The General Election Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
TangerineSteve17 said:
whp.blue said:
TangerineSteve17 said:
Indeedio! and that is fair to you? Unless you are heartless it can't be. The poor pay the price.

No one ever said life is fair or easy?

Yes! it isn't. So what is the point? We're all sentient beings bouncing around.. the least we can do is try to make it as fair as poss.

Basically if you providing a service (whatever that may be) and you're being paid more than you're worth from the person receiving, - then you're a twat.

rubbish.

The receiver determines how much the provider is worth, because they either buy it, thus agreeing they value the service at that price, or they don't, and wait for it to become cheaper and reach a value they think it is worth.
 
Ducado said:
Bluemanc100 said:
TangerineSteve17 said:
Yes! it isn't. So what is the point? We're all sentient beings bouncing around.. the least we can do is try to make it as fair as poss.

Basically if you providing a service (whatever that may be) and you're being paid more than you're worth from the person receiving, - then you're a twat.

You are funny..... so basically you go out and charge less for your services than the competition.... that is your decision.

Flip this around for a second, you undercut a company who has to charge a higher rate than you, they can't find enough business to survive, they go bust

Now who's the twat....

The argument seems a little Noddy to me

Can you lot draw a line under this please and get back on topic
There's enough twats on this thread without introducing more!
 
Ducado said:
Bluemanc100 said:
TangerineSteve17 said:
Yes! it isn't. So what is the point? We're all sentient beings bouncing around.. the least we can do is try to make it as fair as poss.

Basically if you providing a service (whatever that may be) and you're being paid more than you're worth from the person receiving, - then you're a twat.

You are funny..... so basically you go out and charge less for your services than the competition.... that is your decision.

Flip this around for a second, you undercut a company who has to charge a higher rate than you, they can't find enough business to survive, they go bust

Now who's the twat....

The argument seems a little Noddy to me

Can you lot draw a line under this please and get back on topic

Sowwy.
 
The Independent want a Tory - Lib Dem coalition.

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/editorials/in-defence-of-liberal-democracy-10224221.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/edi ... 24221.html</a>
 
Lucky13 said:
The Independent want a Tory - Lib Dem coalition.

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/editorials/in-defence-of-liberal-democracy-10224221.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/edi ... 24221.html</a>

Unless they can invent 30 new seats before Thursday then it isn't happening.
 
Lucky13 said:
The Independant want a Tory - Lib Dem coalition.

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/editorials/in-defence-of-liberal-democracy-10224221.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/edi ... 24221.html</a>


The electoral system here surely has to change... in Germany I'm pretty sure that coalition is the only government possible

If we had the same system then it might stop the bitching and force the parties to work on policies that would complement each others....

Or have I missed something
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Here's something interesting I didn't even realise until today. Discussing the election with my sister in law the other day who said that the Coalition government had brought growth.

But checking the figures, growth at/just after the last election was actually quite strong at 2.5% in the third quarter of 2010. Austerity seems to have put the brakes on it and is still affecting it. You can't build a strong economy without strong wage growth and we're still not seeing that despite all the conditions supposedly being in place.


Are those figures adjusted for borrowing and QE? If not then the real position of GDP probably looks better for the Conservatives as the amount of borrowing and printing has been falling, albeit not by a huge amount, and Brown's economic disaster would look all the more calamitous.
 
Lucky13 said:
The Independent want a Tory - Lib Dem coalition.

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/editorials/in-defence-of-liberal-democracy-10224221.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/edi ... 24221.html</a>

This section is the worry if the polls are right:

"In office, but not in power

A hung parliament is certain this week. For all his talk of no deals with the SNP, Miliband is bound to rely on that party to get his legislative programme through. This would be a disaster for the country, unleashing justified fury in England at the decisive influence of MPs who – unlike this title – do not wish the Union to exist"
 
whp.blue said:
Ducado said:
I hope this is not true, as him loosing his seat would be the highlight of Election Night

ICM have conducted a poll for the Guardian in Sheffield Hallam, seat of Nick Clegg.

Nick Clegg is on course to be saved from defeat in his Sheffield Hallam constituency by a tide of tactical Tory votes, according to a special Guardian/ICM poll conducted in the deputy prime minister’s constituency.

The poll puts Clegg on 42%, seven points clear of his young Labour rival, Oliver Coppard, who is on 35%. Ian Walker, the candidate for the Conservatives , is on 12%.

But Clegg achieves his seven-point lead only because almost half the people (48%) who say their nationwide preference is for the Conservatives are planning to support the Lib Dem.

When ICM asked voters which party they would prefer if they put the local context and candidates out of mind, Labour is out ahead, on 34%, with the Lib Dems on 32% and the Conservatives on 21%.

Looks like Cleggs total capitulation to the Tories may pay off in the end then

mind you I agree it would be funny though

Would be funny if their votes got him elected and he went into a coalition with Labour
 
Very good piece in The Indy tonight:

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/editorials/in-defence-of-liberal-democracy-10224221.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/edi ... 24221.html</a>


A spectre is haunting Britain – the spectre of its own end. Five years ago British democracy entered a new era. There was endless gnashing of teeth at the prospect of a first peacetime coalition since the 1930s, but disaster has been avoided. To the credit of its members, a coalition formed in the interests of the country has governed competently. It leaves a country more indebted and less influential, but stable and growing. That masks the scale of the choice facing Britain this week. At stake is the very idea of majority government, the union with Scotland, and membership of the EU. In other words, British democracy itself.
You wouldn't have guessed that from a data-driven, negative, and deeply uninspiring campaign. New ideas have been in short supply; fear has been the tool of choice; and because of our outdated electoral system, two-thirds of voters have yet again been ignored. This is a betrayal of the British people. This title believes they deserve much better. The Independent was founded on the principle enshrined in its name. We honour that again today, by declaring that we belong to no party or faction, act without fear or favour, and know our readers are wise enough to make up their own minds. That is why we will not be telling you how to vote.
A question of authority
On the question of democracy, however, we are not and will never be neutral: we believe it is precious, and must be revitalised. It is clear that not only our democracy, but our kingdom, is in some peril. It may be thought perverse for a paper with a tinge of republicanism to defend a kingdom; but we believe the union with Scotland is mutually beneficial, and crucial at a time of rapid global change.

Britain has entered a long period of relative decline, as emerging powers such as China and India acquire greater influence. To splinter our country, either through Scottish independence or withdrawal from the EU, would be fatally stupid. Moreover, the reputation of politics, following the Iraq War, the expenses crisis, and the financial crash, has sunk to a rotten low; and whoever forms a government in the coming days must at all costs be legitimate. That is not a question merely of numbers and seats. Rather it is a question of authority, and the ability to reflect the temper of the people.
As believers in pluralism, we have given plenty of coverage to minor parties - three in particular. The Greens have been a disappointment, offering an alternative to austerity that is economically illiterate. Ukip have contributed important ideas on freedom, but are essentially at war with globalisation and modernity, both of which we welcome. The SNP is an agent of change, with impressive leaders in both Alex Salmond and Nicola Sturgeon. But they are a wrecking ball poised to hit Westminster and, unlike us, want to abolish Britain.

You wouldn't have guessed that from a data-driven, negative, and deeply uninspiring campaign. New ideas have been in short supply; fear has been the tool of choice; and because of our outdated electoral system, two-thirds of voters have yet again been ignored. This is a betrayal of the British people. This title believes they deserve much better. The Independent was founded on the principle enshrined in its name. We honour that again today, by declaring that we belong to no party or faction, act without fear or favour, and know our readers are wise enough to make up their own minds. That is why we will not be telling you how to vote.
A question of authority
On the question of democracy, however, we are not and will never be neutral: we believe it is precious, and must be revitalised. It is clear that not only our democracy, but our kingdom, is in some peril. It may be thought perverse for a paper with a tinge of republicanism to defend a kingdom; but we believe the union with Scotland is mutually beneficial, and crucial at a time of rapid global change.
PREVIOUS
Eddie Izzard labels nationalist protesters as 'violent' and...
NEXT
First-time buyers in London 'need to earn at least £77,000'
Britain has entered a long period of relative decline, as emerging powers such as China and India acquire greater influence. To splinter our country, either through Scottish independence or withdrawal from the EU, would be fatally stupid. Moreover, the reputation of politics, following the Iraq War, the expenses crisis, and the financial crash, has sunk to a rotten low; and whoever forms a government in the coming days must at all costs be legitimate. That is not a question merely of numbers and seats. Rather it is a question of authority, and the ability to reflect the temper of the people.
As believers in pluralism, we have given plenty of coverage to minor parties - three in particular. The Greens have been a disappointment, offering an alternative to austerity that is economically illiterate. Ukip have contributed important ideas on freedom, but are essentially at war with globalisation and modernity, both of which we welcome. The SNP is an agent of change, with impressive leaders in both Alex Salmond and Nicola Sturgeon. But they are a wrecking ball poised to hit Westminster and, unlike us, want to abolish Britain.
In pictures: Experts' predictions for the General Election - 03/05/15
1 of 10
Andrew Hawkins (ComRes)
Next
Andrew Hawkins (ComRes)Joe Twyman (YouGov)Ben Page (Ipsos MORI)Rick Nye (Populus)Nick Moon (GfK)Damian Lyons Lowe (Survation) Michelle Harrison (TNS)James Endersby (Opinium Research)Martin Boon (ICM) Lord Ashcroft (Lord Ashcroft Polls)

The main contenders
What of the main parties? Ed Miliband has had an impressive campaign. For several years, too, he has held the factions within Labour together, rightly highlighting inequality as a fundamental priority of the British people. He is clearly an economist who wants to use the state to break up monopolies and generate competition. Yet in key areas his policy prescriptions suggest a party unready for government. Tampering with tuition fees would harm universities while benefiting wealthy rather than poor students. Taxing property more is smart, but rent controls won’t work and a mansion tax is a centralising, blunt tool: much better to reform council tax instead. And though he is right not to flirt with leaving the EU, far too many businesses of all sizes fear Labour.
As for the Tories, an abiding irony of this parliament is that David Cameron, who wanted to be a social reformer, has been principally an economic reformer instead – with some success. Excessive austerity in the first phase of his reign, consistent failure to meet debt and deficit targets, and a worrying lack of productivity notwithstanding, Britain's economy is now growing reasonably well. Given the state of the Eurozone, creating two million mostly decent jobs is an exceptional achievement. Plans to create a northern powerhouse are also welcome.
This title has consistently argued that we would have liked much more to be done for the poor: the Institute for Fiscal Studies is clear they have fared worst since 2010. The young have been unfairly targeted to protect the old, the record on house-building is dire, and the NHS mismanaged. But, the economy aside, in one vital respect Tories deserve tremendous credit: a million more pupils are now at schools rated good or outstanding. This title cherishes education. Such success cannot be ignored.
Many of the good things the Coalition has done are owed to the Liberal Democrats. Nick Clegg may not personally recover from the tuition fees debacle, despite being right (eventually). But history will record him as the man who turned a party of protest into one of government. As a principled, effective politician who could hold another Coalition together, we hope he keeps his seat in Sheffield Hallam. He has confounded his Tory critics, held his party together, been a fine advertisement for a European kind of government, and championed the green agenda just as Tories abandoned it. On raising the income tax threshold, the pupil premium, early years learning and apprenticeships the Lib Dems have been a force for progress, and if he returns to government Mr Clegg should insist on being Education Secretary.
In office, but not in power
A hung parliament is certain this week. For all his talk of no deals with the SNP, Miliband is bound to rely on that party to get his legislative programme through. This would be a disaster for the country, unleashing justified fury in England at the decisive influence of MPs who – unlike this title – do not wish the Union to exist. If that were to be the case while Labour were the second biggest party either in terms of vote share, or seats – or both – how could Labour govern with authority? They could not. Any partnership between Labour and the SNP will harm Britain’s fragile democracy. For all its faults, another Lib-Con Coalition would both prolong recovery and give our kingdom a better chance of continued existence.
This title casts no vote. But we prize strong, effective government, consider nationalism guilty until proven innocent, and say that if the present Coalition is to get another chance, we hope it is much less conservative, and much more liberal.

-------------------------end-----------

Beats having that unwashed twat in support.
 
law74 said:
whp.blue said:
Ducado said:
I hope this is not true, as him loosing his seat would be the highlight of Election Night

Looks like Cleggs total capitulation to the Tories may pay off in the end then

mind you I agree it would be funny though

Would be funny if their votes got him elected and he went into a coalition with Labour
He'll go into coalition, if he has sufficient seats, with the largest party. Which won't be Labour if the polls are to be believed.
 
law74 said:
whp.blue said:
Ducado said:
I hope this is not true, as him loosing his seat would be the highlight of Election Night

Looks like Cleggs total capitulation to the Tories may pay off in the end then

mind you I agree it would be funny though

Would be funny if their votes got him elected and he went into a coalition with Labour

I could see that happening and with that in mind let labour win as the lib dems loosing their leader would be a price worth paying
 
Bluemanc100 said:
Had our local Independent candidate around for the second time tonight..... we've had a knock on the door from him and Labour so far... the others have simply pushed their leaflets through the door

I work from home and the wife is a lady of leisure these days so they haven't knocked

What is everybody else's experience of doorsteppers?

I've had two. Labour & UKIP.

There's a big sign on the porch saying "No Canvassers". Told them to fuck off.
 
Chancy Termites said:
Prestwich_Blue said:
Here's something interesting I didn't even realise until today. Discussing the election with my sister in law the other day who said that the Coalition government had brought growth.

But checking the figures, growth at/just after the last election was actually quite strong at 2.5% in the third quarter of 2010. Austerity seems to have put the brakes on it and is still affecting it. You can't build a strong economy without strong wage growth and we're still not seeing that despite all the conditions supposedly being in place.


Are those figures adjusted for borrowing and QE? If not then the real position of GDP probably looks better for the Conservatives as the amount of borrowing and printing has been falling, albeit not by a huge amount, and Brown's economic disaster would look all the more calamitous.
It's GDP - a measure of physical production/income/expenditure. Nothing to do with QE or borrowing. The only adjustment is in calculating Real GDP, which compares actual GDP to prices. Interestingly in the last three recessions before this, Real GDP has returned to pre-recession levels within 3 years and has been about 7-10% higher after 5 years.

In this one, we were still at less than 97% of 2008 Q1 levels after 5 years. And that's in an era of low inflation. In times like these, the government should be providing an economic stimulus but this one has really sucked the life out of the economy.
 
SWP's back said:
law74 said:
whp.blue said:
Looks like Cleggs total capitulation to the Tories may pay off in the end then

mind you I agree it would be funny though

Would be funny if their votes got him elected and he went into a coalition with Labour
He'll go into coalition, if he has sufficient seats, with the largest party. Which won't be Labour if the polls are to be believed.

Can't see it what about his principles?
 
whp.blue said:
SWP's back said:
law74 said:
Would be funny if their votes got him elected and he went into a coalition with Labour
He'll go into coalition, if he has sufficient seats, with the largest party. Which won't be Labour if the polls are to be believed.

Can't see it what about his principles?
Politicians don't have principles .
 
Cheesy said:
Bluemanc100 said:
Had our local Independent candidate around for the second time tonight..... we've had a knock on the door from him and Labour so far... the others have simply pushed their leaflets through the door

I work from home and the wife is a lady of leisure these days so they haven't knocked

What is everybody else's experience of doorsteppers?

I've had two. Labour & UKIP.

There's a big sign on the porch saying "No Canvassers". Told them to fuck off.
Only had the sitting MP round so far and that was possibly because i have been ripping their policy to shreds on social media, to be fair to him, he answered my questions on a range of issues honestly and not just saying things to try and get my vote and accepted my reasons for not supporting him this time round.
 
Cheesy said:
Bluemanc100 said:
Had our local Independent candidate around for the second time tonight..... we've had a knock on the door from him and Labour so far... the others have simply pushed their leaflets through the door

I work from home and the wife is a lady of leisure these days so they haven't knocked

What is everybody else's experience of doorsteppers?

I've had two. Labour & UKIP.

There's a big sign on the porch saying "No Canvassers". Told them to fuck off.

I'd have dropped a bag of shit out of the upstairs window on them.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top