General Election June 8th

[The perfect fumble]

Course you have.

Oh, a whiff of jealousy me thinks.

 

[KenTheLandlord]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40057115

The simple fact is that their plans aren't fully costed but you just won't admit that. The Tories are no better on this matter.

See what I did there??? A Tory voter disagreeing with an aspect of the manifesto of the party that they are going to vote for. Give it a go, you know you can do it :)

Those criticisms have come from the IFS and if you don't agree with the IFS you are wrong, is that you are saying?
It has flaws and i would not put too many eggs, if any in that basket.

 

[Chippy_boy]

Oh, a whiff of jealousy me thinks.

That would be it.

 

[Machiavelli]

Oh, a whiff of jealousy me thinks.

Or a whiff of pine?

 

[The perfect fumble]

That would be it.

Comes from getting a grant and no fees to go to university, I bloody love Harold Wilson!

 

[KenTheLandlord]

I love the way the arguments against Labours plans ALWAYS come down to well how is it going to be paid for. We are the 5th richest country in the world. We can afford:

92 billion per annum I'm corporate benefits

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/jul/07/corporate-welfare-a-93bn-handshake

We can afford an unusable nuclear arsenal which we don't have the red button for (but don't worry Donald trump has it in his desk)

We can afford countless pointless military interventions

We can afford to bail out banks that gambled with our money and lost

We can afford to give MPs an 11% pay rise as nurses take a cut

We can afford a highly expensive royal family some of which we pay and wouldn't know them if we passed them in the street

We can afford a 15 billion pounds new tube line across London because they're short of transport options

We can afford to pull out of the common market because no deal apparently is better than a bad deal

But

The prospect of investing in our young, investing in our health, investing in much needed infrastructure across all of Britain, bringing our public services out of the hands of carpet baggers, investing in arts, in sport in looking after our elderly, looking after our disabled, investing in housing stock so 30 year olds an live away from mum and dad ffs, investing in the technology of the future is an OUTRAGE.

We need to get a grip. We are being had. Only the blind can't see that

 

[SWP's back]

She's a spineless Conservative, which is a bit of a tautology.

Yes they are known for bending to the will of the people and not making unpopular decisions.

 

[SWP's back]

Oh, a whiff of jealousy me thinks.

I'm not jealous.

Just putting it out there.

 

[Chris in London]

Can you get gradations of tautology?

To a certain extent.

 

[The perfect fumble]

I'm not jealous.

Just putting it out there.

I'm jealous of you though.

I needed to say that.

 

[The perfect fumble]

Yes they are known for bending to the will of the people and not making unpopular decisions.

Oh yeah, they bend to the people alright, their people.

 

[Chippy_boy]

Those criticisms have come from the IFS and if you don't agree with the IFS you are wrong, is that you are saying?
It has flaws and i would not put too many eggs, if any in that basket.

Here's a basket for you Ken:

The country is about to enter into a prolonged phase of significant turmoil over Brexit. There's clouds looming on the horizon. Countless foreign businesses, based here in the UK are sitting waiting, considering their options. They are worried about how they will continue to attract the necessary skilled workers. They are wondering how Brexit will impact upon their ability to export to the EU, which is why many of them are based in the UK in the first place. They are worried about how they are going to contain their costs in order to remain competitive.

And Labour are proposing to unilaterally increase corporation tax to 7 points above the European average.

How many eggs do you want in that lunatic basket? Do you think it's just possibly the wrong thing to do? Do you imagine for one moment that we should be doing everything possible to encourage the likes of Nissan, Honda, Toyota, UBS, Deutche Bank, Astra Zeneca, GSK, Fujitsu, Mitsubishi, Hitachi to stay in the UK? Do you think that might be a good idea?

Or should we clobber them with more tax and employment costs? Which do you think is a good idea right now?

Bear in mind, if this hair brain labour idea falls flat, there's an even bigger great big coach and horses hole through their costings and spending plans.

 

[SWP's back]

I'm jealous of you though.

I needed to say that.

Don't be.

It's 46 degrees here today but with 50 mph gusts. It's like being sandblasted in an oven. And the wife has brought home another fucking stray kitten.

 

[SWP's back]

Oh yeah, they bend to the people alright, their people.

That's true enough.

 

[Chippy_boy]

I'm beginning to think you are actually clinically insane.

 

[grunge]

Plus the extra council tax

If it happens, I dont beleive a word from the sun and the mail which seem to be the only ones reporting it would be a rise.

Plus the price rises due to increased labour costs

How is that relivent to someones personal salary?

Plus the the price rises due to the falling pound
Plus their underperforming pension

As is the same for everyone.

And the biggy...Plus the further tax increases when the corporation tax increases don't deliver 1/4 of the claimed revenue

Its an assumption that cant really be guessed at.

True enough. What's your point?

If you want better services for everyone, its got to be paid for, Labour have chosen a tax hike for the top 5% of earners for a big chunk of that. so the vast top 5% will complain. Not a lot else to say. From a manifesto point of view though, its actually quite clever, preching tothe 95% in the lower brackets.


I should add, Im not a labour supporter, But I just dont see 5p extra on the top 5% of earners as much of an issue, I do admit I would have actually doubled that 80k as 160k+ is the top 1%. and most of the extra revinue will come from that bracket anyway.

 

[Chippy_boy]

If it happens, I dont beleive a word from the sun and the mail which seem to be the only ones reporting it would be a rise.


How is that relivent to someones personal salary?


As is the same for everyone.


Its an assumption that cant really be guessed at.


If you want better services for everyone, its got to be paid for, Labour have chosen a tax hike for the top 5% of earners for a big chunk of that. so the vast top 5% will complain. Not a lot else to say. From a manifesto point of view though, its actually quite clever, preching tothe 95% in the lower brackets.

My point, which clearly went spectacularly over your head is that one's affluence is defined by income minus costs, not just income. It's no use saying people won't have to pay any more tax and that's fine. If the price of everything goes up, you're worse off. If your pension is trashed, your worse off. Labour would have everyone believe hardly anyone will be worse off, but actually this is not true, most people will be.

And the biggy...Plus the further tax increases when the corporation tax increases don't deliver 1/4 of the claimed revenue

Its an assumption that cant really be guessed at.

But we can guess it won't raise anything like what Labour pretend.

 

[grunge]

My point, which clearly went spectacularly over your head is that one's affluence is defined by income minus costs, not just income. It's no use saying people won't have to pay any more tax and that's fine. If the price of everything goes up, you're worse off. If your pension is trashed, your worse off. Labour would have everyone believe hardly anyone will be worse off, but actually this is not true, most people will be.

Went over my head? really?. its exactly what I said in the 1st post you quoted. You seem to just want to argue for the sake of it.

 

[SWP's back]

Went over my head? really?. its exactly what I said in the 1st post you quoted. You seem to just want to argue for the sake of it.

Oh no he doesn't.

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

Here's a basket for you Ken:

The country is about to enter into a prolonged phase of significant turmoil over Brexit. There's clouds looming on the horizon. Countless foreign businesses, based here in the UK are sitting waiting, considering their options. They are worried about how they will continue to attract the necessary skilled workers. They are wondering how Brexit will impact upon their ability to export to the EU, which is why many of them are based in the UK in the first place. They are worried about how they are going to contain their costs in order to remain competitive.

And Labour are proposing to unilaterally increase corporation tax to 7 points above the European average.

How many eggs do you want in that lunatic basket? Do you think it's just possibly the wrong thing to do? Do you imagine for one moment that we should be doing everything possible to encourage the likes of Nissan, Honda, Toyota, UBS, Deutche Bank, Astra Zeneca, GSK, Fujitsu, Mitsubishi, Hitachi to stay in the UK? Do you think that might be a good idea?

Or should we clobber them with more tax and employment costs? Which do you think is a good idea right now?

Bear in mind, if this hair brain labour idea falls flat, there's an even bigger great big coach and horses hole through their costings and spending plans.

Whilst some of that is valid you need to stop with the European average for corporation tax. IF those companies were to relocate they are NOT going to Romania, Bulgaria, Poland, Latvia and Lithuania. The likely suspects, France, Germany, Italy, Belgium all have corporation tax above the rate proposed by the Labour Party.