John Stones - 2017/18 performances

[Andrew___K]

For me, Otamendi is better in bringing the ball up and making decisive passes. Otamendi has made so many passes across the lines that have led to dangerous plays (like DeBruyne's goal vs Chelsea). I don't recall Stones making one (although I'm sure he has but not w/ the frequency of Otamendi).

You're probably not attentive enough, Stones has made a lot of penetrating passes this season. There's little or no doubt that he's better than Ota in this respect.

 

[Dax777]

For me, Otamendi is better in bringing the ball up and making decisive passes. Otamendi has made so many passes across the lines that have led to dangerous plays (like DeBruyne's goal vs Chelsea). I don't recall Stones making one (although I'm sure he has but not w/ the frequency of Otamendi).

Yep. You are absolutely right. Stones a more natural footballer. And technically superior. But Otamendi brings the ball out better and is more decisive.

Its really a Debryune vs Silva issue. Silva is much more natural and eye pleasing, Debryune is rougher, riskier but more aggressive.

As a natural passer, I'd take Stones. As the more decisive passer Otamendi without a doubt.

 

[Dax777]

You're probably not attentive enough, Stones has made a lot of penetrating passes this season. There's little or no doubt that he's better than Ota in this respect.

He hasn't made as many as Otamendi though. So while your claim about Stones is true, the conclusions you've reached are incorrect.

Otamendi has clearly made more incisive and attacking passes than Stones. That people don't know this speaks to how great the bias against Otamendi has been.

http://www.squawka.com/comparison-m...ey_passes/chances_created/avg_pass_length#avg

Above is a comparison of all their passing stats. Otamendi as @nickamon has correctly stated, is clearly a more decisive and incisive passer than Stones.

 

[Andrew___K]

He hasn't made as many as Otamendi though. So while your claim about Stones is true, the conclusions you've reached are incorrect.

Otamendi has clearly made more incisive and attacking passes than Stones. That people don't know this speaks to how great the bias against Otamendi has been.

http://www.squawka.com/comparison-matrix#premier_league/2017/2018/nicolás_otamendi/819/819/9350/0/p|premier_league/2017/2018/john_stones/819/819/4207/37/p#possession_score/total_forward_passes/successful_passes/pass_completion/key_passes/chances_created/avg_pass_length#avg

Above is a comparison of all their passing stats. Otamendi as @nickamon has correctly stated, is clearly a more decisive and incisive passer than Stones.

I get an impression that Stones makes more difficult and 'creative' passes splitting the lines, that can't be properly caught by stats (maybe by 'packing' numbers, but I don't know where to get them. Do you?). On the other hand, my impression is subjective and can be wrong.

 

[Dax777]

I get an impression that Stones makes more difficult and 'creative' passes splitting the lines, that can't be properly caught by stats (maybe by 'packing' numbers, but I don't know where to get them. Do you?). On the other hand, my impression is subjective and can be wrong.

I assure you its just an impression. Line splitting passes are Otamendi's strength. I guess he has the advantage of playing on the left with his right foot. But even if you account for that advantage, I think he is simply more aggressive and thus just better.

I know its wierd for people to realize, But Stones does more ball rotation passing. I.e what Yaya used to do with the "1 touch short pass, move and retrieve" stuff.

Otamendi on the other hand often aggressively carries the ball forward then make a defense splitting pass. He also commits more errors too because of it. Hence why Stones pass% is 97 to Otas 91.

But when you look at forward passes, key passes, passes into the attacking 3rd etc. Its not even close. Otamendi is leaps and bounds ahead.

 

[SebastianBlue]

I assure you its just an impression. Line splitting passes are Otamendi's strength. I guess he has the advantage of playing on the left with his right foot. But even if you account for that advantage, I think he is simply more aggressive and thus just better.

I know its wierd for people to realize it. But So es does more ball rotation passing. I.e what Yaya used to do with the 1 touch short pass move and retrieve stuff.

Otamendi actually often aggressively carries the ball forward then make a defense splitting pass. He also commits more errors too because of it. Hence why Stones pass% is 97 to Otas 91.

But when you look at forward passes, key passes, passes into the attacking 3rd etc. Its not even close. Otamendi is leaps ahead.

I think someone needs to watch a compilation of Stones’ passes this season to verify if those Sqwuaka statistics are accurate.

I absolutely support using statistics for empirical/predictive analysis (as it was one of my focuses of study and is the basis for my profession, so I see the world in that lens) but only if the underlying data is sound. And those look suspect, especially the Chances Created metric.

 

[nickamon]

To clarify, I'm not knocking Stones as he's been excellent this year. I only took a slight exception to the comment that Otamendi has been deputizing for him with bringing the ball up when I honestly think Otamendi does it better than Stones. Stones does it too, but for me not was well and as frequent as Otamendi. Glad to have both in this form!

 

[Dax777]

To clarify, I'm not knocking Stones as he's been excellent this year. I only took a slight exception to the comment that Otamendi has been deputizing for him with bringing the ball up when I honestly think Otamendi does it better than Stones. Stones does it too, but for me not was well and as frequent as Otamendi. Glad to have both in this form!

Absolutely. With Stones we just pass it out of the back better coz his positioning and organization is great.

But in terms of linking defense to attack Otamendi had always done more of that since day 1.

 

[Jonsilfab]

 

[Fame Monster]

Good news to have him back. Just hope he gets back to the level he was at asap because his defending was improving week after week earlier in the season.