The General Election Thread

[malg]

The fact that this thread is 450 pages long and so much abuse has bed bandied about tells me that this government have been very very divisive

Left v Right, religion, barms, Phil Collins RIP, oh and Morrissey, always make for long threads, regardless of who the incumbent government are!

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

The fact that this thread is 450 pages long and so much abuse has bed bandied about tells me that this government have been very very divisive

This is exactly what I was alluding to. In a fucking nutshell.

If you mixed with right-wing people in any meaningful sense you would understand their deep held feelings about the last Labour government in terms of immigration, and financial mismanagement in particular. Many of them are terrified about Labour getting into power. And there's plenty of them, even if you possibly don't encounter them too frequently. In that sense, that government was every bit as "divisive" as this one. You cannot appreciate this because you (seemingly) are incapable of viewing the world outside your own prism.

The notion that this country has ever been united, politically or socially, is utterly farcical. On that basis, every government is very, very divisive.

 

[blueinsa]

I will say it again. all politicians are cunts!

One day, all blues will unite behind this message and we can get back to loving one another again and hating Rags!

 

[whp.blue]

The fact that this thread is 450 pages long and so much abuse has bed bandied about tells me that this government have been very very divisive

This is exactly what I was alluding to. In a fucking nutshell.

If you mixed with right-wing people in any meaningful sense you would understand their deep held feelings about the last Labour government in terms of immigration, and financial mismanagement in particular. Many of them are terrified about Labour getting into power. And there's plenty of them, even if you possibly don't encounter them too frequently. In that sense, that government was every bit as "divisive" as this one. You cannot appreciate this because you (seemingly) are incapable of viewing the world outside your own prism.

The notion that this country has ever been united, politically or socially, is utterly farcical. On that basis, every government is very, very divisive.

spot on
added to the fact that any subject that makes you take a polarized stance will always lead to strong feelings and views that inevitably lead to some form of abuse being dished out especially on an internet forum.

 

[malg]

Nick Clegg has said he'd refuse to join a coalition with any party that didn't agree to raise public sector pay. That puts paid to any Conservative coalition government then! Unless of course they can get the SNP into bed......?

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Unless of course they can get the SNP into bed......?

I find myself strangely attracted to Nicola Sturgeon now you mention it.

 

[malg]

Unless of course they can get the SNP into bed......?

I find myself strangely attracted to Nicola Sturgeon now you mention it.

 

[malg]

From Private Eye (it's great having an Aussie so interested in our politics!):


THE Dirty Digger is close to apoplexy about Labour’s threat to force him to sell off titles. Last week an unnamed Murdoch executive told the Independent that on a recent visit to the Sun the proprietor berated hacks for not doing more to stop a Labour victory: “He basically said the future of the company was at stake and they need to get their act together.”

Since its bollocking the Sun has obediently pumped out warnings that a minority Miliband government backed by the SNP will be a disaster. Under the screaming headline “Tartan Peril”, it claimed the SNP’s “far-left” agenda would “wreck the economy”. To reinforce the point, it showed Nicola Sturgeon dressed in a tartan bikini with her legs wrapped round a Miley Cyrus wrecking ball.

 

[Lucky13]

The fact that this thread is 450 pages long and so much abuse has bed bandied about tells me that this government have been very very divisive

I see it as a healthy sign that people actually care about how the Country is run and will happily argue the point.

I was expecting a boring GE, it hasn't been and I don't think Thursday will be the end of it.

 

[whp.blue]

Unless of course they can get the SNP into bed......?

I find myself strangely attracted to Nicola Sturgeon now you mention it.

That is so wrong on so many levels you may actually need professional assistance to resolve those sort of issues

 

[Damocles]

Nick Clegg has said he'd refuse to join a coalition with any party that didn't agree to raise public sector pay. That puts paid to any Conservative coalition government then! Unless of course they can get the SNP into bed......?

Nick Clegg is going to lose his own seat so wouldn't put much stock in anything that he says

 

[law74]

The fact that this thread is 450 pages long and so much abuse has bed bandied about tells me that this government have been very very divisive

This is exactly what I was alluding to. In a fucking nutshell.

If you mixed with right-wing people in any meaningful sense you would understand their deep held feelings about the last Labour government in terms of immigration, and financial mismanagement in particular. Many of them are terrified about Labour getting into power. And there's plenty of them, even if you possibly don't encounter them too frequently. In that sense, that government was every bit as "divisive" as this one. You cannot appreciate this because you (seemingly) are incapable of viewing the world outside your own prism.

The notion that this country has ever been united, politically or socially, is utterly farcical. On that basis, every government is very, very divisive.

Far from viewing the world in my own prism, I take on board the thoughts of friends from the right, including the landlord of my local who i played cricket with from we were in the under 15's together, my cousin who owns the local butcher's and a couple of mates that work in banking, though from my experiences in life, I believe that all contribute to the society we live in, and while inequality is inescapable, the level of inequality needs addressed.
I do not believe that immigration was the cause of the economic global meltdown, and know personally of companies that recruited actively abroad as it helped them deflate their wage bill and boost profits, hardly a socialist ideal.
That new labour mismanaged the finances is down to them trying imho to be right wing and left at the same time (deregulation of the financial services sector, that the tories ridiculed for not going far enough) and failing to address tax evasion being the two biggest mistakes.
For what it is worth, I would raise corporation tax (and ensure it was collected) from the national and multi national chains, and use the increased revenue to help SME's, the people that recycle their profits in the society that provides those profits, rather than a shareholder from dear knows where, a largescale housing programme (idealy on brownfield sites) with the houses remaining in public ownership (thus reducing the hb bill), with stipulations that those contracted to build the properties must employ a number of apprentices (with the numbers reducing as the apprentices become time served), thus reducing the number of NEEP's, youth unemployment, disenfranchisement and mental health issues that come with youth unemployment. This i believe if organised correctly could be cost neutral (at worst) within 10 - 15 years, and would also halt the ever rising cost of property, enabling first time buyers to get a foot on the ladder as the buy to let market becomes less lucrative

 

[whp.blue]

Nick Clegg has said he'd refuse to join a coalition with any party that didn't agree to raise public sector pay. That puts paid to any Conservative coalition government then! Unless of course they can get the SNP into bed......?

Nick Clegg is going to lose his own seat so wouldn't put much stock in anything that he says

I really hope you are right I would pmsl
The price of his treachery kicked out on his arse seems a fair conclusion to me

 

[law74]

From Private Eye (it's great having an Aussie so interested in our politics!):


THE Dirty Digger is close to apoplexy about Labour’s threat to force him to sell off titles. Last week an unnamed Murdoch executive told the Independent that on a recent visit to the Sun the proprietor berated hacks for not doing more to stop a Labour victory: “He basically said the future of the company was at stake and they need to get their act together.”

Since its bollocking the Sun has obediently pumped out warnings that a minority Miliband government backed by the SNP will be a disaster. Under the screaming headline “Tartan Peril”, it claimed the SNP’s “far-left” agenda would “wreck the economy”. To reinforce the point, it showed Nicola Sturgeon dressed in a tartan bikini with her legs wrapped round a Miley Cyrus wrecking ball.

And the Scottish Sun give the same "tartan peril" full support.......

 

[whp.blue]

From Private Eye (it's great having an Aussie so interested in our politics!):


THE Dirty Digger is close to apoplexy about Labour’s threat to force him to sell off titles. Last week an unnamed Murdoch executive told the Independent that on a recent visit to the Sun the proprietor berated hacks for not doing more to stop a Labour victory: “He basically said the future of the company was at stake and they need to get their act together.”

Since its bollocking the Sun has obediently pumped out warnings that a minority Miliband government backed by the SNP will be a disaster. Under the screaming headline “Tartan Peril”, it claimed the SNP’s “far-left” agenda would “wreck the economy”. To reinforce the point, it showed Nicola Sturgeon dressed in a tartan bikini with her legs wrapped round a Miley Cyrus wrecking ball.

In all fairness what do you expect them to do If the CEO or Owner of your company told you what he wanted from your company would you go against his wishes?

I can't stand The Sun but you can't blame them for this FFS

 

[Lucky13]

Unless of course they can get the SNP into bed......?

I find myself strangely attracted to Nicola Sturgeon now you mention it.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

The fact that this thread is 450 pages long and so much abuse has bed bandied about tells me that this government have been very very divisive

This is exactly what I was alluding to. In a fucking nutshell.

If you mixed with right-wing people in any meaningful sense you would understand their deep held feelings about the last Labour government in terms of immigration, and financial mismanagement in particular. Many of them are terrified about Labour getting into power. And there's plenty of them, even if you possibly don't encounter them too frequently. In that sense, that government was every bit as "divisive" as this one. You cannot appreciate this because you (seemingly) are incapable of viewing the world outside your own prism.

The notion that this country has ever been united, politically or socially, is utterly farcical. On that basis, every government is very, very divisive.

Far from viewing the world in my own prism, I take on board the thoughts of friends from the right, including the landlord of my local who i played cricket with from we were in the under 15's together, my cousin who owns the local butcher's and a couple of mates that work in banking, though from my experiences in life, I believe that all contribute to the society we live in, and while inequality is inescapable, the level of inequality needs addressed.
I do not believe that immigration was the cause of the economic global meltdown, and know personally of companies that recruited actively abroad as it helped them deflate their wage bill and boost profits, hardly a socialist ideal.
That new labour mismanaged the finances is down to them trying imho to be right wing and left at the same time (deregulation of the financial services sector, that the tories ridiculed for not going far enough) and failing to address tax evasion being the two biggest mistakes.
For what it is worth, I would raise corporation tax (and ensure it was collected) from the national and multi national chains, and use the increased revenue to help SME's, the people that recycle their profits in the society that provides those profits, rather than a shareholder from dear knows where, a largescale housing programme (idealy on brownfield sites) with the houses remaining in public ownership (thus reducing the hb bill), with stipulations that those contracted to build the properties must employ a number of apprentices (with the numbers reducing as the apprentices become time served), thus reducing the number of NEEP's, youth unemployment, disenfranchisement and mental health issues that come with youth unemployment. This i believe if organised correctly could be cost neutral (at worst) within 10 - 15 years, and would also halt the ever rising cost of property, enabling first time buyers to get a foot on the ladder as the buy to let market becomes less lucrative

That's fair enough about your social circle and I shouldn't have been so presumptive, so apologies, but if you think that a left wing government would be any less divisive then you fail to appreciate what comprises this country's electorate. Why would a left wing government be any less divisive when around half the voting public could broadly be described as 'conservative'?

 

[whp.blue]

The fact that this thread is 450 pages long and so much abuse has bed bandied about tells me that this government have been very very divisive

This is exactly what I was alluding to. In a fucking nutshell.

If you mixed with right-wing people in any meaningful sense you would understand their deep held feelings about the last Labour government in terms of immigration, and financial mismanagement in particular. Many of them are terrified about Labour getting into power. And there's plenty of them, even if you possibly don't encounter them too frequently. In that sense, that government was every bit as "divisive" as this one. You cannot appreciate this because you (seemingly) are incapable of viewing the world outside your own prism.

The notion that this country has ever been united, politically or socially, is utterly farcical. On that basis, every government is very, very divisive.

Far from viewing the world in my own prism, I take on board the thoughts of friends from the right, including the landlord of my local who i played cricket with from we were in the under 15's together, my cousin who owns the local butcher's and a couple of mates that work in banking, though from my experiences in life, I believe that all contribute to the society we live in, and while inequality is inescapable, the level of inequality needs addressed.
I do not believe that immigration was the cause of the economic global meltdown, and know personally of companies that recruited actively abroad as it helped them deflate their wage bill and boost profits, hardly a socialist ideal.
That new labour mismanaged the finances is down to them trying imho to be right wing and left at the same time (deregulation of the financial services sector, that the tories ridiculed for not going far enough) and failing to address tax evasion being the two biggest mistakes.
For what it is worth, I would raise corporation tax (and ensure it was collected) from the national and multi national chains, and use the increased revenue to help SME's, the people that recycle their profits in the society that provides those profits, rather than a shareholder from dear knows where, a largescale housing programme (idealy on brownfield sites) with the houses remaining in public ownership (thus reducing the hb bill), with stipulations that those contracted to build the properties must employ a number of apprentices (with the numbers reducing as the apprentices become time served), thus reducing the number of NEEP's, youth unemployment, disenfranchisement and mental health issues that come with youth unemployment. This i believe if organised correctly could be cost neutral (at worst) within 10 - 15 years, and would also halt the ever rising cost of property, enabling first time buyers to get a foot on the ladder as the buy to let market becomes less lucrative

As ever the left wing views whilst at first glance seem ideal they are very simplistic and you fail to see the negative consequences of what you are proposing.

I will raise just one point that you appeared to have missed.
Property prices have been rising for years (dips and troughs aside) and some working class people have invested in property with the expectation that the broadly rising prices would become their nest egg in years to come. A lot of the buy to let properties fall into this group.
If their is some great change in direction a huge collection of hard working people would have the financial security snatched away from them.
Added to the fact that during the first 10 - 15 years the costs would cause serious strains on the economy and that is not even getting into whether that time frame is remotely achievable.

 

[malg]

Nick Clegg has said he'd refuse to join a coalition with any party that didn't agree to raise public sector pay. That puts paid to any Conservative coalition government then! Unless of course they can get the SNP into bed......?

Nick Clegg is going to lose his own seat so wouldn't put much stock in anything that he says

I really hope you are right I would pmsl
The price of his treachery kicked out on his arse seems a fair conclusion to me

What treachery is this? Are you on about him going into a coalition with the party that won most seats?

 

[law74]

This is exactly what I was alluding to. In a fucking nutshell.

If you mixed with right-wing people in any meaningful sense you would understand their deep held feelings about the last Labour government in terms of immigration, and financial mismanagement in particular. Many of them are terrified about Labour getting into power. And there's plenty of them, even if you possibly don't encounter them too frequently. In that sense, that government was every bit as "divisive" as this one. You cannot appreciate this because you (seemingly) are incapable of viewing the world outside your own prism.

The notion that this country has ever been united, politically or socially, is utterly farcical. On that basis, every government is very, very divisive.

Far from viewing the world in my own prism, I take on board the thoughts of friends from the right, including the landlord of my local who i played cricket with from we were in the under 15's together, my cousin who owns the local butcher's and a couple of mates that work in banking, though from my experiences in life, I believe that all contribute to the society we live in, and while inequality is inescapable, the level of inequality needs addressed.
I do not believe that immigration was the cause of the economic global meltdown, and know personally of companies that recruited actively abroad as it helped them deflate their wage bill and boost profits, hardly a socialist ideal.
That new labour mismanaged the finances is down to them trying imho to be right wing and left at the same time (deregulation of the financial services sector, that the tories ridiculed for not going far enough) and failing to address tax evasion being the two biggest mistakes.
For what it is worth, I would raise corporation tax (and ensure it was collected) from the national and multi national chains, and use the increased revenue to help SME's, the people that recycle their profits in the society that provides those profits, rather than a shareholder from dear knows where, a largescale housing programme (idealy on brownfield sites) with the houses remaining in public ownership (thus reducing the hb bill), with stipulations that those contracted to build the properties must employ a number of apprentices (with the numbers reducing as the apprentices become time served), thus reducing the number of NEEP's, youth unemployment, disenfranchisement and mental health issues that come with youth unemployment. This i believe if organised correctly could be cost neutral (at worst) within 10 - 15 years, and would also halt the ever rising cost of property, enabling first time buyers to get a foot on the ladder as the buy to let market becomes less lucrative

As ever the left wing views whilst at first glance seem ideal they are very simplistic and you fail to see the negative consequences of what you are proposing.

I will raise just one point that you appeared to have missed.
Property prices have been rising for years (dips and troughs aside) and some working class people have invested in property with the expectation that the broadly rising prices would become their nest egg in years to come. A lot of the buy to let properties fall into this group.
If their is some great change in direction a huge collection of hard working people would have the financial security snatched away from them.
Added to the fact that during the first 10 - 15 years the costs would cause serious strains on the economy and that is not even getting into whether that time frame is remotely achievable.

The first aspect is that I believe that a house should be a home, not seen as an investment opportunity, why should my taxes pay for someone else to own two three or more properties?
in the past many people started with a small terraced house then as their family and income grew, so to did the size of their home, and when their family left home, they could downsize using the money to boost their pension, that i feel is "fair"
that the cost of the housing benefit bill needs adressed seems to be agreed by most, it is how we address the issue we disagree on