US & Israel attack Iran

1.618034 said:
This is the problem. Trump has no hold on Israel whatsoever.

They will not stop.

Fuck knows where this all ends but it isn't going to be soon.
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Israel is finished whatever the outcome of this current war. Their neighbours, unless they kill all of them, will not forget this. I mean the ordinary folk, not the corrupt Saudi and Emiratí leaders. But when they are overthrown Israel will be friendless in the area and beyond.
 
WT86 said:
What did you think I meant when I called the war a disaster and said Trump should be held to account?
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Meaningless considering your main beef seems to be with the actions of the country holding him to account.

Who else do you have in mind?
WT86 said:
I assume by "your governments" you're referencing both the US and the UK, given the long history of exploitation and interventionism by each. No argument here.
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Yet you still ask "why would the Iranians do this"?
 
Postman Pep said:
Meaningless considering your main beef seems to be with the actions of the country holding him to account.

Who else do you have in mind?

Yet you still ask "why would the Iranians do this"?
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They're holding Trump to account by attacking non-US shipping?
 
moomba said:
Theyre making people realise that theres a cost to being a Trump ally.

Those that dont support USA/Israel wont be restricted. Those that do (unfortunately including the UK) will.

Cant blame them, its a common sense strategy.
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Again they threatened and turned back 3 Chinese ships this morning.
 
WT86 said:
The war is a disaster and in a better world Trump and Netanyahu would be called to account for it. That doesn't change the fact Iran doesn't have the right to respond in the way it has. It's not China or New Zealand's fault or the fault of a tanker full of people trying to do their jobs. If they want to retaliate against the belligerents, i.e. the US and Israel, have at it.
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It’s the US that should have thought of the impact on the likes of New Zealand, not Iran which is simply trying to survive against the greatest military force in human history. Their response is both understandable and rational.

To expect Iran to play with a straight bat against such bullying is utterly absurd.
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
It’s the US that should have thought of the impact on the likes of New Zealand, not Iran which is simply trying to survive against the greatest military force in human history. Their response is both understandable and rational.

To expect Iran to play with a straight bat against such bullying is utterly absurd.
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Absolutely
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
It’s the US that should have thought of the impact on the likes of New Zealand, not Iran which is simply trying to survive against the greatest military force in human history. Their response is both understandable and rational.

To expect Iran to play with a straight bat against such bullying is utterly absurd.
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Of course the US should have. Should have done a lot of things.

Maybe expecting Iran not to attack neutral parties is absurd to you. It's a basic principle to most of the world which is why it's enshrined in law.
 
WT86 said:
Of course the US should have. Should have done a lot of things.

Maybe expecting Iran not to attack neutral parties is absurd to you. It's a basic principle to most of the world which is why it's enshrined in law.
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What did you expect them to do? Ask nicely that Billy Big Bollocks stops bombing them?
 
Postman Pep said:
Of course we should ........ put your own fucking house in order before you lecture others.
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It’s akin to a burglar complaining that the victim whose house he broke into used illegal force on him.

The force used might be objectively illegal, but if the burglar hadn’t broken in then it wouldn’t have had to be deployed.

Actions have consequences, sometimes illegal ones
 
WT86 said:
It's a basic principle to most of the world which is why it's enshrined in law.
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Why should Iran follow international law?

No one else is. Israel and the US aren't. No one at the UN is telling them to stop their illegal war.

Carney had this nailed in January, International law is a sham.

We knew the story of the international rules-based order was partially false that the strongest would exempt themselves when convenient, that trade rules were enforced asymmetrically. And we knew that international law applied with varying rigour depending on the identity of the accused or the victim.​
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If any of the countries being affected by this oil crisis, including us, cared about international law, there would be round the clock calls for the US and Israel to be sanctioned, demands that they stop the war, resolutions being brought forward at the UN, NATO, EU. There'd be a Peacekeeping force deployed to Gaza and Lebanon. All arms sales would be stopped, American and Israeli polticians and billionaires would have their assets seized. The GCC would kick the US out of their countries. We wouldn't be letting the US carpet bomb Tehran from Fairford.

No one gives a fuck about international law. We've made that abundantly clear for decades, and now you act shocked when someone else shows it the same disregard.
 
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gordondaviesmoustache said:
It’s akin to a burglar complaining that the victim whose house he broke into used illegal force on him.

The force used might be objectively illegal, but if the burglar hadn’t broken in then it wouldn’t have had to be deployed.

Actions have consequences, sometimes illegal ones
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And guess what happens to the homeowner who uses illegal force.
 
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