PannickAtTheDisco
Well-Known Member
I wasn't blaming, I was pointing out that pushing individualism is distinctly liberal and Conservatives, whilst enjoying free market thinking, only really jumped on the individualist bandwagon because it creates commercial opportunities. If Liberals balanced individual freedoms with responsibility and accountability for those freedoms we may have ended up with a more productive, inclusive society, but it's been allowed to run unabated and we are where we are. That's not blaming, just a commentary on where it's gone.If these Liberals stop pushing for these liberties, do we see the end of capitalist exploitation? Or are you blaming capitalist exploitation on those who have been exploited, that's a bit like blaming a girl if she is raped.
Social norms change over time, it was a social norm in Ancient Rome to take male and female lovers, it was a social norm under feudalism for the Lord of the manor to treat his subjects as minions. 50 years ago it was a social norm that women stayed at home and men went to work, it is a social norm now that all people are expected to work (unless you are rich)
Biological norms, Liberals like to push their agenda on inclusivity of otherwise no specific norms on to others whose idea's of norms differ to there own, how that makes them ripe for capitalist exploitation is debatable i suppose but is it provable because capitalist exploitation would occur anyway, as that is how capitalism works, it is exploitative by nature and i see it more as a social issue than an economic issue, but its an interesting point you make and one well worth consideration.
Thankfully as a Socialist I am of the mind to push for the collective rights rather than individual freedoms, because if one person is free at the expanse of all the others then it is not freedom, it is libertarian selfishness.
As you say, it's a social norm everyone goes to work now because capitalism has monetised women's rights for the worse, not the better. Same with a raft of other good ideas that weren't given the proper checks and balances to preserve traditional structures that were there to protect people, protect society and communities and stop the situation we're in from happening. Yes, capitalism has exploited those barriers being torn down but in reality the barriers should have been carefully re-arranged with more forethought, not torn down. Tearing down only leads to more persecution in so many cases.
In the same way women's rights have been exploited, we have removed basic biological certainty through social constructs and that creates uncertainty, polarisation which again is exploitative. We have private clinics transitioning children at far too young an age and profiteering from it, and political commentators from both sides making a killing from being on either side of such a debate. Again, the only winner is the one making money off both sides. Another unchecked, poorly thought out though if carefully considered, reasonable progression in society to be more tolerant. What we have now is entirely different.
It's an ever increasingly selfish society, all about hustle, individualism and bettering oneself at the expense of pretty much all else. If even I can come to the table and advocate that society would be better with collective restraints then something is tangibly amiss with the way we're developing.
There's a lot of money to be made, but the tensions, disparities and polarisations are only going to get worse, not better, as more and more people get fucked by the direction we're heading unchecked.