings is just continued support of Western lives of excess. As someone who lives amongst (and frequently takes part in) the excess, I'd say that damage is being done to both the people of Syria and Britain by our government; one under the guise of eradicating a highly radicalised religious movement and the other by controlling it's citizens with misdirection and short term solutions to long term problems.
 
I meant we in the west have a better lifestyle because other people are doing the dirty work, and it is easy for us to just criticise for how that is achieved. I'm thankful I don't have to make certain decisions. I don't like what the government is doing, I just don't kneejerk react and criticise, as I know I don't fully understand what is going on. (other people like to think they do, but they don't etc)
 
urban genie said:
My

experience with them was when I was a kid and my dad was on strike. Fair play they collected money and got donations for the strikers, but they seemed to thinak they could then turn up at the picket lines and rant and cause mither with the coppers. They would also just turn up at our house daily telling me dad to support this that and the other and that their help for the strikers should mean they owe them support. In the end me dad told them to fuck off as they would not leave anyone in the strike alone, they then decided to heckle strikers as traitors to soclaism for not supporting them on everything. When we go on marches and they turn up all me dad says is "the tossers are here" Most left wing groups joke about their name as they probably haven't worked a day in their life.
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Doesn't surprise me, but what did surprise me is that Stop the War is part of the Socialist Worker's Party. A cynic would say they're using Stop the War as a means of anti capitalism protest movement rather than a peace movement that condemns all violence, aggression and war.
Someone did post a website address about veterans who speak out about conflict and war, I'll take more notice of their views in the future.
 
fulabeer said:
I meant we in the west have a better lifestyle because other people are doing the dirty work, and it is easy for us to just criticise for how that is achieved. I'm thankful I don't have to make certain decisions. I don't like what the government is doing, I just don't kneejerk react and criticise, as I know I don't fully understand what is going on. (other people like to think they do, but they don't etc)
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Of course, all that people know is what they choose to believe. But I am in no way appreciative of this "better lifestyle" that has been given to me. In fact, as someone who works full time on barely above minimum wage in a high risk job that requires endless training, this argument seems like it might have some basis for those who do genuinely profiteer from armed conflict but has next to fuck all to do with the majority of the population.
 
fulabeer said:
I was on the railway pickets when the SWP tried to muscle in. At first they offered support and collected money. They then tried to force strikers to attend their meetings. Those who refused were bullied and hassled. Most strikers were just out to increase a very meagre wage, and to try and improve conditions and our future pension. The SWP wanted us to stand with them on all world issues, and couldn't understand most of us were not interested. It became obvious they had no interest in our cause, and just wanted to have a go at any authority and world powers, and to further their own cause. The amount of misinformation they were happy to circulate if it helped their cause was mindboggling. This lead to them turning on us. It got quite nasty in the end.

Current anti war protesters think anybody who supports the bombing campaign are warmongers or misinformed morons. They smugly assume they are right and anybody who thinks otherwise have been brainwashed by the government. It would never occur to them that they might be the ones brainwashed by the various left wing protester groups.
The current situation in the middle east doesn't compare to previous problems. Mainly because, previous conflicts were against people who just wanted us out. Isis, not only want us out, but are also intent on expanding and dominating other countries. Simply ignoring the problem, or doing nothing will not work/help this time.

It is too simple to say we/Americans have caused this problem in the first place, as the region has always been very unstable and would have had these problems regardless. I would agree that our previous actions have not made things any better though. It is just too easy to just blame the government for everything they do, when we have enjoyed the fruits of that labour for decades. We rely on oil as a developed nation for example. Somebody has had to get their hands dirty to keep it flowing. Yet some criticise from the comfort of there keyboards, when the truth is nobody knows what is really going on over there apart from the people there...
Click to expand...
I have had experience of the SWP donkey's years ago. A bunch of western hating, self loathers who, to a man/woman
were all from the middle class, well to do areas around the town, none were what you would call 'Working class.'
They actually don't mix with whom they purport to champion, in fact they treat them with a sanctimonious contempt,
as they know better, obviously. Needless to say the 'Workers' bit in the title was something not one of them did, it was either permanent students, or training for some sort of activists job.
 
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