The Tottenham Thread 12/13

[Marvin]

Vertonghen is a centre-back though playing out of position

On paper Spurs are very strong, but players like Dempsey were anonymous yesterday. And Walker never crossed the half-way line. Maybe the early Spurs goal worked to our advantage in the long run as it convinced Spurs to hold what they had.

 

[JoeMercer'sWay]

despite every decision they got yesterday they got their goal through defensive cock-ups again and did sod all else all game, completely ineffective and completely outplayed.

 

[Marvin]

despite every decision they got yesterday they got their goal through defensive cock-ups again and did sod all else all game, completely ineffective and completely outplayed.

Correct. And when you consider they were 1-0 up, playing a team under pressure, and with players of the calibre Spurs have in their team, their tactics were inexplicable

When you look at the League table and you see that teams like WBA and WHU and Everto are challenging for 4th spot you should as a Spurs fan be wondering whether Spurs are getting the best out of their team

 

[MSP]

Bale didn't want to damage title chances of his next club, here you go :)

He was bloody awful yesterday apart from that one shot in 2nd half.. invisible.

 

[BoyBlue_1985]

reg. AVB: The more I watch his teams, the more I believe that he got lucky at Porto. He had an incredibly good side, playing in an average league.

reg. Bale: He was having to cover for a very poor Vertonghen yesterday. Vertonghen's goal at Old Trafford has led to a lot of overrating. He is poor defensively and it showed y'day. Both the goals we scored came from moves starting vertonghen's side of the pitch. Even in that second half at Old Trafford, United found a lot of joy down Vertonghen's wing.

Although this is true and Porto very rarely do not win the league anyway he still went a season undefeated and won the Europa League. While I feel I could maybe produce a decent league season at Porto only a good manager could achieve what he did

 

[IBlue]

Vertonghen is a centre-back though playing out of position

On paper Spurs are very strong, but players like Dempsey were anonymous yesterday. And Walker never crossed the half-way line. Maybe the early Spurs goal worked to our advantage in the long run as it convinced Spurs to hold what they had.

Walker never crossed the half way line due the tactical move of playing Kolarov in the wide midfield role, this allowed Clichy to be one on one with Lennon, and he was all over him lke a rash.<br /><br />-- Mon Nov 12, 2012 2:43 pm --<br /><br />

despite every decision they got yesterday they got their goal through defensive cock-ups again and did sod all else all game, completely ineffective and completely outplayed.

Correct. And when you consider they were 1-0 up, playing a team under pressure, and with players of the calibre Spurs have in their team, their tactics were inexplicable

When you look at the League table and you see that teams like WBA and WHU and Everto are challenging for 4th spot you should as a Spurs fan be wondering whether Spurs are getting the best out of their team

I was suprised they didn't come out more after they had scored, you could sense the tension in our fans and it could have transmitted to the players, in hindsight i think the 2 penalty none decisions got the fans going, a bit of the seige mentality came out in us.

 

[sergiokun]

despite every decision they got yesterday they got their goal through defensive cock-ups again and did sod all else all game, completely ineffective and completely outplayed.

Spot on, they deserved nothing yesterday

 

[Pam]

I was very surprised about just how bad they were yesterday. It was no improvement on the Wigan fiasco from the previous weekend.

 

[Dzeko's Right Boot]

It almost seemed as if they only scored by accident. They didn't try to score at any point before they did and didn't look they had any intent to. They seemed to want to contain us all game, so when they did score they had even more reason to invite us on because they actually had a lead to defend.


One thing that was REALLY noticeable was how much they miss Luka Modric. They had nobody to carry the ball through the middle, or pass it away quickly but effectively. Things aren't looking good for Spurs at the moment. The sooner they drop Dempsey, the better.

 

[Pam]

despite every decision they got yesterday they got their goal through defensive cock-ups again and did sod all else all game, completely ineffective and completely outplayed.

Correct. And when you consider they were 1-0 up, playing a team under pressure, and with players of the calibre Spurs have in their team, their tactics were inexplicable

When you look at the League table and you see that teams like WBA and WHU and Everto are challenging for 4th spot you should as a Spurs fan be wondering whether Spurs are getting the best out of their team

They played that second half in exactly the same way as they played the Swamp game and they only just got away with it.

 

[spurspinter1]

One thing that was REALLY noticeable was how much they miss Luka Modric. They had nobody to carry the ball through the middle, or pass it away quickly but effectively. Things aren't looking good for Spurs at the moment. The sooner they drop Dempsey, the better.

And Rafa. Oh how I miss Rafa.

With Dembele I think we have a really good replacement for Modric in the centre of the pitch, him for Modric with 15m+ change isn't bad going. It's just unfortunate that he's been out for so long, the hip problem was with him whilst he was at Fulham so god knows how we didn't forsee some kind of issue but it's not the first time with our medical team unfortunately. With us missing out and having no back up plan on other targets we've left ourselves lacking creativity and adventure in midfield.

That combined with the Rafa out for Sig and Dempsey in is having a severe impact. The Dempsey signing always had that slightly uncomfortable feeling to it, he tries hard but doesn't have anywhere near the flair/creativity that VDV had.

As for Siggy I think there is potential and he's obviously a talented lad but it's just not working for him.

Both of these players fortunes may improve as Ade improves and gets back to fitness, Defoe's done well with the goals he's scored but will never have the ability to bring players like siggurdsson in to the game, it's just not the way he plays.

Defensively we may have injuries but I believe we could be doing better with what we've got currently, how bad can Walker play before he is dropped, why is Vertonghen playing LB when we have other options and was there really a long term plan with Hugo set in place?

From an offensive point of view, there's just not that spark that I want to see when I watch Spurs play, and I doubt we've really got anything lined up for January to change that, I'm assuming we'll do nothing until the last day when we'll put in a 30m bid fro Falcao just after we've heard Chelsea have put in 35m. To deal with the clubs that can spend that kind of money we were always going to have to be savvy, and unfortunately we just haven't been that.

 

[adrianr]

despite every decision they got yesterday they got their goal through defensive cock-ups again and did sod all else all game, completely ineffective and completely outplayed.

Correct. And when you consider they were 1-0 up, playing a team under pressure, and with players of the calibre Spurs have in their team, their tactics were inexplicable

When you look at the League table and you see that teams like WBA and WHU and Everto are challenging for 4th spot you should as a Spurs fan be wondering whether Spurs are getting the best out of their team

They played that second half in exactly the same way as they played the Swamp game and they only just got away with it.

But they still tore United to shreds in the first half. Where was that Spurs? :S

 

[Ntini77]

I couldn't believe how defensive they played. After all, this is Spurs, a team renowned for fast, direct, counter attacking football.

Serious question marks over AVB already for me.

 

[Marvin]

One thing that was REALLY noticeable was how much they miss Luka Modric. They had nobody to carry the ball through the middle, or pass it away quickly but effectively. Things aren't looking good for Spurs at the moment. The sooner they drop Dempsey, the better.

And Rafa. Oh how I miss Rafa.

With Dembele I think we have a really good replacement for Modric in the centre of the pitch, him for Modric with 15m+ change isn't bad going. It's just unfortunate that he's been out for so long, the hip problem was with him whilst he was at Fulham so god knows how we didn't forsee some kind of issue but it's not the first time with our medical team unfortunately. With us missing out and having no back up plan on other targets we've left ourselves lacking creativity and adventure in midfield.

That combined with the Rafa out for Sig and Dempsey in is having a severe impact. The Dempsey signing always had that slightly uncomfortable feeling to it, he tries hard but doesn't have anywhere near the flair/creativity that VDV had.

As for Siggy I think there is potential and he's obviously a talented lad but it's just not working for him.

Both of these players fortunes may improve as Ade improves and gets back to fitness, Defoe's done well with the goals he's scored but will never have the ability to bring players like siggurdsson in to the game, it's just not the way he plays.

Defensively we may have injuries but I believe we could be doing better with what we've got currently, how bad can Walker play before he is dropped, why is Vertonghen playing LB when we have other options and was there really a long term plan with Hugo set in place?

From an offensive point of view, there's just not that spark that I want to see when I watch Spurs play, and I doubt we've really got anything lined up for January to change that, I'm assuming we'll do nothing until the last day when we'll put in a 30m bid fro Falcao just after we've heard Chelsea have put in 35m. To deal with the clubs that can spend that kind of money we were always going to have to be savvy, and unfortunately we just haven't been that.

You certainly approached the game at Old Trafford in a very different way than you approached our game.

I agree Dembele was a revelation in the first few weeks of the season. I remember reading in advance of our game that AVB was hoping to get him back in about 2 weeks without the need for surgery

Bit harsh on Dempsey when he managed to score so many goals for Fulham. He clearly can be an effective player it's just a question of working out how to get the best out of him. I get the feeling that Spurs transfer strategy is often dictated not by footballing reasons but by Levy's desire to wheel and deal and get a bargain. That may have been the motive for getting Dempsey.

Good Luck at the weekend. Arsenal have to win, whereas a draw would I guess be OK for Spurs

 

[alky313]

It makes no sense to play Dempsey in the hole at Spurs, he played wide for most of his career and drifted inward. I do believe that Demosey was more effective at Fulham than Demebele. I'm not saying that Dembele isn't the better player. But when utilised properly Dempsey is unmarkable similar to Shitarito.

 

[Speaker]

Weirdly enough I actually think that AVB got his tactics spot on, and realised the limitations of his team. We were outmatched and outgunned in every area of the pitch. What AVB did realise was that you have conceded over half of your goals conceded from set pieces. From this we had Thudd whipping free kicks into your box whenever we had a free kick in your half. For all intents and purposes, this worked.

I think what many people are missing (which in my opinion AVB is not) is context. We are a side that was veritably gutted this summer, losing Modric, VDV, and King. Our king replacement has been forced to play left back, our Modric replacement is injured, and we just did not get a replacement for VDV truly. Dempsey is woeful (his record last season was not brilliant, he had 17 in 38 or something like that. He may score the odd goal, and this has turned him into the premier 'MOTD player'. Looks great on highlights because he scores a goal, but trust me, he does absolutely fuck all apart from that. Not exactly what you want from your attacking midfielder, who should be one of the most creative players on the pitch). Couple that with key injuries to BAE, Parker, Dembele, and Kaboul, and we were not in the best shape for this match.

Also, why in the hell would we come out and attack you constantly with a depleted first 11? We were playing away at the Premier League Champions who are unbeaten this season, and haven't lost at home in the league in around two years. For us to come and attack with the weakened first 11 we had would have been folly. AVB has his critics, but in this instance I think he set us up in the only possible way to get something out of the match. It didn't quite work this time, but I did not expect anything from the game anyway.

Oh, and to the poster who wondered how we felt that WHU and WBA were challenging for fourth, well, they're not. They may be within touching distance now, but I imagine the picture shall be very different at the end of they year.

A top 6 finish will suit me this year, with the foundations laid for the future. I would love us to actually spend some fucking money soon too. We've had a net spend of about 2 million quid since 2007. Fancy giving us Dzeko for £5m and pay half his wages? :D

On a lighter note, Sandro was a beast again, Caulker had a good game too, and Ade was brilliant.

 

[Matty]

Weirdly enough I actually think that AVB got his tactics spot on, and realised the limitations of his team. We were outmatched and outgunned in every area of the pitch. What AVB did realise was that you have conceded over half of your goals conceded from set pieces. From this we had Thudd whipping free kicks into your box whenever we had a free kick in your half. For all intents and purposes, this worked.

I think what many people are missing (which in my opinion AVB is not) is context. We are a side that was veritably gutted this summer, losing Modric, VDV, and King. Our king replacement has been forced to play left back, our Modric replacement is injured, and we just did not get a replacement for VDV truly. Dempsey is woeful (his record last season was not brilliant, he had 17 in 38 or something like that. He may score the odd goal, and this has turned him into the premier 'MOTD player'. Looks great on highlights because he scores a goal, but trust me, he does absolutely fuck all apart from that. Not exactly what you want from your attacking midfielder, who should be one of the most creative players on the pitch). Couple that with key injuries to BAE, Parker, Dembele, and Kaboul, and we were not in the best shape for this match.

Also, why in the hell would we come out and attack you constantly with a depleted first 11? We were playing away at the Premier League Champions who are unbeaten this season, and haven't lost at home in the league in around two years. For us to come and attack with the weakened first 11 we had would have been folly. AVB has his critics, but in this instance I think he set us up in the only possible way to get something out of the match. It didn't quite work this time, but I did not expect anything from the game anyway.

Oh, and to the poster who wondered how we felt that WHU and WBA were challenging for fourth, well, they're not. They may be within touching distance now, but I imagine the picture shall be very different at the end of they year.

A top 6 finish will suit me this year, with the foundations laid for the future. I would love us to actually spend some fucking money soon too. We've had a net spend of about 2 million quid since 2007. Fancy giving us Dzeko for £5m and pay half his wages? :D

On a lighter note, Sandro was a beast again, Caulker had a good game too, and Ade was brilliant.

Sandro reminds me of De Jong in a way, in that he goes in 100% into challenges whether it's needed or not. He'll end up really injuring an opponent at some point. Caulker looked pretty decent to be fair. As for Adebayor, he spent most of the game falling over under the mearest of breezes and, if memory serves, didn't have a single shot. I'm not sure that quaifies as "brilliant" if you ask me.

Spurs issues will be the same issues they've faced for the last few seasons, Levy seems to want to "break even" on his transfer spending. That's all well and good but, as Arsenal are now discovering, eventually selling your better players and replacing them with unproven alternatives will eventually catch up with you. Spurs need to go out and splash some cash, you simply can't compete with the likes of Chelsea, City and United if you aren't willing to dip into the pot and spend.

 

[r.soleofsalford]

One thing that was REALLY noticeable was how much they miss Luka Modric. They had nobody to carry the ball through the middle, or pass it away quickly but effectively. Things aren't looking good for Spurs at the moment. The sooner they drop Dempsey, the better.

And Rafa. Oh how I miss Rafa.

With Dembele I think we have a really good replacement for Modric in the centre of the pitch, him for Modric with 15m+ change isn't bad going. It's just unfortunate that he's been out for so long, the hip problem was with him whilst he was at Fulham so god knows how we didn't forsee some kind of issue but it's not the first time with our medical team unfortunately. With us missing out and having no back up plan on other targets we've left ourselves lacking creativity and adventure in midfield.

That combined with the Rafa out for Sig and Dempsey in is having a severe impact. The Dempsey signing always had that slightly uncomfortable feeling to it, he tries hard but doesn't have anywhere near the flair/creativity that VDV had.

As for Siggy I think there is potential and he's obviously a talented lad but it's just not working for him.

Both of these players fortunes may improve as Ade improves and gets back to fitness, Defoe's done well with the goals he's scored but will never have the ability to bring players like siggurdsson in to the game, it's just not the way he plays.

Defensively we may have injuries but I believe we could be doing better with what we've got currently, how bad can Walker play before he is dropped, why is Vertonghen playing LB when we have other options and was there really a long term plan with Hugo set in place?

From an offensive point of view, there's just not that spark that I want to see when I watch Spurs play, and I doubt we've really got anything lined up for January to change that, I'm assuming we'll do nothing until the last day when we'll put in a 30m bid fro Falcao just after we've heard Chelsea have put in 35m. To deal with the clubs that can spend that kind of money we were always going to have to be savvy, and unfortunately we just haven't been that.

got to agree on dembele i think he`s a good player who could become top quality

 

[Marvin]

On a lighter note, Sandro was a beast again, Caulker had a good game too, and Ade was brilliant.

The one player who caused City problems was Adebayor.

Had AVB taken a more positive approach, I think your players would have showed up a lot better. I am not sure it's a good idea for AVB to ask naturally attacking players to defend.

Walker getting criticism now, but how much is that down to AVB restricting what he's best at and asking him to concentrate on things he's not so good at?

Yet AVB had the courage to send his team out at Old Trafford and attack so we can't categorise him as a defensive coach. Perhaps he looked at the missing players and just decided that the best chance of a result was to defend? I think he got that wrong.

 

[Dzeko's Right Boot]

Definitely agree on Adebayor. How the fuck did you get him to run so much?