Suella Braverman - sacked as Home Secretary (p394)

mexico1970 said:
It's a bit sneery mate and without getting into the conversation because it has been flogged to death, the asylum rules and system in general needs a rethink.

It should be a lot easier to remove the 20% who fail asylum.

Not everyone who emigrates here is a brain surgeon and is better than Dave.

Not every one who talks about immigration is stupid and is a racist.
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Why is it 'sneery'?

It's wholly factual. The government issues hundreds of thousands of visas each year. Given their politics, why, if it isn't necessary for economic reasons, including filling unfillable vacancies in the job market? This is a political choice. Not exactly the far-left these Tories, are they?

The Government could invest vast sums in training up more of our own people. It chooses not to and imports immigrants instead. Why? Is it purely cost? Is it that many of own own are so badly educated - to put it politely - that they are wholly unfitted to these roles? Or are the Tories secretly trying to replace us with brown people? Hey, maybe we have uncovered the reason for leaving the EU, to stop white immigration! Seriously, what explanation do you find most likely? For my part, I think it's cost. Are you up for paying more tax?

Similarly, around 80% of asylum seekers qualify for asylum. That is they hit whatever the criteria are. Just a fact.

As to the other 20%, I presume we try to return them 'home'. But it's not hard to envisage there might be the odd difficulty with that. China, I know for a fact, will not accept people who have left China. Maybe other countries are similarly awkward. These countries are sovereign states too. It's not 1899. We can't just tell them what to do. What's the alternative? Shoot them? Keep them in jail indefinitely?

Any fool can come up with slogans like 'Stop the Boats'. Strength Through Joy. Work Makes Free. See how easy it is? But the practical work involved in achieving an end like 'reducing immigration' is huge. It almost certainly means spending more public money. (Higher taxes is what that translates to.) It definitely means coming to terms with other sovereign states and engaging in complex and delicate negotiations, at least some of which will also involve cost (to us). Generally, to get an agreement with another country, you have to give something back. You cannot be the kid who keeps all the toys and refuses to play. It really doesn't work like that.
 
Ducado said:
But she need she support of MPs and she has not got that unless the Tory party is reduced to a few swivel eyed loons
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I feel that she may have views to flouncing out of the tories waving her martyrdom flag and join with other luminaries of the loony right - farage springs to mind- in a new extremist set-up, and takes the swivel-eyed loons remaining in the tories with her.
The tories reduced to small numbers and an act of revenge from cruella.
It‘s a win/win for the ratbag.
 
BrianW said:
Why is it 'sneery'?

It's wholly factual. The government issues hundreds of thousands of visas each year. Given their politics, why, if it isn't necessary for economic reasons, including filling unfillable vacancies in the job market? This is a political choice. Not exactly the far-left these Tories, are they?

The Government could invest vast sums in training up more of our own people. It chooses not to and imports immigrants instead. Why? Is it purely cost? Is it that many of own own are so badly educated - to put it politely - that they are wholly unfitted to these roles? Or are the Tories secretly trying to replace us with brown people? Hey, maybe we have uncovered the reason for leaving the EU, to stop white immigration! Seriously, what explanation do you find most likely? For my part, I think it's cost. Are you up for paying more tax?

Similarly, around 80% of asylum seekers qualify for asylum. That is they hit whatever the criteria are. Just a fact.

As to the other 20%, I presume we try to return them 'home'. But it's not hard to envisage there might be the odd difficulty with that. China, I know for a fact, will not accept people who have left China. Maybe other countries are similarly awkward. These countries are sovereign states too. It's not 1899. We can't just tell them what to do. What's the alternative? Shoot them? Keep them in jail indefinitely?

Any fool can come up with slogans like 'Stop the Boats'. Strength Through Joy. Work Makes Free. See how easy it is? But the practical work involved in achieving an end like 'reducing immigration' is huge. It almost certainly means spending more public money. (Higher taxes is what that translates to.) It definitely means coming to terms with other sovereign states and engaging in complex and delicate negotiations, at least some of which will also involve cost (to us). Generally, to get an agreement with another country, you have to give something back. You cannot be the kid who keeps all the toys and refuses to play. It really doesn't work like that.
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It was sneery because you thought so little of Dave, you might not agree that we need to stop the boats but many many other people do.

You know? Have an opinion on immigration. People had an opinion on immigration BEFORE the boats started to come why were they not allowed to have an opinion then?

Asylum needs an overhaul, everything about it needs changing, what you wont do is change peoples minds (Not that it needs changing) by mentioning Dave the bloody shelf stacker.
 
mexico1970 said:
It was sneery because you thought so little of Dave, you might not agree that we need to stop the boats but many many other people do.

You know? Have an opinion on immigration. People had an opinion on immigration BEFORE the boats started to come why were they not allowed to have an opinion then?

Asylum needs an overhaul, everything about it needs changing, what you wont do is change peoples minds (Not that it needs changing) by mentioning Dave the bloody shelf stacker.
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Sorry Dave.
 
mexico1970 said:
It was sneery because you thought so little of Dave, you might not agree that we need to stop the boats but many many other people do.

You know? Have an opinion on immigration. People had an opinion on immigration BEFORE the boats started to come why were they not allowed to have an opinion then?

Asylum needs an overhaul, everything about it needs changing, what you wont do is change peoples minds (Not that it needs changing) by mentioning Dave the bloody shelf stacker.
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Let's say it all needs changing.

It won't be changed by slogans, and still less by whining. It will be changed by practical men and women working very hard for a long time and coming up with an alternative paradigm. That will almost certainly involve complex and delicate negotiations with other sovereign states and it will certainly involve a great deal of cost.

None of this is glamorous, and none of it is quick, either. The charlatan Tories divert you with silly slogans and constant whining but do nothing practical to bring about change. That's because they know they will con a certain class of people into supporting them. Meanwhile, they issue hundreds of thousands of immigration visas each year. The Tory Government that is. Not Jeremy Corbyn. Not Momentum. Not the Brixton Black Sisters Collective. The Tory Government.

They've been doing this all my life since the days of 'If you want a N***** for a Neighbour, Vote Labour.' Yes, that was them too. And, when they won power, did they cut immigration? Did they fuck. The Tories have been in power for roughly 80% of the last century by the way.

If you can't see it for the distraction con that it is, I really can't help you.
 
The only reason the boats should be stopped is so we can offer a safer more humane way of entering the country without risk of death.
Not because they are all 20 something gangsters who are going to eat your children as some would have you believe.
Of course there will be some who are unsavoury and a risk which is why there should be protocols in place that can do the necessary checks before they are allowed to roam the streets.
I’m not sure what the answer is but I am sure this mob ruling atm aren’t even close to getting it right.
 
BrianW said:
Let's say it all needs changing.

It won't be changed by slogans, and still less by whining. It will be changed by practical men and women working very hard for a long time and coming up with an alternative paradigm. That will almost certainly involve complex and delicate negotiations with other sovereign states and it will certainly involve a great deal of cost.

None of this is glamorous, and none of it is quick, either. The charlatan Tories divert you with silly slogans and constant whining but do nothing practical to bring about change. That's because they know they will con a certain class of people into supporting them. Meanwhile, they issue hundreds of thousands of immigration visas each year. The Tory Government that is. Not Jeremy Corbyn. Not Momentum. Not the Brixton Black Sisters Collective. The Tory Government.

They've been doing this all my life since the days of 'If you want a N***** for a Neighbour, Vote Labour.' Yes, that was them too. And, when they won power, did they cut immigration? Did they fuck. The Tories have been in power for roughly 80% of the last century by the way.

If you can't see it for the distraction con that it is, I really can't help you.
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The Tories are cunts.

But I know someone sneering at the working class when I see it, and I CAN'T help you with that.
 
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