The Labour Government

[Pingu the Penguin]

Has anyone any idea why there's apparently a court order preventing Ange from revealing what a crook she is?

Seems rather convenient. I wonder if she applied for it?

And before people try to brush aside her rank hypocrisy as being "perfectly legal, nothing to see here", it transpires that putting your home into trust whilst allowing your under 18 kids to live there, may well be in the eyes of the HMRC still count as your home for stamp duty purposes, whether in a trust or not. I.e. she's guilty of tax evasion not avoidance, and may well be liable for the additional £40k plus penalties.

So surprised at Angela. Working class girl and has been really vocal about social justice and that those who can afford to pay their dues into the public purse. I dont get the sense she has done anything “wrong” but the hypocrisy of getting clever expensive tax advice to save a few bob certainly sticks in the craw a bit.

 

[Chippy_boy]

So surprised at Angela. Working class girl and has been really vocal about social justice and that those who can afford to pay their dues into the public purse. I dont get the sense she has done anything “wrong” but the hypocrisy of getting clever expensive tax advice to save a few bob certainly sticks in the craw a bit.

And for me, it reveals one of two things, either

(a) She is so fucking thick, she had no idea that this would look really bad,

or

(b) She knew it would look like it stinks and yet went ahead anyway because she doesn't give a shit.

I'm genuinely not sure which it is. It's baffling to me how any party (and I include the Tories in this) can allow their MPs to engage in things which OPTICALLY are so damaging for the party. If I were PM and especially after the freebies scandal last year, I would have been telling my ministers that if there's anything that appears even remotely dodgy going forward, then that cannot be tolerated they will be summarily fired without warning. Elections are won and lost on the back of things like this. Once a party's reputation for sleeze is established, it's very hard to shake off. Ask the Tories!

 

[Brewster's millions]

I'm not sure why I'm bothering but main residence for HMRC is usually a choice for anyone who owns more than one property, whereas council tax main residence is up to the local council to determine based on a whole raft of factors (based not on legislation but case law). Two councils might both claim your main residence is in their area - though that's less likely now as they will now get more council tax if it's not your main residence.

I'm frankly amazed at Tory MPs pushing this, as I'd be surprised at some of their property ownership. Farage hasn't jumped on this bandwagon, has he?

Inside Nigel Farage's £3m four home luxury property empire bought since Brexit

The self-styled man of the people has amassed a property portfolio worth almost £3million since the 2016 Brexit referendum. Our disclosures come after it was revealed that the Reform leader is earning around £700,000 a year outside Parliament

www.mirror.co.uk

Main residence for council tax purposes might be determined by case law, but the factors influencing the decision aren’t especially complex or abstract. Where do people spend most of their time, family ties, where are they registered to vote, where a person’s children attend school. Factors which make the suggestion that a flat in Hove is her main residence so ridiculous.

Also, I knew that Nigel Farage sets Labour Party policy these days, but I hadn’t realised that he was your ethics advisor as well.

 

[hilts]

Fuck off with the negatives you non believer. 17-18 year olds have got the biggest bumper pay rise ever in the history of mankind and the doctors aren’t on strike anymore…. Now go get you a Starmer flag to wave daily, like a chameleon it changes colour to blend in to whatever background it needs to.

You may laugh but I've just driven up to a roundabout outside Labour HQ and I didn't know if I should go left, go right or paint the fucker.

 

[Brewster's millions]

You may laugh but I've just driven up to a roundabout outside Labour HQ and I didn't know if I should go left, go right or paint the fucker.

Which way was the wind blowing?

 

[BobKowalski]

So surprised at Angela. Working class girl and has been really vocal about social justice and that those who can afford to pay their dues into the public purse. I dont get the sense she has done anything “wrong” but the hypocrisy of getting clever expensive tax advice to save a few bob certainly sticks in the craw a bit.

That’s a fair point. Politics is your prime job and everything you do has to be viewed through a political lens, irrespective of whether it is legal or not. Sometimes politicians have to ask themselves ‘how does this look?’ and then act accordingly.

Equally, there is something about Angela Rayner that drives certain people** insane with fury - it’s Greta Thunberg syndrome (GTS) - so whatever she does, no matter how innocuous, people melt into an emotional puddle that is totally at odds with the scale of the alleged offence.

** male, socially conservative, deeply insecure

 

[Chippy_boy]

This is madness. You've all lost it.

Just on number 4. £325k is the threshold for the value of the whole estate, which in Rayner's case now includes the only home she owns - and would anyway be based on valuations when she dies which you sick misogynists would no doubt welcome.

Incorrect. She valued it at £650k, which is the limit for capital gains tax relief for a couple passing a property on to their children when the property is not their primary residence. Had it been valued above £650k then IHT is payable immediately (which is what happens when you put something in a trust), either by her at 20% or by the trust at a higher rate. So for example, at £800k she'd have had to pay £30k in IHT, or the trust would have to pay £37,500k.

So by valuing it at exactly £650k she's avoided having to pay any IHT. How convenient.

Heather Powell, a property specialist at Blick Rothenberg: "Valuing the property at £650,000 is a remarkable coincidence. It's the nil-rate band for two people for inheritance tax purposes so I'm sure that was a very comfortable number to go in at and would have maximised the benefit for Angela."

And regards the other points I made, you think "you have all lost it" for calling foul about her rank hypocrisy? Bizarre.

 

[BobKowalski]

Incorrect. She valued it at £650k, which is the limit for capital gains tax relief for a couple passing a property on to their children when the property is not their primary residence. Had it been valued above £650k then IHT is payable immediately (which is what happens when you put something in a trust), either by her at 20% or by the trust at a higher rate. So for example, at £800k she'd have had to pay £30k in IHT, or the trust would have to pay £37,500k.

So by valuing it at exactly £650k she's avoided having to pay any IHT. How convenient.

Heather Powell, a property specialist at Blick Rothenberg: "Valuing the property at £650,000 is a remarkable coincidence. It's the nil-rate band for two people for inheritance tax purposes so I'm sure that was a very comfortable number to go in at and would have maximised the benefit for Angela."

And regards the other points I made, you think "you have all lost it" for calling foul about her rank hypocrisy? Bizarre.

So, all these properties - or this property is in a Trust?

 

[Chippy_boy]

So, all these properties - or this property is in a Trust?

The house in Ashton. She says she no longer owns it and has passed it on (valuing it at £650k) to her kids, in trust.

This comes after last year when the same steaming hypocrite who benefitted from a 25% discount on the purchase of her council flat, was arguing that the right to buy should be removed. She also has had some "interesting" behaviour previously regards which home she said she was living in.

She was registered on the electoral roll at her ex-council house in Vicarage Road for five years after she married in 2010. Despite them being newlyweds, her husband was listed elsewhere – a house in Lowndes Lane, just over a mile away, which had also been bought under the right-to-buy scheme. So double the trousering.

Yet when whe registered the births of her kids at the same time, she gave her address as Lowndes Lane. Voters are expected to register at their permanent home address, and lying about that can in theory lead to a prison sentence. Also, anyone buying a right-to-buy property signs a form confirming that it is their only or principal home.

Basically, in brief summary, she is dodgy as fuck.

 

[BobKowalski]

The house in Ashton. She says she no longer owns it and has passed it on (valuing it at £650k) to her kids, in trust.

This comes after last year when the same steaming hypocrite who benefitted from a 25% discount on the purchase of her council flat, was arguing that the right to buy should be removed. She also has had some "interesting" behaviour previously regards which home she said she was living in.

She was registered on the electoral roll at her ex-council house in Vicarage Road for five years after she married in 2010. Despite them being newlyweds, her husband was listed elsewhere – a house in Lowndes Lane, just over a mile away, which had also been bought under the right-to-buy scheme. So double the trousering.

Yet when whe registered the births of her kids at the same time, she gave her address as Lowndes Lane. Voters are expected to register at their permanent home address, and lying about that can in theory lead to a prison sentence. Also, anyone buying a right-to-buy property signs a form confirming that it is their only or principal home.

Basically, in brief summary, she is dodgy as fuck.

So, long story short, the house in question is in a Trust. My interest in this story was minimal at best and has now completely evaporated. A clear case of GTS. Nurse, please send in the next patient.

GTS Symptoms

Irrational rage when seeing/reading news featuring prominent women of a liberal persuasion - working class accent is an additional trigger.
Compulsion to vent on public forums or at random people in public.
Uncontrollable urge to shout out expletives at TV screen or other medium.
Excessive sweating, hot flushes and/or erectile dysfunction.
Irritable bowel.
Increased chance of divorce.

 

[Chippy_boy]

So, long story short, the house in question is in a Trust. My interest in this story was minimal at best and has now completely evaporated. A clear case of GTS. Nurse, please send in the next patient.

What a surprise.

Labour minister proves herself to be AT BEST a steaming hypocrite, and Marxist Bob's reaction? Nothing to see here.

Well blow me over.

I'll gloss over the fact that she may very well have committed fraud. But of course, that doesn't matter either. She's LABOUR.

 

[Hertzblue]

I'm not sure why I'm bothering but main residence for HMRC is usually a choice for anyone who owns more than one property (for Capital Gains Tax exemption, whereas the rules for the higher stamp duty are based on objective criteria (based on case law). The daft thing is the right wing press getting neighbours in Ashton to say they don't see her there much - which helps prove it's not her main residence! For council tax, main residence is up to the local council to determine based on a whole raft of factors (again based not on legislation but case law). Two councils might both claim your main residence is in their area - though that's less likely now as they will now get more council tax if it's not your main residence.

[I had to edit that to reflect that "main residence" can be different for different taxes. I'm not surprised it needs a tax specialist.]

I'm frankly amazed at Tory MPs pushing this, as I'd be surprised at some of their property ownership. Farage hasn't jumped on this bandwagon, has he?

Inside Nigel Farage's £3m four home luxury property empire bought since Brexit

The self-styled man of the people has amassed a property portfolio worth almost £3million since the 2016 Brexit referendum. Our disclosures come after it was revealed that the Reform leader is earning around £700,000 a year outside Parliament

www.mirror.co.uk

You cannot defend Big Ange by comparing her behaviours to Tories like its eggs with eggs, they are not the same thing.
No one should be surprised if a Conservative whose beliefs emphasise the individual, personal responsibility and a desire for a small state seeks to avoid taxation. Those aren't the beliefs of a Socialist, the belief is in the collective, a belief in the state, an interventionist state requires high taxation, if that is the state you believe in then surely you should not seek to avoid taxation, it is hypocrisy.
Those on the right understand and recognise our nature is driven by self interest , socialism fails to recognise our nature and can only seek to deny it. Amazingly even when Socialist leaders themselves succumb to their own human self interest they feel unable to recognise it.
Hence Socialism the world over looks something like this..



Given your staunch defence of such behaviour Vic , are we to presume that come the revolution you see yourself on the right hand side of this wall ;)

 

[Dave Ewing's Back 'eader]

And for me, it reveals one of two things, either

(a) She is so fucking thick, she had no idea that this would look really bad,

or

(b) She knew it would look like it stinks and yet went ahead anyway because she doesn't give a shit.

I'm genuinely not sure which it is. It's baffling to me how any party (and I include the Tories in this) can allow their MPs to engage in things which OPTICALLY are so damaging for the party. If I were PM and especially after the freebies scandal last year, I would have been telling my ministers that if there's anything that appears even remotely dodgy going forward, then that cannot be tolerated they will be summarily fired without warning. Elections are won and lost on the back of things like this. Once a party's reputation for sleeze is established, it's very hard to shake off. Ask the Tories!

I'd put a quid (tax paid) on this. Brassed-necked, hard-nosed hypocrite.

 

[BobKowalski]

You cannot defend Big Ange by comparing her behaviours to Tories like its eggs with eggs, they are not the same thing.
No one should be surprised if a Conservative whose beliefs emphasise the individual, personal responsibility and a desire for a small state seeks to avoid taxation. Those aren't the beliefs of a Socialist, the belief is in the collective, a belief in the state, an interventionist state requires high taxation, if that is the state you believe in then surely you should not seek to avoid taxation, it is hypocrisy.
Those on the right understand and recognise our nature is driven by self interest , socialism fails to recognise our nature and can only seek to deny it. Amazingly even when Socialist leaders themselves succumb to their own human self interest they feel unable to recognise it.
Hence Socialism the world over looks something like this..
View attachment 168418


Given your staunch defence of such behaviour Vic , are we to presume that come the revolution you see yourself on the right hand side of this wall ;)

Big Ange was sacked by Spurs last season, bit harsh bringing him into this.

 

[BobKowalski]

What a surprise.

Labour minister proves herself to be AT BEST a steaming hypocrite, and Marxist Bob's reaction? Nothing to see here.

Well blow me over.

I'll gloss over the fact that she may very well have committed fraud. But of course, that doesn't matter either. She's LABOUR.

Never go ‘Cap Lock’. It’s not a good look.

Labour minister putting house into a Trust is a not the best example of Marxist economic doctrine, but we live in strange times with Tories and US Republicans walking away from free trade and embracing protectionism and tariffs, so who the fuck knows these days.

 

[Hgblue2]

So, long story short, the house in question is in a Trust. My interest in this story was minimal at best and has now completely evaporated. A clear case of GTS. Nurse, please send in the next patient.

GTS Symptoms

Irrational rage when seeing/reading news featuring prominent women of a liberal persuasion - working class accent is an additional trigger.
Compulsion to vent on public forums or at random people in public.
Uncontrollable urge to shout out expletives at TV screen or other medium.
Excessive sweating, hot flushes and/or erectile dysfunction.
Irritable bowel.
Increased chance of divorce.

Confession through projection ;)

 

[Vic]

At least the Spectator is not joining in the hysteria.

Angela Rayner’s not-so-scandalous ‘third home’

Angela Rayner has bought a £700,000 seaside flat — but does her so-called ‘third home’ really amount to hypocrisy?

www.spectator.co.uk

 

[Chippy_boy]

At least the Spectator is not joining in the hysteria.

Angela Rayner’s not-so-scandalous ‘third home’

Angela Rayner has bought a £700,000 seaside flat — but does her so-called ‘third home’ really amount to hypocrisy?

www.spectator.co.uk

Well they should.

@jeremycorbyn correct to raise tax dodging issue, the public are furious with those who get away with tax avoidance while they pay! - Angela Rayner tweet.

 

[Vic]

Well they should.

@jeremycorbyn correct to raise tax dodging issue, the public are furious with those who get away with tax avoidance while they pay! - Angela Rayner tweet.

No political motive there, I suppose.

 

[Chippy_boy]

No political motive there, I suppose.

Why are you incapable of criticizing Labour? I mean seriously, here she is complaining about people avoiding tax and then caught doing exactly that herself. This is by any definition, hypocritical. Why can you not bring yourself to say, "well yeah, fair enough, that is pretty hypocritical of her"? It's bizarre how you lot - in the main - seem unable to be honest about any Labour mis-step, blunder or wrong-doing.