The Scottish Politics thread

Brewster's millions said:
Point taken regarding the optics, it does look very bad for them.

I would however argue that the reason why the case is so dodgy even within a normal business environment - and why the SNP investigation is different to that surrounding City - relates to the essentially ring-fenced, non-fungible, nature of the 667k provided.

The onus is therefore clearly on Murrell to prove how the 667k - again, distinct from other donations provided to meet day-to-day funding requirements - was used, or indeed where it was moved to if it hasn’t already been spent. The loan provided by Murrell, and importantly the failure to disclose the loan at the time, merely increases the need for an explanation. I would expect that only a very small number of people exercised control over the ring-fenced funds and so I still find it difficult to believe that it would take nearly two years of genuine investigation to determine the facts. Indeed, the manner of the Treasurer’s resignation and the personal loan provided - kept secret at the time of course - suggests that the Murrells may have had sole control.

In City’s case, the club will argue that all of its revenue is fungible from a regulatory perspective, that this revenue has been signed off as such by the auditors, and it’s therefore up to the club how it spends it as long as losses do not exceed a pre-determined amount.

That’s my argument in any case, for what it’s worth. At the very least it’s good to see the communication between Sturgeon and the police facing some scrutiny this morning, as I don’t believe for one moment that she didn’t know the house call was imminent.
Click to expand...

In fairness I haven't followed the detail, but I agree it needs fully investigated and concluded either way.

For what it's worth, I have a good few friends that have in fact donated to that pot. Not one of them is bothered how their money is used, currently at least, as long as it ultimately gets used on the referendum or even pursuit for independence in some other form. Which is one thing you can probably fully expect the snp to do. One described it as giving money to his new niece for her first school uniform. Then watching his brother spend it on clothes she needs now. He's not pissed off because he knows she'll still get a uniform when the time comes.

The big issue might be if it turns out they have embezzled the money or took it out the fund for personal use. But if they can justify the funds being used on a long term strive for a referendun (i.e legal costs of challenging Westminster's stance in court etc), then there will be nothing to see there other than juicy headlines. Till then, it is likely of interest more for the opposition, than the public.
 
Whilst I am an SNP member, if there has been illegality then those charged and found guilty should be subject to the full weight of Scottish law irrespective of who they are. I will retain some balance though and wait until charges are brought against party officials and then wait until they are found guilty before I condemn them. You know, a bit like we wish City were treated by media and others.

Just to bring a little balance though, I can think of a least 50 things that have been perpetrated by the Tory Government in Westminster over the last few years that are more dishonest than what those formerly in charge of the SNP are accused of. Still, I wont play whataboutism other than saying that I recognise that this circus will be a welcome distraction for those still in denial about what Tory deceit, incompetence and greed has brought the country to.
 
Coatigan said:
In fairness I haven't followed the detail, but I agree it needs fully investigated and concluded either way.

For what it's worth, I have a good few friends that have in fact donated to that pot. Not one of them is bothered how their money is used, currently at least, as long as it ultimately gets used on the referendum or even pursuit for independence in some other form. Which is one thing you can probably fully expect the snp to do. One described it as giving money to his new niece for her first school uniform. Then watching his brother spend it on clothes she needs now. He's not pissed off because he knows she'll still get a uniform when the time comes.

The big issue might be if it turns out they have embezzled the money or took it out the fund for personal use. But if they can justify the funds being used on a long term strive for a referendun (i.e legal costs of challenging Westminster's stance in court etc), then there will be nothing to see there other than juicy headlines. Till then, it is likely of interest more for the opposition, than the public.
Click to expand...
I agree that for most SNP donors, the use of the funds is probably not a huge issue - in theory at least - as they would view the donations as ultimately supporting an independence push at some point.

However, you could also argue that if that were indeed the case, then why would the party need to pursue a separate fundraising exercise on the basis of a ring-fencing of donations? I suspect that the issue here is simply that a number of large contributors to the fund didn’t receive the influence over or access to the party they expected to receive, with the opaque nature of Murrell’s actions being the aggravating factor.

Although I dislike Sturgeon and have no time for the SNP, I don’t think really think there was any embezzling of funds for personal gain in a blatant criminal sense. My own view, and it’s just an opinion, is that the funds may have been directed towards the other high profile legal case surrounding the SNP over the past few years, and that the Murrells have tried to avoid disclosing this.

My main concern though is the nature of the relationship that has developed between the FM and the police. In fact, I would rather see public money being used to determine whether any information about the impending arrest was provided to Sturgeon than trying to find out what happened to the missing funds. The SNP has shown ample evidence down the years of how adept they are at wasting other peoples’ money, so the odd 667k is neither here nor there.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
Whilst I am an SNP member, if there has been illegality then those charged and found guilty should be subject to the full weight of Scottish law irrespective of who they are. I will retain some balance though and wait until charges are brought against party officials and then wait until they are found guilty before I condemn them. You know, a bit like we wish City were treated by media and others.

Just to bring a little balance though, I can think of a least 50 things that have been perpetrated by the Tory Government in Westminster over the last few years that are more dishonest than what those formerly in charge of the SNP are accused of. Still, I wont play whataboutism other than saying that I recognise that this circus will be a welcome distraction for those still in denial about what Tory deceit, incompetence and greed has brought the country to.
Click to expand...
Gosh Sadds.
If you think you have a scoop on the Tory activities. You should get onto The Daily Mail or The Guardian or whatever. They’d love to run with it I’m sure. Same as if you have any beef on any other club in the league. Their sports department would love to hear from you.

Don’t you think there’s a common audience there?
 
Brewster's millions said:
I agree that for most SNP donors, the use of the funds is probably not a huge issue - in theory at least - as they would view the donations as ultimately supporting an independence push at some point.

However, you could also argue that if that were indeed the case, then why would the party need to pursue a separate fundraising exercise on the basis of a ring-fencing of donations? I suspect that the issue here is simply that a number of large contributors to the fund didn’t receive the influence over or access to the party they expected to receive, with the opaque nature of Murrell’s actions being the aggravating factor.

Although I dislike Sturgeon and have no time for the SNP, I don’t think really think there was any embezzling of funds for personal gain in a blatant criminal sense. My own view, and it’s just an opinion, is that the funds may have been directed towards the other high profile legal case surrounding the SNP over the past few years, and that the Murrells have tried to avoid disclosing this.

My main concern though is the nature of the relationship that has developed between the FM and the police. In fact, I would rather see public money being used to determine whether any information about the impending arrest was provided to Sturgeon than trying to find out what happened to the missing funds. The SNP has shown ample evidence down the years of how adept they are at wasting other peoples’ money, so the odd 667k is neither here nor there.
Click to expand...
What do you reckon is buried in the garden?
 
mancity2012_eamo said:
Gosh Sadds.
If you think you have a scoop on the Tory activities. You should get onto The Daily Mail or The Guardian or whatever. They’d love to run with it I’m sure. Same as if you have any beef on any other club in the league. Their sports department would love to hear from you.

Don’t you think there’s a common audience there?
Click to expand...
I’m sure you are making a clever point. I’m going through a thick phase unfortunately.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top
✖
  AdBlock Detected
Bluemoon relies on advertising to pay our hosting fees. Please support the site by disabling your ad blocking software to help keep the forum sustainable. Thanks.