The Scottish Politics thread

[Ban-jani]

I don't disagree, I just think it feeds on opposition and a victim of the English oppression mindset. The SNP would vanish as quickly as ukip if we started to go along with them.

Maybe we should kick the miserable cunts out of the union or just declare England as independent.

To be honest I‘m sick of the Scottish and Welsh with their anti English nonsense and NI is a head ache.

Get rid and let’s go our own way.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Maybe we should kick the miserable cunts out of the union or just declare England as independent.

To be honest I‘m sick of the Scottish and Welsh with their anti English nonsense and NI is a head ache.

Get rid and let’s go our own way.

Again, I think we agree - maybe just putting it on different ways ;-)

 

[BobKowalski]

Maybe we should kick the miserable cunts out of the union or just declare England as independent.

To be honest I‘m sick of the Scottish and Welsh with their anti English nonsense and NI is a head ache.

Get rid and let’s go our own way.

Think it's just they would like to be consulted on decisions that effect them rather than have the English dictate terms. We are a four nation Union so maybe we should consider acting like one. If the E27 can hammer out a consensus I don't see why our 300 year Union with it's shared history and culture can't do the same.

 

[Ban-jani]

Think it's just they would like to be consulted on decisions that effect them rather than have the English dictate terms. We are a four nation Union so maybe we should consider acting like one. If the E27 can hammer out a consensus I don't see why our 300 year Union with it's shared history and culture can't do the same.

It’s a joke Bob but are we being consulted when the Scots get their vote?

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Cameron had to face an Independence movement.

Johnson faces a country that voted Remain over Leave, a country that seems to have more competent governance during a pandemic than the one he leads, a country who's Government isn't being questioned over money and access from Russian oligarchs nor is it led by a proven liar who lies week after week.

Therein lies the difference.

It's interesting you state that the Scottish government has been more competent than the UK government. I don't quite think the stats back that up, but I'm am ope. To persuasion other wise. Especially when you consider the extra spending power that the Scottish government has per person over the England especially. I think the difference lies in how sturgeon comes across compared to Johnson. She is without doubt a much more accomplished public speaker than Johnson. That I think largely gives rise to the perception that the Scottish government has performed so much better.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

It’s a joke Bob but are we being consulted when the Scots get their vote?

They do get consulted it’s called a UK parliament , where all the countries debate and pass laws For the uk

then they go off to their own parliament to do their own domestic things in their own country.

You know the Northern Irish go to their parliament , the scots to theirs , the welsh to theirs and the English to theirs , oh wait.....

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

It's interesting you state that the Scottish government has been more competent than the UK government. I don't quite think the stats back that up, but I'm am ope. To persuasion other wise. Especially when you consider the extra spending power that the Scottish government has per person over the England especially. I think the difference lies in how sturgeon comes across compared to Johnson. She is without doubt a much more accomplished public speaker than Johnson. That I think largely gives rise to the perception that the Scottish government has performed so much better.

It does seem there is a stronger correlation between hating Johnson and liking sturgeon than SNP support and effective governance of Scotland. It would be a shame if the main driver of breaking the union is blind hatred. It is of no consequence if that hatred is for BJ, brexit, the English or whatever - hatred is a dodgy logic upon which to base decisions.

 

[joe123]

It does seem there is a stronger correlation between hating Johnson and liking sturgeon than SNP support and effective governance of Scotland. It would be a shame if the main driver of breaking the union is blind hatred. It is of no consequence if that hatred is for BJ, brexit, the English or whatever - hatred is a dodgy logic upon which to base decisions.

Probably true but negativity has always been a big political motivator. Some people hate the EU, some people hate the tories etc etc and has been the main factor in why they vote the way the do.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

It does seem there is a stronger correlation between hating Johnson and liking sturgeon than SNP support and effective governance of Scotland. It would be a shame if the main driver of breaking the union is blind hatred. It is of no consequence if that hatred is for BJ, brexit, the English or whatever - hatred is a dodgy logic upon which to base decisions.

She likes stirring it up that's for sure.

 

[Ifwecouldjust.......]

She's a class act

 

[Saddleworth2]

There is a fair amount of unintelligent dribble spouted on this thread. For those that want to debate sensibly, this is an important read as it sets out in some detail how An independent Scotland's economy might look. The report was released in 2018 so will require a refresh of projections caused by Covid. The report was produced by the Sustainable Growth Commission, a think tank set up by Ms Sturgeon. It’s comprehensive in scope But a reasonably easy read.

zhttps://www.sustainablegrowthcommission.scot/report

Proposals around currency are the most contentious and are the area that I have most serious reservations.

 

[hilts]

My preferred option would be an one island Ireland and Scotland England and Wales being one country with regions with more power locally. Won’t happen in a million years. Otherwise I think Scotland and Wales should be independent. In these uncertain times we may as well get it over with and rethink everything.

In or out make your mind up people. If I was Scottish I would vote out for sure.

 

[BobKowalski]

My preferred option would be an one island Ireland and Scotland England and Wales being one country with regions with more power locally. Won’t happen in a million years. Otherwise I think Scotland and Wales should be independent. In these uncertain times we may as well get it over with and rethink everything.

In or out make your mind up people. If I was Scottish I would vote out for sure.

I’m one of the few who wants the Union to remain as is but I can see the logic in a united Ireland. I like the idea of a single British country with strong regional Govt but yeah it will never happen.

I’m resigned to Scotland becoming independent. If Ireland can do it then so can Scotland. If ex colonies like Malta are viable as independent countries than it is ludicrous to suggest Scotland cannot be independent. If the NI protocols work then you have a template for how Scotland can straddle two custom unions and it has greater economic opportunities via the option of full EU membership. It will also have EU money funnelled into it in the early years. Scotland will also look at Ireland and see that the EU chief trade negotiator and EU finance minister are Irish. It will also have a vote and more say in European affairs than it currently does in UK affairs.

Having said all this it will a sad day for me when it happens.

 

[bluethrunthru]

I’m one of the few who wants the Union to remain as is but I can see the logic in a united Ireland. I like the idea of a single British country with strong regional Govt but yeah it will never happen.

I’m resigned to Scotland becoming independent. If Ireland can do it then so can Scotland. If ex colonies like Malta are viable as independent countries than it is ludicrous to suggest Scotland cannot be independent. If the NI protocols work then you have a template for how Scotland can straddle two custom unions and it has greater economic opportunities via the option of full EU membership. It will also have EU money funnelled into it in the early years. Scotland will also look at Ireland and see that the EU chief trade negotiator and EU finance minister are Irish. It will also have a vote and more say in European affairs than it currently does in UK affairs.

Having said all this it will a sad day for me when it happens.

I have often wondered myself when the economic argument is used to rubbish the Scots chances of making a go of it why it is often overlooked that there are many many countries around the world who relied on us as their "mother country" who have made a go of independence. Three of them rather ironically seem to do ok and are in the EU so why it wouldn't work for Scotland is far from cut and dried except in the eyes of some armchair economists on here.

I'd like things to stay as they are too but as we are often told we have to respect the will of the people. NI is interesting because the majority for now seem to want to remain in the UK however they also voted Remain in the referendum. The way Johnson has lied to them regards free trade can't have improved their view of being ruled from Westminster and if Brexit causes chaos for them then, like Scotland with its 50+% pro devolution polls it could mean a fight to the death for Johnson at the GE.

 

[Saddleworth2]

I’m one of the few who wants the Union to remain as is but I can see the logic in a united Ireland. I like the idea of a single British country with strong regional Govt but yeah it will never happen.

I’m resigned to Scotland becoming independent. If Ireland can do it then so can Scotland. If ex colonies like Malta are viable as independent countries than it is ludicrous to suggest Scotland cannot be independent. If the NI protocols work then you have a template for how Scotland can straddle two custom unions and it has greater economic opportunities via the option of full EU membership. It will also have EU money funnelled into it in the early years. Scotland will also look at Ireland and see that the EU chief trade negotiator and EU finance minister are Irish. It will also have a vote and more say in European affairs than it currently does in UK affairs.

Having said all this it will a sad day for me when it happens.

I have similar feelings and would rather see the Union modernised than broken. I doubt that will ever happen though. Still some huge issues to grapple with not least the question of currency. Retain sterling like Ireland did when it became independent. Set up our own currency or Euro and how to transition from one to the other and over what period. The SNP Party didn’t like the conclusions of the sustainable growth commission report I posted. They want a fast transition. For that they would need all the fiscal governance and central bank established. The other big issue I see is what the tone of any negotiation with A Tory government. I feel that we would see all the nonsense we have seen in their approach to Brexit negotiations whereas with good will on both sides, there is a way through the allocation of debt etc. You will see from that report some proposals are made which seem on the face of it a reasonable start point.

 

[Saddleworth2]

I have often wondered myself when the economic argument is used to rubbish the Scots chances of making a go of it why it is often overlooked that there are many many countries around the world who relied on us as their "mother country" who have made a go of independence. Three of them rather ironically seem to do ok and are in the EU so why it wouldn't work for Scotland is far from cut and dried except in the eyes of some armchair economists on here.

I'd like things to stay as they are too but as we are often told we have to respect the will of the people. NI is interesting because the majority for now seem to want to remain in the UK however they also voted Remain in the referendum. The way Johnson has lied to them regards free trade can't have improved their view of being ruled from Westminster and if Brexit causes chaos for them then, like Scotland with its 50+% pro devolution polls it could mean a fight to the death for Johnson at the GE.

There are many small nations of Scotland’s size with developed economies. It is clear that Sturgeon is looking at New Zealand closely. And not just to steal ideas from their Covid response. Their approach to economic planning is cited as an approach worthy of replicating for an independent Scotland within the SGC report I posted.

 

[blueparrot]

There are many small nations of Scotland’s size with developed economies. It is clear that Sturgeon is looking at New Zealand closely. And not just to steal ideas from their Covid response. Their approach to economic planning is cited as an approach worthy of replicating for an independent Scotland within the SGC report I posted.

Without wanting to ignite the Orkney as part of Scotland debate, thought Johnson made a case for independence when he said Orkney alone could supply 20% of the UK’s renewable/ green energy. Scotland as a whole could probably supply 100% and already a leader in renewables could become a big renewable energy exporter.

 

[Saddleworth2]

Without wanting to ignite the Orkney as part of Scotland debate, thought Johnson made a case for independence when he said Orkney alone could supply 20% of the UK’s renewable/ green energy. Scotland as a whole could probably supply 100% and already a leader in renewables could become a big renewable energy exporter.

I think at present 25% of what we generate is exported over the Border. I certainly think it will continue to be a major part of the Scottish economy over the next decade. I also noted that sensibly the SGC have recommended that we put oil revenues into a development fund like Norway did from the start rather than being a hostage to future oil prices in our year to year budgeting.

 

[Ifwecouldjust.......]

I’m one of the few who wants the Union to remain as is but I can see the logic in a united Ireland. I like the idea of a single British country with strong regional Govt but yeah it will never happen.

I’m resigned to Scotland becoming independent. If Ireland can do it then so can Scotland. If ex colonies like Malta are viable as independent countries than it is ludicrous to suggest Scotland cannot be independent. If the NI protocols work then you have a template for how Scotland can straddle two custom unions and it has greater economic opportunities via the option of full EU membership. It will also have EU money funnelled into it in the early years. Scotland will also look at Ireland and see that the EU chief trade negotiator and EU finance minister are Irish. It will also have a vote and more say in European affairs than it currently does in UK affairs.

Having said all this it will a sad day for me when it happens.

it will be a very sad indeed .... but looking inevitable due to the actions of a minority

 

[blueparrot]

I think at present 25% of what we generate is exported over the Border. I certainly think it will continue to be a major part of the Scottish economy over the next decade. I also noted that sensibly the SGC have recommended that we put oil revenues into a development fund like Norway did from the start rather than being a hostage to future oil prices in our year to year budgeting.

Think I’ve seen snippets of the SGC never read it all,I’ll give it a read.