UEFA FFP investigation - CAS decision to be announced Monday, 13th July 9.30am BST

[tolmie's hairdoo]

I suspect that Sam, having been burned once on this case, is playing safe this time round. Far more sensible in his shoes to say he expects a ban than say he expects CAS to throw the case out.

Far more sensible not to comment, or at least not admit to guessing?

 

[Pablo ZZZ Peroni]

He just seems a bit naive. He must have been stitched up by someone with that "City will be cleared" story just before the ban was announced. He was taken for a ride by a source who no doubt had their own motives.

He thought he had good information from his sources. The story wouldn't have been run if not for the information being backed up by the Athletic's main financial man Matt Slater who corroborated it with his own contacts. Matt Slater is a twat but that isn't the point.

Maybe the information was correct. Afterall prestwichblue said he heard the same thing but City turned down a fine.

 

[PannickAtTheDisco]

Oh great, we're back in full tin hat conspiracy land.

as opposed to cloud cuckoo land where people think these are independent journalists with integrity just posting their well-researched, factual based stories?

 

[chesterbells]

Not really. If everyone takes a step back and has a little think - he went balls out that we weren't getting banned. It was his first big story at the Athletic and it was a big exclusive as at the time nobody else had it. The fact that it ended up going totally the other way has probably been a chastening experience for him. Remember that whatever you may or may not think of him, he is their City correspondent. He's not in this to deliberately alienate City supporters, far from it. Him giving his opinion and erring on the side of "guilty" makes not a blind bit of difference to me.

In the greater scheme of things there are loads of reporters who are deliberately and constantly going after the negative with City. Sam isn't one of them, so I prefer to save my energy for guys like Miguel and Jonny Liew and that little clique of twats.

Well said, esp last para.

 

[BillyShears]

True enough. I don’t dislike Sam Lee anywhere near as much as some of the usual suspects but I do think he’s totally out of his depth when talking about FFP.

As for the second bit, you may well be right. I’m nervous about the outcome but I’m trusting the club when they say they have done nothing wrong. If we can prove that at CAS - and by prove, I mean proof of the irrefutable kind that the club have been so vocal about - then we ought to prevail because I trust CAS to reach the correct decision.

Of course, it’s been at the back of my mind that the club may have been lying to us all along and we’re bang to rights. Their bold stance throughout doesn’t appear to reflect this though.

Aye. What bothers me about some of the stuff over the last few pages is that there are legitimately people out there trying to undermine City in the media. They are openly hostile and they are looking for a fight with the club every week. Focussing on Sam as some sort of anti-City writer completely destroys the credibility of the argument. A conversation about how well you understand a subject is different to being deliberately and purposefully hostile. Which is what large segment of the British media are with us. Sam isn't that, and that's not an opinion its a fact.

I'm not sure that I 'trust' CAS anymore than I trust UEFA. Fundamentally these are regulations mean to control spending, and these charges are beyond historical. The reality is that FFP was designed to ensure clubs that had large owner investment ended up stable and financially self sufficient. We are there. On that basis alone, UEFA should suck a dick, CAS should have told UEFA to suck a dick during a preliminary challenge, and the current case is one big farce of bollocks.

And because it's such a farce but has gotten this far, I fear the worst.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

Neville said he thought we’d win. That said, I don’t think he had an understanding of this case itself and it was more a general anti-FFP stance he was taking. As we know, this case isn’t about the perceived rights and wrongs of FFP - it’s about whether we’ve done what we’ve been accused of doing.

Neville has been consistent in his criticism of FFP for years, even before he became a club owner who wanted to invest.

 

[BillyShears]

Far more sensible not to comment, or at least not admit to guessing?

It'd be far more sensible if none of us commented until the outcome but here we are! Haha.

 

[johnnytapia]

You make a good point. It is very difficult to judge because we have virtually no allies in the media or the football world. Of course we are all biased and Bluemoon is certainly an echo chamber. No one outside City has been positive but I do think the media hate campaign against us has generally reduced since Christmas and that could be a good sign.

Even Peter Gardner seemed to find it hard to give us a few good words. The honourable exception being 25th September 1989 and his player ratings in that day's MEN.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

He thought he had good information from his sources. The story wouldn't have been run if not for the information being backed up by the Athletic's main financial man Matt Slater who corroborated it with his own contacts. Matt Slater is a twat but that isn't the point.

Maybe the information was correct. Afterall prestwichblue said he heard the same thing but City turned down a fine.

Fair point. It is possible that City were due to avoid a ban because the source knew Ceferin was looking for a deal but it all went belly up when City would not play ball. In that case the story may have come from the pro-Ceferin camp within UEFA and was just a genuine error by the Athletic. But that's an even bigger reason for Sam not to start guessing now (at least in public).

 

[tolmie's hairdoo]

It'd be far more sensible if none of us commented until the outcome but here we are! Haha.

Haha. I suppose the argument being made by some is that there is a big difference between passing comment, having an informed opinion, than just guessing.

All that does is stimulate discourse.

If Sam doesn't have European football on his plate for two years, his job isn't exactly enhanced.

 

[lancs blue]

CAS should have told UEFA to suck a dick during a preliminary challenge

Disagree with that, CAS were bound by their own regulations - they couldn't rule on the substance of the case until UEFA's AC had completed their investigations and City had launched a fresh appeal.

 

[tonea2003]

He's big enough to know that's a possibility and all that will entail. He's said a few times it's just his opinion.

Quite frankly, my opinion is that a 2 year ban is more likely than CAS throwing this out so I don't really know what else to say ...

out of interest where do you stand on the clubs position of

"the comprehensive body of irrefutable evidence in support of its position."

just bluster?

 

[cjn]

Fair point. It is possible that City were due to avoid a ban because the source knew Ceferin was looking for a deal but it all went belly up when City would not play ball. In that case the story may have come from the pro-Ceferin camp within UEFA and was just a genuine error by the Athletic. But that's an even bigger reason for Sam not to start guessing now (at least in public).

I’m not sure why people are struggling with the distinction between a journalist passing off a guess either as a fact or an informed opinion in an article, and someone just asking for his opinion on Twitter and him giving it with the disclaimer that he doesn’t have any inside info on it.

 

[BillyShears]

Disagree with that, CAS were bound by their own regulations - they couldn't rule on the substance of the case until UEFA's AC had completed their investigations and City had launched a fresh appeal.

When @projectriver sees that post he's going to slap me silly. Of course they were never going to do that. But it sticks in my craw that Football Leaks alone led to all of this. Someone somewhere should've put a stop to it a long time ago. We didn't break any fucking laws, we didn't kill anyone, we basically had an owner who invested in the club with a plan. End of story. The rest is all about their regulations keeping the haves and the haves nots separate and never giving the have nots a chance of joining the haves.

 

[BillyShears]

out of interest where do you stand on the clubs position of

"the comprehensive body of irrefutable evidence in support of its position."

just bluster?

When you go balls out like the club have, then they better be right. Otherwise I want to see heads rolling left right and centre inside the Etihad. I'll repeat, we should not be here. This should've been dealt with without it being shit or bust. The fact it is now shit or bust means we must win for the sake of our credibility.

The damage that will be done if CAS uphold the UEFA ban won't just go forwards, it'll go backwards too. Taint everything the players, coaches, etc have achieved over the last decade. That's a disgrace and would be on all the powers that be at City.

 

[BringBackSwales]

Nah. That’s nonsense. He was asked an opinion and gave it. It’s not like he can delete it if CAS find in our favour.

journalists like the all of us on here live and die by their opinions.

Is it fuck nonsense, he has no idea, which is what he said in his first 2 words, the rest was fucking irrelevant, like most of what he says. Journalists live or die by click bait, and in most cases telling the majority of their audience what they want to hear, which was what the “no nowt” did.

 

[tonea2003]

When you go balls out like the club have, then they better be right. Otherwise I want to see heads rolling left right and centre inside the Etihad. I'll repeat, we should not be here. This should've been dealt with without it being shit or bust. The fact it is now shit or bust means we must win for the sake of our credibility.

The damage that will be done if CAS uphold the UEFA ban won't just go forwards, it'll go backwards too. Taint everything the players, coaches, etc have achieved over the last decade. That's a disgrace and would be on all the powers that be at City.

the big thing for me is the use of the word "irrefutable". in the whole statement it stands out a mile, they could have not used that word and it would of still been a strong statement.
the use of that word is all the eggs in the basket and as you rightly say its shit or bust

 

[slbsn]

When @projectriver sees that post he's going to slap me silly. Of course they were never going to do that. But it sticks in my craw that Football Leaks alone led to all of this. Someone somewhere should've put a stop to it a long time ago. We didn't break any fucking laws, we didn't kill anyone, we basically had an owner who invested in the club with a plan. End of story. The rest is all about their regulations keeping the haves and the haves nots separate and never giving the have nots a chance of joining the haves.

The one about CAS? No slaps from me.

Ordinarily, I'd agree it was more likely CAS would throw out the appeal rather than uphold it. But City know this and the stakes are really high so I have to assume they have very strong feelings that they will prevail. They may be wrong. The club has been consistently wrong before on FFP. Remember the 2014 breaches are now known to have been "huge" (UEFA's word in a CAS case).

If City are wrong this time and we go down to a 2 year ban with everything that brings then a lot of what you write in above is wrong because CAS would have said "you did break the laws, you did conceal, you did mislead, you did make false claims about UEFA's independence and integrity, you may have filed false accounts and its not good enough to have a plan if it is in breach of the rules. Send them down"....

 

[SidJames]

I still think there could be another twist in this story.

The UEFA punishment was so extremely harsh,and OTT. That even if we are not fully acquitted.

i expect it will be reduced in some capacity.

I am still of my own personal opinion though.That the punishment was so harsh,and OTT because UEFA knew they had no case against us,that we would appeal.So vindictively did this to sensationalize,and character assassinate the brand,bastards.

Even if we are fully acquitted,some haters will carry on regardless.

 

[blue b4 the moon]

Not really. If everyone takes a step back and has a little think - he went balls out that we weren't getting banned. It was his first big story at the Athletic and it was a big exclusive as at the time nobody else had it. The fact that it ended up going totally the other way has probably been a chastening experience for him. Remember that whatever you may or may not think of him, he is their City correspondent. He's not in this to deliberately alienate City supporters, far from it. Him giving his opinion and erring on the side of "guilty" makes not a blind bit of difference to me.

In the greater scheme of things there are loads of reporters who are deliberately and constantly going after the negative with City. Sam isn't one of them, so I prefer to save my energy for guys like Miguel and Jonny Liew and that little clique of twats.

He'd have penned the no ban story purely on City being bullish.

From what I've seen he knows less than an average City fan about anything to do with the case.

He's just a waste of internet.