OB1
Well-Known Member
And Then There Were Three is one of my favourite Genesis albums. Much prefer it to Foxtrot but more on that at some point.
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The Album Review Club - Week #145 - (page 1923) - Tellin' Stories - The Charlatans
- Thread starter RobMCFC
- Start date
And Then There Were Three is one of my favourite Genesis albums. Much prefer it to Foxtrot but more on that at some point.
Saddleworth2
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- 27 Jan 2014
- Messages
- 21,646
I recognise that the tall lad isnt to everyones taste but he is not a Gabriel impressionist. He manages to recreate early genesis vibe in his own way.I love Hackett and anything he does...but I can't listen to people trying to sing Peter's vocals!
RobMCFC
Well-Known Member
Foxtrot - Genesis
A very theatrical album this one, which for me means that there’s good and bad.
“Get ‘Em Out by Friday” is a great example. There’s some brilliant music on show, those choppy organ parts are superb, and the track is generally well put together with lots of interesting changes. However, whilst I’m also a big fan of stories in a song, Peter Gabriel’s singing doesn’t work for me. I realise that he is playing multiple parts here, but it’s annoying that Dick Van Dyke from Mary Poppins is one of them. His vocals are also all over the place on this album. “Sing man, just sing!” I found myself shouting at several points. This is clearly going to crop up for me a lot in these reviews as weird vocalisations is one of my pet hates.
There’s some very nice acoustic guitar in “Horizons” and Tony Banks’ keyboards are excellent throughout.
“Supper’s Ready” – I know a lot of people love this, but I found it too much stop and start and not enough ebb and flow. I think that’s my main problem with this album – for all the good instrumental work, and I did enjoy a lot of it, there’s not quite enough rhythm or umph for my taste. But I’ve listened twice, and I could quite happily listen to this again, which is why I’ll give it 7/10.
A very theatrical album this one, which for me means that there’s good and bad.
“Get ‘Em Out by Friday” is a great example. There’s some brilliant music on show, those choppy organ parts are superb, and the track is generally well put together with lots of interesting changes. However, whilst I’m also a big fan of stories in a song, Peter Gabriel’s singing doesn’t work for me. I realise that he is playing multiple parts here, but it’s annoying that Dick Van Dyke from Mary Poppins is one of them. His vocals are also all over the place on this album. “Sing man, just sing!” I found myself shouting at several points. This is clearly going to crop up for me a lot in these reviews as weird vocalisations is one of my pet hates.
There’s some very nice acoustic guitar in “Horizons” and Tony Banks’ keyboards are excellent throughout.
“Supper’s Ready” – I know a lot of people love this, but I found it too much stop and start and not enough ebb and flow. I think that’s my main problem with this album – for all the good instrumental work, and I did enjoy a lot of it, there’s not quite enough rhythm or umph for my taste. But I’ve listened twice, and I could quite happily listen to this again, which is why I’ll give it 7/10.
Saddleworth2
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- 27 Jan 2014
- Messages
- 21,646
For vocals you will absolutely love ;-), you need to listen to 'the battle of epping forrest' from Selling England:Foxtrot - Genesis
A very theatrical album this one, which for me means that there’s good and bad.
“Get ‘Em Out by Friday” is a great example. There’s some brilliant music on show, those choppy organ parts are superb, and the track is generally well put together with lots of interesting changes. However, whilst I’m also a big fan of stories in a song, Peter Gabriel’s singing doesn’t work for me. I realise that he is playing multiple parts here, but it’s annoying that Dick Van Dyke from Mary Poppins is one of them. His vocals are also all over the place on this album. “Sing man, just sing!” I found myself shouting at several points. This is clearly going to crop up for me a lot in these reviews as weird vocalisations is one of my pet hates.
There’s some very nice acoustic guitar in “Horizons” and Tony Banks’ keyboards are excellent throughout.
“Supper’s Ready” – I know a lot of people love this, but I found it too much stop and start and not enough ebb and flow. I think that’s my main problem with this album – for all the good instrumental work, and I did enjoy a lot of it, there’s not quite enough rhythm or umph for my taste. But I’ve listened twice, and I could quite happily listen to this again, which is why I’ll give it 7/10.
"The Battle of Epping Forest" was inspired by a news story that Gabriel had read several years previously about the territorial battles by two rival gangs in the East End of London that would fight in Epping Forest.[14] He placed an advertisement in The Times and looked through library archives in attempt to find more about the story, but was unable to find any further information, so he created his own fictional characters, including "Liquid Len", "Harold Demure" and "The Bethnal Green Butcher".[14][35]
All sung in ten different voices (as far as I can count)!
Lyrics are an absolute hoot too.
In with a left hook is the Bethnal Green Butcher,
But he's countered on the right by Mick's chain-gang fight,
And Liquid Len, with his smashed bottle men,
Is lobbing Bob the Nob across the gob.
With his kissar in a mess, Bob seems under stress,
But Jones the Jug hits Len right in the mug;
And Harold Demure, who's still not quite sure,
Fires acorns from out of his sling.
(Here come the cavalry!)
Marklr
Well-Known Member
haha...love the Dick Van Dyke comparison made me laugh out loud.! I totally get you...maybe if i hadn't first heard it as a 12 year old, I'd be the same.Foxtrot - Genesis
A very theatrical album this one, which for me means that there’s good and bad.
“Get ‘Em Out by Friday” is a great example. There’s some brilliant music on show, those choppy organ parts are superb, and the track is generally well put together with lots of interesting changes. However, whilst I’m also a big fan of stories in a song, Peter Gabriel’s singing doesn’t work for me. I realise that he is playing multiple parts here, but it’s annoying that Dick Van Dyke from Mary Poppins is one of them. His vocals are also all over the place on this album. “Sing man, just sing!” I found myself shouting at several points. This is clearly going to crop up for me a lot in these reviews as weird vocalisations is one of my pet hates.
There’s some very nice acoustic guitar in “Horizons” and Tony Banks’ keyboards are excellent throughout.
“Supper’s Ready” – I know a lot of people love this, but I found it too much stop and start and not enough ebb and flow. I think that’s my main problem with this album – for all the good instrumental work, and I did enjoy a lot of it, there’s not quite enough rhythm or umph for my taste. But I’ve listened twice, and I could quite happily listen to this again, which is why I’ll give it 7/10.
Not bad at all.
Watcher of the skies I did not like the start but it got better as it went on.
Time Table.My favourite song on the album.
The rest okay but found some of the keyboards annoying.The start of Get em out by Friday I could picture Rick Wakeman guesting on stage and playing the intro for far too long
Then we end up with.Supper's Ready which I thought was awful until the last four minutes.
Does Gabriel sing every song in this.
If so I can see why Collins took over found them similar in a few tracks.
A lot better than I thought but still I will not be rushing back to listen to Genesis in the future.
5/10.
Watcher of the skies I did not like the start but it got better as it went on.
Time Table.My favourite song on the album.
The rest okay but found some of the keyboards annoying.The start of Get em out by Friday I could picture Rick Wakeman guesting on stage and playing the intro for far too long
Then we end up with.Supper's Ready which I thought was awful until the last four minutes.
Does Gabriel sing every song in this.
If so I can see why Collins took over found them similar in a few tracks.
A lot better than I thought but still I will not be rushing back to listen to Genesis in the future.
5/10.
FogBlueInSanFran
Well-Known Member
Foxtrot is aptly named -- there’s a lot -- and I mean a LOT -- of up and down in this record.
Let’s start with this: I don’t find much of Foxtrot to be rock and roll, which is fine. It’s prog pop, but rather than prog pop heavily influenced and sounding like classical music, the first half is prog pop heavily influenced by and sounding like jazz. To some extent I found that unique and winning, even if the idea is probably better in concept than execution.
Let’s pretend the unnecessary two-minute organ chord bashing exercise that opens “Watcher of the Skies” doesn’t exist, because it’s infuriating. After that, the band is jumpier and speedier than I expected relative to other Genesis. And rather than whomping away with the sledgehammer drums Phil Collins became known for (and that I don’t hate TBF), I hear some pretty remarkable dexterity which surprised me some. Quite listenable.
Likewise “Can-Utility” – the first two minutes just seem like aimless noodling. Then it moves into the acoustic guitar backed by strings and those splashy drums before finding a resting spot for Tony Banks organ, the expression of which should IMO be additive and in the background (or used in brief solos) rather than driving in the foreground (and why I’ve always been hugely annoyed by ELP).
But “Time Table” is the kind of Genesis that I’ve struggled with, the quiet lily-on-the-pond stuff that doesn’t really have a hook and definitionally has to lean on the vocals (which Gabriel isn’t capable of injecting emotion into here) and the lyrics (which don’t have an obviously interesting subject, at least to me). So it kind of tries to simulate beauty rather than actually being beautiful. Not my thing. Nor is “Get ‘Em Out By Friday”, which whistles along between slow tempo and uptempo and no tempo but honestly I just felt was confusing in both message and what it was trying to be sonically.
“Horizons” is a nice acoustic interlude (I never mind those), and then into the meat of “Supper’s Ready”, all 22+ minutes of it. It’s in parts wonderful, and parts unpleasant. I am not going to write out all the frankly ridiculous titles, but parts II and III are especially good, with Gabriel soaring into the chorus on II and Hackett suddenly blazing all over III. Part V feels a little Bowie-esque and a lot TV-program-for-kids-like and much more like what would come out of a Broadway musical (which I’m certain was intended). Part VI has that odd time signature and that organ morphs into a Yes-sy mish-mash which I didn’t mind as much as I usually would in this context, and then part VII returns to Gabriel and Hackett flying together to a great closing effect.
Of all the records we’ve gone through on both threads, I found this to be I think the most varied in quality in terms of parts I enjoyed vs. those I didn’t. You can hear what Gabriel would become, and what Genesis would become without him. None of this sticks in my ears the way the first quarter of “Lamb” does, nor the best songs on “Trick”, nor Gabriel’s best solo work. But there’s enough really good stuff to make it worth wading through the less interesting/more irritating parts. it's right down the middle, but because I liked the good bits more than I disliked the bad bits, I'll go 6/10.
Let’s start with this: I don’t find much of Foxtrot to be rock and roll, which is fine. It’s prog pop, but rather than prog pop heavily influenced and sounding like classical music, the first half is prog pop heavily influenced by and sounding like jazz. To some extent I found that unique and winning, even if the idea is probably better in concept than execution.
Let’s pretend the unnecessary two-minute organ chord bashing exercise that opens “Watcher of the Skies” doesn’t exist, because it’s infuriating. After that, the band is jumpier and speedier than I expected relative to other Genesis. And rather than whomping away with the sledgehammer drums Phil Collins became known for (and that I don’t hate TBF), I hear some pretty remarkable dexterity which surprised me some. Quite listenable.
Likewise “Can-Utility” – the first two minutes just seem like aimless noodling. Then it moves into the acoustic guitar backed by strings and those splashy drums before finding a resting spot for Tony Banks organ, the expression of which should IMO be additive and in the background (or used in brief solos) rather than driving in the foreground (and why I’ve always been hugely annoyed by ELP).
But “Time Table” is the kind of Genesis that I’ve struggled with, the quiet lily-on-the-pond stuff that doesn’t really have a hook and definitionally has to lean on the vocals (which Gabriel isn’t capable of injecting emotion into here) and the lyrics (which don’t have an obviously interesting subject, at least to me). So it kind of tries to simulate beauty rather than actually being beautiful. Not my thing. Nor is “Get ‘Em Out By Friday”, which whistles along between slow tempo and uptempo and no tempo but honestly I just felt was confusing in both message and what it was trying to be sonically.
“Horizons” is a nice acoustic interlude (I never mind those), and then into the meat of “Supper’s Ready”, all 22+ minutes of it. It’s in parts wonderful, and parts unpleasant. I am not going to write out all the frankly ridiculous titles, but parts II and III are especially good, with Gabriel soaring into the chorus on II and Hackett suddenly blazing all over III. Part V feels a little Bowie-esque and a lot TV-program-for-kids-like and much more like what would come out of a Broadway musical (which I’m certain was intended). Part VI has that odd time signature and that organ morphs into a Yes-sy mish-mash which I didn’t mind as much as I usually would in this context, and then part VII returns to Gabriel and Hackett flying together to a great closing effect.
Of all the records we’ve gone through on both threads, I found this to be I think the most varied in quality in terms of parts I enjoyed vs. those I didn’t. You can hear what Gabriel would become, and what Genesis would become without him. None of this sticks in my ears the way the first quarter of “Lamb” does, nor the best songs on “Trick”, nor Gabriel’s best solo work. But there’s enough really good stuff to make it worth wading through the less interesting/more irritating parts. it's right down the middle, but because I liked the good bits more than I disliked the bad bits, I'll go 6/10.
FogBlueInSanFran
Well-Known Member
I wrote mine before I read yours and we are so on the same page. I could make a colossally good Genesis mix tape/Spotify list with 1 out of every 3 Genesis songs, and I'd never miss the 2 of 3 I'd left out. Better would be the ability to lift the best 4 minute bits from the 8 minute songs.Foxtrot - Genesis
A very theatrical album this one, which for me means that there’s good and bad.
“Get ‘Em Out by Friday” is a great example. There’s some brilliant music on show, those choppy organ parts are superb, and the track is generally well put together with lots of interesting changes. However, whilst I’m also a big fan of stories in a song, Peter Gabriel’s singing doesn’t work for me. I realise that he is playing multiple parts here, but it’s annoying that Dick Van Dyke from Mary Poppins is one of them. His vocals are also all over the place on this album. “Sing man, just sing!” I found myself shouting at several points. This is clearly going to crop up for me a lot in these reviews as weird vocalisations is one of my pet hates.
There’s some very nice acoustic guitar in “Horizons” and Tony Banks’ keyboards are excellent throughout.
“Supper’s Ready” – I know a lot of people love this, but I found it too much stop and start and not enough ebb and flow. I think that’s my main problem with this album – for all the good instrumental work, and I did enjoy a lot of it, there’s not quite enough rhythm or umph for my taste. But I’ve listened twice, and I could quite happily listen to this again, which is why I’ll give it 7/10.
Saddleworth2
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- 27 Jan 2014
- Messages
- 21,646
Prog pop?Foxtrot is aptly named -- there’s a lot -- and I mean a LOT -- of up and down in this record.
Let’s start with this: I don’t find much of Foxtrot to be rock and roll, which is fine. It’s prog pop, but rather than prog pop heavily influenced and sounding like classical music, the first half is prog pop heavily influenced by and sounding like jazz. To some extent I found that unique and winning, even if the idea is probably better in concept than execution.
Let’s pretend the unnecessary two-minute organ chord bashing exercise that opens “Watcher of the Skies” doesn’t exist, because it’s infuriating. After that, the band is jumpier and speedier than I expected relative to other Genesis. And rather than whomping away with the sledgehammer drums Phil Collins became known for (and that I don’t hate TBF), I hear some pretty remarkable dexterity which surprised me some. Quite listenable.
Likewise “Can-Utility” – the first two minutes just seem like aimless noodling. Then it moves into the acoustic guitar backed by strings and those splashy drums before finding a resting spot for Tony Banks organ, the expression of which should IMO be additive and in the background (or used in brief solos) rather than driving in the foreground (and why I’ve always been hugely annoyed by ELP).
But “Time Table” is the kind of Genesis that I’ve struggled with, the quiet lily-on-the-pond stuff that doesn’t really have a hook and definitionally has to lean on the vocals (which Gabriel isn’t capable of injecting emotion into here) and the lyrics (which don’t have an obviously interesting subject, at least to me). So it kind of tries to simulate beauty rather than actually being beautiful. Not my thing. Nor is “Get ‘Em Out By Friday”, which whistles along between slow tempo and uptempo and no tempo but honestly I just felt was confusing in both message and what it was trying to be sonically.
“Horizons” is a nice acoustic interlude (I never mind those), and then into the meat of “Supper’s Ready”, all 22+ minutes of it. It’s in parts wonderful, and parts unpleasant. I am not going to write out all the frankly ridiculous titles, but parts II and III are especially good, with Gabriel soaring into the chorus on II and Hackett suddenly blazing all over III. Part V feels a little Bowie-esque and a lot TV-program-for-kids-like and much more like what would come out of a Broadway musical (which I’m certain was intended). Part VI has that odd time signature and that organ morphs into a Yes-sy mish-mash which I didn’t mind as much as I usually would in this context, and then part VII returns to Gabriel and Hackett flying together to a great closing effect.
Of all the records we’ve gone through on both threads, I found this to be I think the most varied in quality in terms of parts I enjoyed vs. those I didn’t. You can hear what Gabriel would become, and what Genesis would become without him. None of this sticks in my ears the way the first quarter of “Lamb” does, nor the best songs on “Trick”, nor Gabriel’s best solo work. But there’s enough really good stuff to make it worth wading through the less interesting/more irritating parts. it's right down the middle, but because I liked the good bits more than I disliked the bad bits, I'll go 6/10.
is that a new genre?
I have heard this album called many things but that’s a first for me. Kudos.
RobMCFC
Well-Known Member
Yeah, I was hovering between a 6 and a 7, but as I haven’t given any 7s, decided to be generous. There’s definitely some good stuff in there but it’s just so stop-start and in need of a good editor IMO.I wrote mine before I read yours and we are so on the same page. I could make a colossally good Genesis mix tape/Spotify list with 1 out of every 3 Genesis songs, and I'd never miss the 2 of 3 I'd left out. Better would be the ability to lift the best 4 minute bits from the 8 minute songs.