Veganism

[BlueTangerine]

So you'd rather they were killed at birth as is the norm? Suppose a gradual decimation of all live stock is also ok, shame for the ones that starve to death, but if it's a long slow death probably works ok, still not sure if you've ever worked with animals in this context, I don't like to prejudge

Are you saying no life is horrific enough, that no matter the circumstance, being born, exploited, tortured, and killed, it is still worth living? and why would they starve to death?

 

[andyhinch]

What on earth are... Sorry but none of your posts seem to make sense. Maybe I'm missing something, but they wouldn't be killed at birth. And they wouldn't starve to death. I'm not sure if you're just on the WUM or if you actually believe what you're saying.

So bulls aren't killed at birth?

 

[Yaya_Tony]

I didn't expect everyone to agree with me. But if you believe animals feel pain, and your tastebuds and convenience are more important, then call yourself a selfish twat and move on.

my general health and wellbeing come first. Fish, pork, lamb and steak are just as important to humans as potatoes, pasta, rice and tomatoes.

 

[andyhinch]

Are you saying no life is horrific enough, that no matter the circumstance, being born, exploited, tortured, and killed, it is still worth living? and why would they starve to death?

Who would feed them, use animal husbandry best practice to look after them?

 

[BlueTangerine]

my general health and wellbeing come first. Fish, pork, lamb and steak are just as important to humans as potatoes, pasta, rice and tomatoes.

I am not sure that's right to be honest. (There is a lot of evidence to suggest that we are at our healthiest with no meat at all) but even if it was right and it was scientifically proven that being vegan knocked 5 years off your life. I would still say you shouldn't exploit and eat animals.

 

[Yaya_Tony]

I am not sure that's right to be honest. (There is a lot of evidence to suggest that we are at our healthiest with no meat at all) but even if it was right and it was scientifically proven that being vegan knocked 5 years off your life. I would still say you shouldn't exploit and eat animals.

Who are you to tell me what I shouldn't eat? If I want to boil a fucking egg are you going to come round and stop me? If I want to roast a big piece of gammon are you gonna be knocking on? If I want to fry some steak and tomato what then? Some cod and lemon with garlic in the microwave. Or are you just full of hot air because you think you're right.

 

[BlueTangerine]

Who would feed them, use animal husbandry best practice to look after them?

We needn't get involved. We needn't play God. As was said, the world won't go vegan over night. As demand reduces, so will the animals being produced. When/if eating meat is illegal or simply not the done thing anymore, then we might have to use controlling methods, who knows. The point is life is cruel enough without us creating beings whose sole purpose is to be born, exploited, suffer, die and then get eaten.

 

[BlueTangerine]

Who are you to tell me what I shouldn't eat? If I want to boil a fucking egg are you going to come round and stop me? If I want to roast a big piece of gammon are you gonna be knocking on? If I want to fry some steak and tomato what then? Some cod and lemon with garlic in the microwave. Or are you just full of hot air because you think you're right.

Yeah mate. I am going to knock on....

I am making an argument/offering opinion on an internet forum. If you are unconvinced, then you are unconvinced. Big whoop-de-doo. I think you're selfish... and again, diddums.

 

[andyhinch]

We needn't get involved. We needn't play God. As was said, the world won't go vegan over night. As demand reduces, so will the animals being produced. When/if eating meat is illegal or simply not the done thing anymore, then we might have to use controlling methods, who knows. The point is life is cruel enough without us creating beings whose sole purpose is to be born, exploited, suffer, die and then get eaten.

I'll gladly take you to a farm/let you hunt, talk to people in the industry, I do find your morality clouds your judgement somewhat, I still assume your not a country type

 

[SWP's back]

Well it's true that there are a lot of extremely painful procedures carried out on animals in factory farming. For instance, piglets are often castrated with no anaesthetic. If they watch it happening, I expect most people would agree that it's not unreasonable to describe this as
'torture' (or at least, it's a 'torturous' experience for the piglet).

However, I do think it is unreasonable to refer to someone you disagree with as a 'deluded fuck wit', especially when you're demonstrably wrong on the point in question.

Still waiting for this scientific consensus.

 

[SWP's back]

Yeah you've said many times. What is your view? What will be will be? Don't change anything! Nature knows what it's doing!

I very much doubt you will change anything either way. So you may as well have a nice bacon sandwich and che the fuck up.

 

[Damocles]

Yeah I know mate, I disagree.

Ok I'll rephrase.

The scientific consensus is that the animals that you quoted do not have the mental capacity to have wants.

You're giving them characteristics that are not there and basing an entire argument out of it. You're essentially having a religious debate.

 

[BlueTangerine]

I very much doubt you will change anything either way. So you may as well have a nice bacon sandwich and che the fuck up.

:) Yeah! that'll cheer me up. But you are right. I won't change much, I don't go on marches or anything, but I'm doing my lickle bit in my lickle corner. Things can change though mate. I don't believe they're dumb. I think they can feel, and I think they understand the difference of being stroked on the head, or having their nuts chopped off.
Obviously even if it was scientifically proved tomorrow that animal's 'pain experience' was exactly the same as ours, hardly anyone would give a shit, but slowly it would be phased out, because we are humans with humanity and everything.

 

[Damocles]

There is a lot of evidence to suggest that we are at our healthiest with no meat at all

There is absolutely no evidence at all to suggest this.

@FantasyIreland can you weigh in here please?

 

[Yaya_Tony]

Yeah mate. I am going to knock on....

I am making an argument/offering opinion on an internet forum. If you are unconvinced, then you are unconvinced. Big whoop-de-doo. I think you're selfish... and again, diddums.

Diddums my arse. You're talking through your arse, full of shit and you fucking know it.

 

[BlueTangerine]

Ok I'll rephrase.

The scientific consensus is that the animals that you quoted do not have the mental capacity to have wants.

You're giving them characteristics that are not there and basing an entire argument out of it. You're essentially having a religious debate.

Ooh I wouldn't want to do that. By want I mean I think they can tell the difference between pain and pleasure.

 

[SWP's back]

I didn't expect everyone to agree with me. But if you believe animals feel pain, and your tastebuds and convenience are more important, then call yourself a selfish twat and move on.

Only if you call yourself a wet, limp handwringing busy ****. For balance b

 

[smudgedj]

A necessary evil? People like nice teeth.

I use mine to rip flesh apart.

 

[SWP's back]

I am not sure that's right to be honest. (There is a lot of evidence to suggest that we are at our healthiest with no meat at all) but even if it was right and it was scientifically proven that being vegan knocked 5 years off your life. I would still say you shouldn't exploit and eat animals.

Where's this evidence?

 

[Yaya_Tony]

I use mine to rip flesh apart.

Instead of bananas or carrots?