VAR Discussion Thread | 2024/25

So here is Dale Johnson's take on the two decisions at Old Trafford:

"With the Premier League using a 5-centimetre tolerance level in offside decisions, the animation doesn't move directly in line with the players. That's because a player could be seen to be just ahead of the offside line, but be given onside.

The angle is of little use on a decision such as this because it was impossible to see how Foster was offside. What the technology deems to be the final decision will be used, even if the picture doesn't seem definitive."

Wtaf does that mean other than there is no evidence that he was offside at all. We just have to "trust the process" .....

And:

"The only question was whether Anthony was still grabbing Amad's shirt when he entered the area -- a holding offense is applied when it ends rather than when it starts. While the Burnley player and much of Amad's shirt was outside the area, his upper body was inside and that makes it a spot kick."

I may well be wrong but isn't the point of contact determinant in the awarding of a penalty, not the position of the attacker? Or has that changed?
Well that second bit about the holding is complete crap because if it was true why did they overturn the decision in the first half against walker, they should just say we make it up as we go along depending on how we want the result to go.
 
The argument about re reffing the game is not even a question anymore. We know they do and it's just passed into the game through VAR.

It's crazy what we are giving up in the name of VAR....
Consistency from top to the bottom of the game.
Knowledge on what constitutes a foul or handball.
A free flowing game.
Belief in the refs and referees (we trust them even less now).
Less player cheating. Its everywhere now playing for the VAR decision, slightest handballs, corner kick fouls, claim claim just so it can go to the randomnicity of the VAR ref.
Fan enjoyment.
 
Not heard a peep! What a surprise!

I hope this clears it up:

"With the Premier League using a 5-centimetre tolerance level in offside decisions, the animation doesn't move directly in line with the players. That's because a player could be seen to be just ahead of the offside line, but be given onside.

The angle is of little use on a decision such as this because it was impossible to see how Foster was offside. What the technology deems to be the final decision will be used, even if the picture doesn't seem definitive."
 
The argument about re reffing the game is not even a question anymore. We know they do and it's just passed into the game through VAR.

It's crazy what we are giving up in the name of VAR....
Consistency from top to the bottom of the game.
Knowledge on what constitutes a foul or handball.
A free flowing game.
Belief in the refs and referees (we trust them even less now).
Less player cheating. Its everywhere now playing for the VAR decision, slightest handballs, corner kick fouls, claim claim just so it can go to the randomnicity of the VAR ref.
Fan enjoyment.
Correct. Player cheating has got worse not better. Slow motion analysis makes every contact look like a foul.
 
The dips match today.
Arsenal had a shot that took a clear deflection for a corner but the ref gave a goal kick. The players appealed the ref said no then put his finger to his earpiece before giving a corner.
There is no indication that the linesman spoke to him and said he was wrong so who did tell him ?
The 4th official ? I doubt it. He shouldn't be involved in decisions.
Var ? You have to think so even though they shouldn't be involved.

I know, I laughed as I typed it .
And yet min the match before it, Reijnders header clearly hit a Brighton player, but he gave a goal kick, with no touching of his ear-piece.

That being said, I’m all in favour of the VAR just telling him ‘it’s a corner’ if he’s looked at it once and it is clearly, a corner.
 
Tbf I enjoy Jay Bothroyd digging Gallagher out on ref watch every week he rips him to shreds rightly
 
The argument about re reffing the game is not even a question anymore. We know they do and it's just passed into the game through VAR.

It's crazy what we are giving up in the name of VAR....
Consistency from top to the bottom of the game.
Knowledge on what constitutes a foul or handball.
A free flowing game.
Belief in the refs and referees (we trust them even less now).
Less player cheating. Its everywhere now playing for the VAR decision, slightest handballs, corner kick fouls, claim claim just so it can go to the randomnicity of the VAR ref.
Fan enjoyment.
 
The argument about re reffing the game is not even a question anymore. We know they do and it's just passed into the game through VAR.

It's crazy what we are giving up in the name of VAR....
Consistency from top to the bottom of the game.
Knowledge on what constitutes a foul or handball.
A free flowing game.
Belief in the refs and referees (we trust them even less now).
Less player cheating. Its everywhere now playing for the VAR decision, slightest handballs, corner kick fouls, claim claim just so it can go to the randomnicity of the VAR ref.
Fan enjoyment.
It's tragic what's been done to football, and to see those involved in the sport who have had their love of sport so eroded by now, like Murph on talksport the other day, it's hard to watch. Guys like Murph cannot stand or believe that football has been reduced to this shambles, but he is powerless to do anything about it, after trying for a while to get it sacked, he is now resigned to accepting that it will not be removed, and his punishment is to be tasked to comment on endless incidents related to a system that he knows shouldn't exist. It's quite a situation to say the least.

Having incidents discussed like this is unnatural and the body language of those that try to justify VAR and decisions is all wrong. Take Howard Webb, the excessive and dramatic hand motions for example that he does while explaining VAR incidents, while trying to do damage control for the system, does not instill confidence.

The whole "it needs to get better" rather than "it needs to go" has become the popular "acceptable" rallying cry. The desire to keep this in football at all costs, despite the never ending dissatisfaction with it, makes little sense. This is not working, fans can't stand it, it's expensive, it gets loads of decisions wrong that likely would have been called correctly on the pitch. VAR has proven itself to be a catastrophic failure, it's done such harm to our sport. I pray that something is done to put this to an end, but I'm afraid that the egos and the hubris involved by those pushing VAR is too great. And I think it boils down to the fact that getting rid of VAR would reflect so poorly on those behind it, that they'd never recover socially from being behind such a monumental failure, that they cannot allow that to happen, because then they'll be associated with the failed system. So as a result, the entire football world continues to suffer.

The "Ref Watch" show itself is insulting to the average fan, to have Dermy or Howard Webb explain how wrong their system is constantly, as if this is going to do anything but annoy fans even more. This VAR was a wrench thrown into our sport by those with a complete delusion as it pertains to how football works and the need to have it run smoothly. Those involved in VAR and those who continue to push it have so callously disrespected the sport in a way that is unforgivable. The only way they can redeem themselves for what they did is to return football to normal, and live in infamy for not anticipating the problems of their delusional idea and refusing to put it back as it should be.
 
Did you guys hear about the VAR "outage" during the Barcelona Rayo Vallecano Match? What a shambles.


It's hard to put into words the reaction to what happened here.

Pedri says that during the game he did not know whether VAR was working or not, a situation he feels can’t be repeated in Spain’s top flight. "I didn’t know when there was or wasn’t a VAR. At first they said there wasn’t one, halfway through the match there was, then again there wasn’t... We have to improve it so that the competition is much more serious."

Yes Pedri, I would agree that the footballing competition needs to be more serious. It was serious and well functioning before VAR was introduced. You would think that the VAR outage would render the result illegal. If the match had been contractually agreed upon under the conditions of having VAR, then VAR failing and not being able to be used would violate the contract.

But it's as if nothing matters anymore, VAR not working one half, then working another half, then not working again, but on we go like nothing happened.


Think about how much electrical power is wasted by maintaining VAR throughout the world, especially in places like Spain that maybe don't have the best electrical supply.


^^This article points out that MEDIAPRO, the company who administers VAR in LaLiga, could not even determine the cause of the outage.

Yamal's penalty put Barça 1-0 up and led to furious scenes on the sidelines as Rayo coach Iñigo Pérez contested the ruling.

"I'm ashamed of my reaction on the touchlines after the penalty was awarded," Pérez said after the game in an interview with broadcaster DAZN. "It was the result of frustration. Referees make mistakes and that's OK. What bothers me is that today the players had five minutes of VAR and five minutes without it and so on
."

Perez went on to say in no uncertain terms -

"Everyone that's played knows the influence it has on the players, referees and assistants now... It's a different game."

^^It is a different game, and it took this VAR outrage for Perez to express that. The game that we love, or loved, no longer exists. This is obviously an untenable situation, to have our "football" replaced with this charade.

Pérez also conceded the issue could have been "our club's fault" as he suggested games should be halted if VAR fails in the future.

"We need better protocol for these situations," he added. "My anger is over the lack of protocol and the lack of efficiency.

"It's not a good image for our league. If VAR is not working, we should suspend the game until it is."


The fact that the match doesn't automatically get suspended, or delayed, with the monitor not working shows that there is no backup plan to what would happen in such a scenario. Why for example couldn't they just use an alternate battery powered monitor or tablet to have the ref review the decision in the event that the main monitor goes out?

This reinforces how poorly designed VAR is and how it is so overly relied on that everyone loses their minds when it stops working. It is a complete embarrassment for something like this to happen and to see the kind of chaos it causes.
 
It's tragic what's been done to football, and to see those involved in the sport who have had their love of sport so eroded by now, like Murph on talksport the other day, it's hard to watch. Guys like Murph cannot stand or believe that football has been reduced to this shambles, but he is powerless to do anything about it, after trying for a while to get it sacked, he is now resigned to accepting that it will not be removed, and his punishment is to be tasked to comment on endless incidents related to a system that he knows shouldn't exist. It's quite a situation to say the least.

Having incidents discussed like this is unnatural and the body language of those that try to justify VAR and decisions is all wrong. Take Howard Webb, the excessive and dramatic hand motions for example that he does while explaining VAR incidents, while trying to do damage control for the system, does not instill confidence.

The whole "it needs to get better" rather than "it needs to go" has become the popular "acceptable" rallying cry. The desire to keep this in football at all costs, despite the never ending dissatisfaction with it, makes little sense. This is not working, fans can't stand it, it's expensive, it gets loads of decisions wrong that likely would have been called correctly on the pitch. VAR has proven itself to be a catastrophic failure, it's done such harm to our sport. I pray that something is done to put this to an end, but I'm afraid that the egos and the hubris involved by those pushing VAR is too great. And I think it boils down to the fact that getting rid of VAR would reflect so poorly on those behind it, that they'd never recover socially from being behind such a monumental failure, that they cannot allow that to happen, because then they'll be associated with the failed system. So as a result, the entire football world continues to suffer.

The "Ref Watch" show itself is insulting to the average fan, to have Dermy or Howard Webb explain how wrong their system is constantly, as if this is going to do anything but annoy fans even more. This VAR was a wrench thrown into our sport by those with a complete delusion as it pertains to how football works and the need to have it run smoothly. Those involved in VAR and those who continue to push it have so callously disrespected the sport in a way that is unforgivable. The only way they can redeem themselves for what they did is to return football to normal, and live in infamy for not anticipating the problems of their delusional idea and refusing to put it back as it should be.
They said it would stop the Maradona handballs, or lampards non-goal.

They've taken over the game
 
I hope this clears it up:

"With the Premier League using a 5-centimetre tolerance level in offside decisions, the animation doesn't move directly in line with the players. That's because a player could be seen to be just ahead of the offside line, but be given onside.

The angle is of little use on a decision such as this because it was impossible to see how Foster was offside. What the technology deems to be the final decision will be used, even if the picture doesn't seem definitive."
10 lines and a lot of words.
'We just make it up' is 5 words and says exactly the same thing.

To be fully accurate you could use 13 words
'We just make it up so that it favours the rags and dips'
 

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