The British Monarchy

domalino said:
She’s British with Caribbean and African heritage, what part of this are you struggling with? She literally spelled it out in the original conversation.

You don’t get to claim her African heritage is fake because it goes back more than one generation - a standard never used by anyone before because it’s so stupid- and the fact a random Ghanaian twitter user says she’s not African doesn’t contradict her because she’s never claimed to be - although it’s interesting you didn’t quote the bit where that twitter poster says the interrogation was completely inappropriate.

I do find it interesting that the 2 people most desperate to argue with Fulani’s complaint about Hussey are a guy who says it can’t be racist because Fulani isn’t really African and the other says it can’t be true because he (and no one actually present) thinks she must be lying about the conversation - presumably because if it did happen as reported it’s obviously inappropriate and racist.

And you both also keep complaining about me replying to your replies.
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You’re very good at pointing out things that people understand, not just in this thread but across the board in general. The trouble is that the thing you highlight changes with every post, without of course any acknowledgment that your earlier posts were inaccurate and disingenuous (such as claiming I refused to believe Fulani was British). I really don’t see the point in conversing with you given this pattern of your behaviour.

I’m happy for you if you believe that befriending a particular dance group is proof of heritage. I’m also happy for you if you believe that somebody who (after teaming up with said dance group) chooses to change her name from Marlene Headley to Ngozi Fulani - and dresses as she does - isn’t giving anyone any reason to believe that she may possibly be from an African family. Needless to say, I’m also happy if you believe that somebody can remember every single word of a longish conversation, and be able to produce an exact, 100% accurate transcript - with all the correct emphasis and changes of tone - the following day. Furthermore, I’m chuffed if you think that Fulani’s past comments about the royal family are completely irrelevant to the whole episode.

But, most of all, I’d just be happy to ignore you from now on.
 
mancity2012_eamo said:
And remind me again, what is British?
Is it being born on the island of Britain? Was it being born within the empire? Ever?
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Up to the individual I suppose. If it says it in your (only) passport then it's a legal fact. Within that though there will be many folk that regard themselves as Scottish, Welsh, Irish, English or even European. Then there will be a lot of 1st/2nd generation British that may still feel they come from/belong somewhere else. Outside of the legal need for a passport to travel I don't suppose it matters what an individual decides to define themselves. Some struggle to pick from a couple of genders so with 195 countries to choose from this could get complicated.
 
Brewster's millions said:
I’m also happy if you believe that somebody can remember every single word of a longish conversation, and be able to produce an exact, 100% accurate transcript - with all the correct emphasis and changes of tone - the following day
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The Palace haven’t disputed the transcript, and most importantly neither has Hussey herself. But you continually are, which seems a little odd.
 
Ric said:
She was born and raised in London, and considers herself British so that will do for me.
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Ric , you are totally missing the point..I was born in Manchester but have a strange surname, foreign parents. I regard myself as English.
I take no offence from people asking me of my heritage. Just explain how that is deemed indecent ?
 
Berts Neck said:
Ric , you are totally missing the point..I was born in Manchester but have a strange surname, foreign parents. I regard myself as English.
I take no offence from people asking me of my heritage. Just explain how that is deemed indecent ?
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With the greatest respect mate, I feel like you’re maybe missing the point. If she’d just asked about Fulani’s heritage there wouldn’t have been an issue. It was the persistent, inappropriate nature of the questioning that caused the problem. Have you read the full transcript?
 
HelloCity said:
Seems like it could be a bot account.

Lots of far right tweets going back.

90% of the tweet history is attacking transsexuals as well.
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Not sure the tweet is quite the gotcha it purports itself to be either. Fulani has been pretty open about her nationality and ancestry. It's not uncommon for people of Caribbean descent to want to explore and connect with their African-ness. And it isn't their fault that they've been robbed of their history or a clear idea of precisely where their ancestors are from. Sometimes they have to fill in the gaps themselves but if she's chosen a West African name for herself then that tracks given that's where most slaves that ended up in the Carribbean came from.

Also ironic that that twitter account seems to have a lot say about women's rights but then comes out with loads of needlessly mean spirited comments about how Fulani dresses (calling her cheap etc). Then again, we all know that Terfs aren't really that bothered about other women or gay people. They're just bothered about pushing their own bigoted agenda.
 
Rascal said:
........................

The RW media have a lot to lose here, there vitriolic campaign against Meghan could be proved a lie, Hence the attempts by the RW to discredit the Lady who was questioned about where she was from, and the support given to Lady in Waiting.

I know this is supposition but reading Fumbs post before had me thinking as to what reason behind this furore could there possibly be.

Of course, I might be wrong and talking bollox
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The vitriolic campaign against Meghan has been shown to be lies on many occasions.
They have repeatedly praised Kate Middleton for doing certain things yet criticised Meghan for similar actions.
 
Ric said:
She was born and raised in London, and considers herself British so that will do for me.
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Ric, I may come across as flippant, but in general, genuinely, what is and was British?
I’ve asked this many times to many people who are or claim to be British and the goalposts seem to move. It’s a moveable feast it seems. It means different things to different people.
 
mancity2012_eamo said:
Ric, I may come across as flippant, but in general, genuinely, what is and was British?
I’ve asked this many times to many people who are or claim to be British and the goalposts seem to move. It’s a moveable feast it seems. It means different things to different people.
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It meaning different things to different people is surely different to moving the goalposts? The latter implies the same person saying different things at different times, not different people having different opinions.

Clearly there's a legal answer, where anyone who's a British Citizen is British, but for many people it's probably more complicated. Many of us in Manchester will know British Citizens who were born in this country, who consider themselves Irish. I think "different things to different people" is why it's pointless trying to define it.

I remember a program years ago where a racist was explaining that you had to be able to trace your lineage back through multiple generations (some argue as far as the Anglo-Saxons) to be truly British. They did try to move the goalposts when a little research showed that genetically their ancestors were definitely not local :)
 
bluenova said:
It meaning different things to different people is surely different to moving the goalposts? The latter implies the same person saying different things at different times, not different people having different opinions.

Clearly there's a legal answer, where anyone who's a British Citizen is British, but for many people it's probably more complicated. Many of us in Manchester will know British Citizens who were born in this country, who consider themselves Irish. I think "different things to different people" is why it's pointless trying to define it.

I remember a program years ago where a racist was explaining that you had to be able to trace your lineage back through multiple generations (some argue as far as the Anglo-Saxons) to be truly British. They did try to move the goalposts when a little research showed that genetically their ancestors were definitely not local :)
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The legal answer is the only answer. The rest is just culture. Myself and someone of Indian or Carribean heritage will be British in documents because we were born on the same island but not in culture or the environment in which we were brought up.

I could have been born and brought up in Spain but if my culture and environment is British I will have considered myself British and not Spanish.
 
Mon Autre said:
Not sure the tweet is quite the gotcha it purports itself to be either. Fulani has been pretty open about her nationality and ancestry. It's not uncommon for people of Caribbean descent to want to explore and connect with their African-ness. And it isn't their fault that they've been robbed of their history or a clear idea of precisely where their ancestors are from. Sometimes they have to fill in the gaps themselves but if she's chosen a West African name for herself then that tracks given that's where most slaves that ended up in the Carribbean came from.

Also ironic that that twitter account seems to have a lot say about women's rights but then comes out with loads of needlessly mean spirited comments about how Fulani dresses (calling her cheap etc). Then again, we all know that Terfs aren't really that bothered about other women or gay people. They're just bothered about pushing their own bigoted agenda.
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My oh my!

The Fulani is a nomadic tribe that roams the Sahel, too far north to be sucked very much into the slave trade. I've met them, they're incredible people, fiercely independent and staggeringly striking....

657152uTSMz9HB.jpg


They sharpen their teeth, did you know that?

Ngozi, on the other hand, is an Igbo name from the south east of Nigeria, about 1,000 km from the Sahel, you know? Biafra? The Biafran war? Lieutenant-Colonel Ujukwu? ring any bells?

Of course not

One of my best mates is an Igbo. You know any Igbo? Fulani? You know where Nigeria is? Or Ghana?

Know anything about the golden age of Nigerian music from the 70's?





Of course not.

The Igbo...

samson-ejim-photo-1-768x509.jpg


Lovely people.

I'm tired of catering to idiots like you.

The really perverse thing is you think you're being oh so politically correct, yet when it comes to African history, culture, anything really, you know sweet Fanny Adams about fuck all.

Oh, by the way, could you be any more patronising?...

it isn't their fault that they've been robbed of their history or a clear idea of precisely where their ancestors are from. Sometimes they have to fill in the gaps themselves but if she's chosen a West African name for herself
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Why do you talk about black Britons as if they're children? Do you do this in real life?

Believe me, don't believe me, I couldn't give a flying fuck, but if a pasty faced fat fucker from Salford knows this, there's no reason on earth why Marlene Headley doesn't.
 
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bluenova said:
It meaning different things to different people is surely different to moving the goalposts? The latter implies the same person saying different things at different times, not different people having different opinions.

Clearly there's a legal answer, where anyone who's a British Citizen is British, but for many people it's probably more complicated. Many of us in Manchester will know British Citizens who were born in this country, who consider themselves Irish. I think "different things to different people" is why it's pointless trying to define it.

I remember a program years ago where a racist was explaining that you had to be able to trace your lineage back through multiple generations (some argue as far as the Anglo-Saxons) to be truly British. They did try to move the goalposts when a little research showed that genetically their ancestors were definitely not local :)
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Fair point in the first paragraph.
However as you explain yourself later, you ask this question and people do tend to trip themselves up depending on their own viewpoint or perhaps prejudices.

I’m genuinely not trying to be obstreperous in a British forum but it’s something I’ve never got my head around.
I mean, were my grandparents British because they were born in a pre Republic Ireland. Were they considered so by English people. Did they consider themselves so.?
My own father was born pre the Republic, my mother just after it.

Britishness never entered the conversation over here. It’s something we don’t consider, we see ourselves as very different but 100 years ago were we considered so by mainland Britain.
 
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Ric said:
The Palace haven’t disputed the transcript, and most importantly neither has Hussey herself. But you continually are, which seems a little odd.
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is that the transcript you posted a few pages back. Is that the full conversation?
 
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