The Labour Party

Chippy_boy said:
I missed this gem, "Labour members vote to back effectively abolishing private schools and redistributing their possessions".

Beautiful!

That's another nail in their coffin.

But seriously, what could *possibly* encapsulate their true spirit of bitterness and envy, other than wanting rich kids and their parents to do less well?

Fuck all to do with wanting poor kids to do well, so long as the rich kids do worse.

Fabulous. Truly the policy of a keys down the side of the BMW party. And they have the fucking cheek to describe Tories as nasty. What a bunch of sad losers

Sad fucking losers.
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The idea is for the rich to have to invest in the state system for the benefit of everyone rather than creating enclaves. The average fee is around £16,500 a year so it is way beyond the means of most if even if you aspire to send your kid to private school.

Also the number of Prime Ministers we elect who, by sheer coincidence, went to Eton means I would vote to abolish that particular stain on our public life in a heartbeat.
 
Damocles said:
I'm out of the loop with this "Labour Civil War" as I've been busy the last week and only read BBC/mainstream news outlets. What's actually happening? Is there any genuine chance of a split or is it typical media shite?
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It's media shite, there'll be no split, besides, the splitters have nowhere to go.

The blairites are using remain as a fig leaf for their true intentions, they're finished. The likes of Clive Lewis? If he doesn't get what he wants, he'll still stay, he'll realise soon enough he's already won.
 
BobKowalski said:
The idea is for the rich to have to invest in the state system for the benefit of everyone rather than creating enclaves. The average fee is around £16,500 a year so it is way beyond the means of most if even if you aspire to send your kid to private school.

Also the number of Prime Ministers we elect who, by sheer coincidence, went to Eton means I would vote to abolish that particular stain on our public life in a heartbeat.
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How will they invest?

means tested state schooling with anyone earning a few bob made to pay?
 
Damocles said:
I'm out of the loop with this "Labour Civil War" as I've been busy the last week and only read BBC/mainstream news outlets. What's actually happening? Is there any genuine chance of a split or is it typical media shite?
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Momentum launched an attempt to get rid of Watson. Surprisingly it all turned a bit heated so Corbyn called them off
 
The perfect fumble said:
It's media shite, there'll be no split, besides, the splitters have nowhere to go.

The blairites are using remain as a fig leaf for their true intentions, they're finished. The likes of Clive Lewis? If he doesn't get what he wants, he'll still stay, he'll realise soon enough he's already won.
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Yeah it looked a bit pie in the sky when I was reading. Cheers.
 
cibaman said:
Momentum launched an attempt to get rid of Watson. Surprisingly it all turned a bit heated so Corbyn called them off
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So they should. And so Watson and his crew should fight back.

This is the essence of democracy. When two factions disagree on a way forward then the more popular faction in the electorate should win and represent the Party, with an eye to a broad Church approach, as best they can.
 
The perfect fumble said:
Clearly not, it's the same organised chaos.
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Nah.

Trying to depose the deputy leader by getting rid of the job or a Union boss telling the shadow cabinet they had better go elsewhere if they dont tow the line over brexit is as good an exhibition of loyalty and unity you will see.
 
blueinsa said:
Nah.

Trying to depose the deputy leader by getting rid of the job or a Union boss telling the shadow cabinet they had better go elsewhere if they dont tow the line over brexit is as good an exhibition of loyalty and unity you will see.
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Loyalty is overrated. I've decided that I'd like Momentum to be as forward pushing as possible because it leaves them without a backdoor policy. No blaming the Blairites for an election loss if there's no Blairites there.
 
Chippy_boy said:
I missed this gem, "Labour members vote to back effectively abolishing private schools and redistributing their possessions".

Beautiful!

That's another nail in their coffin.

But seriously, what could *possibly* encapsulate their true spirit of bitterness and envy, other than wanting rich kids and their parents to do less well?

Fuck all to do with wanting poor kids to do well, so long as the rich kids do worse.

Fabulous. Truly the policy of a keys down the side of the BMW party. And they have the fucking cheek to describe Tories as nasty. What a bunch of sad losers

Sad fucking losers.
Click to expand...

You missed it because thats not the policy - Labour wants to remove charitable status, tax advantages and exemption from business rates for fee paying school - I applaud them. How can there be social mobility when the wealthy send their kids to subsidised fee paying schools? Its about market forces if you like - nobody is going to abolish fee paying schools they will still exist and every right to do so its just that fees will reflect the going market rate to provide that place as happens in the state system.
Plus it has everything to do with poorer kids doing better - if fee paying schools pay taxes and rates then there is more in the system to redistribute to try and help state education.
Its about values .
 
blueinsa said:
How will they invest?

means tested state schooling with anyone earning a few bob made to pay?
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It means they have a stake in the state system. Are schools adequately funded? Have they enough teachers, facilities, equipment? If you have a stake in the system that you are sending your little Johnny to then you will more be inclined to look out for it and if you do have more means then most that can make a difference.

Allowing the rich to opt out and perpetuate a system of privilege, which is increasingly beyond the means of people who are well off, creates an unhealthy divide. If the political class and media class is dominated by people from a few schools and a few universities and have the means to keep that system going how does that help the country as a whole? Do you think the last umpteen PM’s who went to Eton is us electing the best in class or just us electing the people with the most means?
 
Damocles said:
Loyalty is overrated. I've decided that I'd like Momentum to be as forward pushing as possible because it leaves them without a backdoor policy. No blaming the Blairites for an election loss if there's no Blairites there.
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Get rid of prescription charges this morning....fantastic.

Ban private education this afternoon....fucking ridiculous.

Blaming the blairites is like being back in South Africa where the ANC has been in power since 1994 and to this day everything that goes tits up and that is virtually everything is still the fault of the Apartheid regime if you listen to them.

I cant vote Labour with them running the show im afraid.
 
bluethrunthru said:
You missed it because thats not the policy - Labour wants to remove charitable status, tax advantages and exemption from business rates for fee paying school - I applaud them. How can there be social mobility when the wealthy send their kids to subsidised fee paying schools? Its about market forces if you like - nobody is going to abolish fee paying schools they will still exist and every right to do so its just that fees will reflect the going market rate to provide that place as happens in the state system.
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This is actually a myth btw. I've posted the evidence on the forum before; in almost every study ever conducted on the issue, the "quality" of school that you go to has almost no effect at all on your life chances.

Sending kids from the ghetto to a private school and sending rich kids to an underfunded public high school produced no differentiation from the norm of academic achievement. Much more important is the social class that you come from. Rich kids will be schooled well no matter where they go and poor kids will always be fucked.

Social mobility is about social class differences rather than educational standards. Creating a larger middle class, for example, seems to be the best way to do that and the best way to achieve a large middle class is to invest in underfunded public services in working class areas. Addiction, adult care services, Children and Young People's Services, etc.

Essentially, if your Mum is a crackhead and your Dad is a drunk then it doesn't matter if you go Manchester Grammar or Moston Brook, you're pretty much going to have a shit life.
 
BobKowalski said:
It means they have a stake in the state system. Are schools adequately funded? Have they enough teachers, facilities, equipment? If you have a stake in the system that you are sending your little Johnny to then you will more be inclined to look out for it and if you do have more means then most that can make a difference.

Allowing the rich to opt out and perpetuate a system of privilege, which is increasingly beyond the means of people who are well off, creates an unhealthy divide. If the political class and media class is dominated by people from a few schools and a few universities and have the means to keep that system going how does that help the country as a whole? Do you think the last umpteen PM’s who went to Eton is us electing the best in class or just us electing the people with the most means?
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The rich pay their taxes on top of paying their private school fees.

How does this in any way invest much needed money into the state school system?
 
blueinsa said:
Nah.

Trying to depose the deputy leader by getting rid of the job or a Union boss telling the shadow cabinet they had better go elsewhere if they dont tow the line over brexit is as good an exhibition of loyalty and unity you will see.
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Noises off, it means nothing.

Watson is no more an effective Deputy to Corbyn than you are, everyone knows it, you might give a shit, but only because you want to. With respect you're a lost soul to Labour and you ain't coming back.

New Labour is dead, you'll have to find a home in the Lib Dems or hang around for a one nation Tory, there'll be one along soon enough.
 
The perfect fumble said:
Noises off, it means nothing.

Watson is no more an effective Deputy to Corbyn than you are, everyone knows it, you might give a shit, but only because you want to. With respect you're a lost soul to Labour and you ain't coming back.

New Labour is dead, you'll have to find a home in the Lib Dems or hang around for a one nation Tory, there'll be one along soon enough.
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Watson is to Corbyn as Prescott was to Blair.

And New Labour isn't dead. You can tell that by all the New Labour MPs and supporters still actually in the Labour Party.

And I'm not sure calling life long Labour voters "lost souls you ain't coming back" is really the best strategy for an election.
 
The perfect fumble said:
Noises off, it means nothing.

Watson is no more an effective Deputy to Corbyn than you are, everyone knows it, you might give a shit, but only because you want to. With respect you're a lost soul to Labour and you ain't coming back.

New Labour is dead, you'll have to find a home in the Lib Dems or hang around for a one nation Tory, there'll be one along soon enough.
Click to expand...

New labour is dead to you, not to me. Unfortunately your Labour means more Tory governments, regardless of how shit they are right now.
 
blueinsa said:
The rich pay their taxes on top of paying their private school fees.

How does this in any way invest much needed money into the state school system?
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It doesn't, but that's not the point.

I can see it now, the playing fields of Eton....

kes-football-match.jpg
 
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