My latest research on Manchester's football birth

Thanks Gary, another very informative article.

It was just as well that Manchester FC had got in first with that name when Newton Heath tried to "re-brand" themselves as the Manchester club!
 
BUMP

The article is free for a limited period here http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/14660970.2016.1276238. As it's free to download you may as well give it a brief scan. It should be of interest to rugby and lacrosse fans, as well as anyone interested in Manchester and football. Get it while you can. I think the free period is only for the rest of this month and the more reads/downloads it gets the better the opportunity for further articles/research on Manchester, football and so on. Thanks

p.s. I've also co-authored an article on the origins of soccer in Stoke which is also free for a short time here http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/14660970.2016.1276247 If you know any stoke fans then please let them know. Thanks
 
Excellent read that Gary.

I do take slight issue with your note 12..

Born in Ashton under lyne and raised in Stalybridge I would never consider myself to be Mancunian. I would, however, say East of Manchester before being asked to be more specific.

I identify more with Lancashire than Manchester.

However, I totally agree that we would identify more with Manchester than Stockport (SK postcode) and definitely not with Chester.

When I was working in Northenden in the late 80's people from work were of the opinion that Wythenshawe, where most of them lived was in Manchester, but Stalybridge was in some far flung land. ( it's about a mile further from mcr town hall).
 
Carver said:
Excellent read that Gary.

I do take slight issue with your note 12..

Born in Ashton under lyne and raised in Stalybridge I would never consider myself to be Mancunian. I would, however, say East of Manchester before being asked to be more specific.

I identify more with Lancashire than Manchester.

However, I totally agree that we would identify more with Manchester than Stockport (SK postcode) and definitely not with Chester.

When I was working in Northenden in the late 80's people from work were of the opinion that Wythenshawe, where most of them lived was in Manchester, but Stalybridge was in some far flung land. ( it's about a mile further from mcr town hall).
Click to expand...

Thanks for the comments. The point I guess I was trying to make was that Manchester is a bit more fluid than city boundaries suggest. I went on about this in the piece because I had previously been criticised for using the definition of '8 miles from St Ann's Square' as a researcher into Lancashire football was basically saying my research should only focus on the city of Manchester and that by mentioning outside of the city I was someway giving Manchester credit for something it ought not to have. My argument was that the Manchester region had connections that were not purely county specific, so Wythenshawe would be excluded from a Manchester 'city only' piece - as would of course West Gorton at the time of St Mark's formation, which makes the Manchester city boundary a nonsense at that time. Oh, it's all too complex I guess, but I went in to so much detail about what Manchester is/was in this article simply because of that criticism. For me, if the Manchester FA at the time said they represented 8 miles from Manchester city centre then I felt that was a good enough definition.

I totally agree with you that if you're from Stalybridge, Ashton etc. then that's your birth place and county, but even that gets complicated I guess with the slum clearance programme of the 50s-70s (hence my comments about Hyde although I couldn't go into details about why many Hattersley residents felt they were Mancunian - another article there perhaps?).

Thanks again for the comments. The article will not be free for ever and so if anyone wants to download it please do so asap (tweets and facebook links to the article help as well of course): http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/14660970.2016.1276238?src=recsys
 
Carver said:
Excellent read that Gary.

I do take slight issue with your note 12..

Born in Ashton under lyne and raised in Stalybridge I would never consider myself to be Mancunian. I would, however, say East of Manchester before being asked to be more specific.

I identify more with Lancashire than Manchester.

However, I totally agree that we would identify more with Manchester than Stockport (SK postcode) and definitely not with Chester.

When I was working in Northenden in the late 80's people from work were of the opinion that Wythenshawe, where most of them lived was in Manchester, but Stalybridge was in some far flung land. ( it's about a mile further from mcr town hall).
Click to expand...
Im 51 ,52 in a few weeks,Im Ashton u Lyne born n bred ,but I feel more Manc than Lanc, I tell people when abroad ( if they ask where in Manchester are you from )Im from East Manchester rather than Lancs,even though Im a proud Lancastrian ,But even central Manchester older folk will still consider themselves Lancastrian too I guess
 
Gary James said:
Thanks for the comments. The point I guess I was trying to make was that Manchester is a bit more fluid than city boundaries suggest. I went on about this in the piece because I had previously been criticised for using the definition of '8 miles from St Ann's Square' as a researcher into Lancashire football was basically saying my research should only focus on the city of Manchester and that by mentioning outside of the city I was someway giving Manchester credit for something it ought not to have. My argument was that the Manchester region had connections that were not purely county specific, so Wythenshawe would be excluded from a Manchester 'city only' piece - as would of course West Gorton at the time of St Mark's formation, which makes the Manchester city boundary a nonsense at that time. Oh, it's all too complex I guess, but I went in to so much detail about what Manchester is/was in this article simply because of that criticism. For me, if the Manchester FA at the time said they represented 8 miles from Manchester city centre then I felt that was a good enough definition.

I totally agree with you that if you're from Stalybridge, Ashton etc. then that's your birth place and county, but even that gets complicated I guess with the slum clearance programme of the 50s-70s (hence my comments about Hyde although I couldn't go into details about why many Hattersley residents felt they were Mancunian - another article there perhaps?).

Thanks again for the comments. The article will not be free for ever and so if anyone wants to download it please do so asap (tweets and facebook links to the article help as well of course): http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/14660970.2016.1276238?src=recsys
Click to expand...
During the 1980's I worked in Hattersley for a few years,everyone I met was from Manchester and Im not just saying this but,everyone was a city fan,its probably changed a hell of a lot now with all their success since the 1990's..
 
blue44 said:
During the 1980's I worked in Hattersley for a few years,everyone I met was from Manchester and Im not just saying this but,everyone was a city fan,its probably changed a hell of a lot now with all their success since the 1990's..
Click to expand...
Yes, I spent first 18 years of my life living in Hattersley. Most families had moved from Gorton-Bradford areas of east Manchester and so took their football allegiances with them when it was built in 60s.
 
@Gary James
Could you please help me win an argument, I work with a load of rags and dippers and the other day I congratulated the rags on having a scouser as leading scorer ,then added it was appropriate being a scouse team.
Have I imagined it or have I read it was the scouse railway workers working for LYR that formed newton heath ?
Or is there another scouse connection ?
 
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