Yep-the ship is about Manchester's trading links and predates the Ship Canal.
On the bee - the idea of including a bee was discussed at length in the consultation process and those that filled in the questionnaires, attended the talks etc. were encouraged to give their views on it. The bee was not popular with fans and didn't get many people saying it should be included then. The bee is, probably, the most important Manchester symbol but it has never been an emblem of MCFC. It's important that Manchester uses it but fans made it clear that it wasn't regarded as a MCFC image etc.
Part of the reason the club went to the lengths it did to explain the significance of each element in all the badges and those associated with Manchester was to ensure the badge had genuine connections with the club's fans, history, identity and drive. The bee's a great symbol but fans overwhelming chose over elements - I think the stars got more votes at the time! Personally, I wouldn't have had the rose in the badge because it was introduced by the new board in 1972 that led to Swales taking power, but that's only my opinion. That's why the consultation was set up - to get majority feelings.
Thanks, Gary. I'm on the same page as you, the ship, shield, 3 rivers are iconic symbols of Manchester and Manchester City, so it was essential they were included.
I grew up with the rose badge, but as I've said, the rose no longer feels relevant to Manchester for me. However, I've seen a mock up of the current badge without the rose and it does look a bit plain, like something is missing. I think the rose being included adds something aetherically to the badge, and for me I see the symbolism as a nod to our old badge as opposed to representing Lancashire.
Regarding the bee, I'm really fond of it's symbolism and have been since I was a kid. I and others tried to do a badge design with it included and it just never worked. On the sides it looked too cluttered, in the middle it just didn't look like a City badge.
Perhaps it's best that it wasn't used on our badge, because then perhaps it wouldn't have gone on to gain even more significance around the city in recent times if it became more associated with the football club.
I think it would be a great "secondary symbol" for City to use in future though. The modern football world requires simplified secondary icons for the socks, backs of shirts etc. United have the devil on its own, Arsenal have the cannon, Liverpool the liver bird, whereas we just have "City" written. I don't think there would be too many complaints if we had the bee replacing "City" on the socks, back of the neck of the shirt, or bottom of the numbers.
Perhaps we could do this for cup finals in future, it's a real shame that we've stopped wearing the CoA in cup finals, don't you think?
