The British Monarchy

[bluethrunthru]

tweet of the day brings a bit of levity

 

[ROCKET80]

That’s where my perception of Britishness always takes me.
My perception is that British/Monarchy/Military and Empire are all so intrinsically and historically linked and all this pageantry that you revel in, is basically telling the world your story and particularly your importance globally.

I think this is why, from the outside it is looked on with admiration for the show you put on but equally a slight repulsion, not for the history that it represents to certain ex colonies, but perhaps how still, a majority of your citizens drink it in and seem to long for that place in the world again.
This perception while the reality of what is happening in Britain at the moment seems quite different, looking in.

I have great respect for how your Queen performed her stately duties and wouldn’t have a bad word to say in her own thread. I think that respect has been shown from every party on the island of Ireland. Sinn Fein have surprised me in how they have conducted themselves. You get the feeling that their is a genuine respect for her part in trying to secure a peaceful future for the island as a whole.
My own feeling on why, is perhaps the example she showed as a statesman, particularly in the 2011 visit. But this thread is not about her per-say, it the wider issue of the monarchy and it’s future.

Some of the ideas I have in my head might be best suited to the Irish political thread, but suffice to say that as far as Britishness goes, rightly or wrongly, the monarchy still carries a military enforcement weight on it’s shoulders over here, for many.
Royal pageantry is wrapped up in military display.

Very good post.

In my experience as a Brit living abroad, your perception of British/Monarchy/Military and Empire being intrinsically and historically linked is shared around the world, especially for indigenous populations in former British colonies.

You're again right about the pomp and ceremony, everyone loves a good spectacle. The wealth and privilege on show is found repugnant knowing how that wealth was gained, and how it is maintained whilst a lot of the population are struggling.

Very few people knew the Queen personally, and we'll never know her true thoughts on anything. One thing that cannot be questioned is the respect world leaders had for her. I don't think Charles will command that level of respect.

With the UK's reputation on the world stage having been seriously damaged with Brexit, Boris, and the current government, perhaps the 'national grief' on show is more to do with her death signaling an end of an era and a realisation of the UKs current standing in the world.

 

[oldius]

Very good post.

In my experience as a Brit living abroad, your perception of British/Monarchy/Military and Empire being intrinsically and historically linked is shared around the world, especially for indigenous populations in former British colonies.

You're again right about the pomp and ceremony, everyone loves a good spectacle. The wealth and privilege on show is found repugnant knowing how that wealth was gained, and how it is maintained whilst a lot of the population are struggling.

Very few people knew the Queen personally, and we'll never know her true thoughts on anything. One thing that cannot be questioned is the respect world leaders had for her. I don't think Charles will command that level of respect.

With the UK's reputation on the world stage having been seriously damaged with Brexit, Boris, and the current government, perhaps the 'national grief' on show is more to do with her death signaling an end of an era and a realisation of the UKs current standing in the world.

We have no idea of the respect world leaders had for her. Many were present: imagine if they didn't show. Many said nice things: imagine if their words were harsh.
Celebrities awash with tears for someone they didn't know - it is, IMO, utterly ridiculous, but many buy it because they want to, not because they have any dose of reality or objectivity about it.

 

[oldius]

While the nation burns?

You don't sound ambivalent you sound downright angry, just watch the telly and put your fist down, nearly everyone else has.

I was speaking metaphorically, of course.
I am ambivalent about the monarchy, yes: I have no idea whether we would be better as a republic, or not.
I am not ambivalent about the 'compulsory' national feeling: not everybody is grieving; swathes of the nation are not weeping; many will watch for the spectacle, or because the airways have been taken over and nearly every shop, cafe, restaurant, sporting event, cinema or theatre has been closed - a PR exercise shaped by the fear of judgement should they open. I think it was Noam Chomsky that described it as 'manufactured consent'.

 

[Gray]

I was speaking metaphorically, of course.
I am ambivalent about the monarchy, yes: I have no idea whether we would be better as a republic, or not.
I am not ambivalent about the 'compulsory' national feeling: not everybody is grieving; swathes of the nation are not weeping; many will watch for the spectacle, or because the airways have been taken over and nearly every shop, cafe, restaurant, sporting event, cinema or theatre has been closed - a PR exercise shaped by the fear of judgement should they open. I think it was Noam Chomsky that described it as 'manufactured consent'.

There is one thing for certain, the spectacle yesterday was a far better watch than the premier league games I endured over the previous three days.

 

[Grassland Blue]

And yet in 6 weeks when the cold weather crisis hits and the NHS is overwhellmed no one will even think about this week, well except bbcredbutton who will probably have it on repeat still.


These greatest experiences soon fade when the next one comes along or a crisis hits.

I think the 'Agueroooo' moment shades it for me...
:- )

 

[oldius]

There is one thing for certain, the spectacle yesterday was a far better watch than the premier league games I endured over the previous three days.

I didn't watch one minute of it so I cannot comment, spectacle or not.

 

[Grassland Blue]

You have just hit the nail on the head, sadly some people are like sheep,
They see a lot of people waiting in line to look at something & they think "if I dont join that lot I might miss out" very much like the loo roll shortage in lock down, a lot of people panic buying loo rolls were only doing it because they saw other people doing it,
Its exactly how the old market traders used to drum up trade, get some mates to form a que at your stall & all of a sudden people think there must be something good, I better get in line otherwise I might miss out,
Human nature is a strange thing.

Was the run on baked beans a contributory factor towards the number of loo rolls sold?

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

It's hard for people to stop acting that way though, we're indoctrinated from birth to believe they are something special. Like cults and religions (she was the head of the CoE) it's hard to challenge a belief that has been instilled in you from an early age, even when faced with evidence to the contrary.

There are some similarities between the reactions of the UK media and some of the population, with what we saw in North Korea when Kim Jong-il died.

You should be able to criticise the Catholic Church on the day the Pope dies, regardless if it offends Catholics, and you should be able to question the point of monarchy on the day the head of that institution dies, even if it offends monarchists.

Would you like people publicly slagging your mum when she dies. The answer to that question is clearly no. You would want them to pay respect or at the very minimum stay silent, why is that so hard for you and others to do?

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

We have no idea of the respect world leaders had for her. Many were present: imagine if they didn't show. Many said nice things: imagine if their words were harsh.
Celebrities awash with tears for someone they didn't know - it is, IMO, utterly ridiculous, but many buy it because they want to, not because they have any dose of reality or objectivity about it.

I don't know 11 blokes who kick a ball arround in East Manchester every two weeks, but I have a very strong afinity to them. I also cried when another bloke I don't know scored a goal on 93.20. Never met the chap, bizarre isn't it. ?