Another new Brexit thread

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mcfc1632 said:
I have been looking at the facts since the early 90s - my views on the EU were formed many years before 2015.

I can readily see how people with the appropriate pre-disposition and desire to push a narrative can make the comparisons you do - god knows we have had it for over 3 years from many posters on here - although I credit you with setting a new benchmark.

When you say things like:

"I feel how uncomfortable you're becoming with this realisation.. and

"Don't feel ashamed"

You are just making yourself look a bit childish IMO - crack on

If you want to try and demonstrate some genuine analysis rather than all this nonsense

Have another go at:

"Certainly the EU have no need to find a solution for the backstop - and neither have the UK

Do you understand why?"

The attempt you just made was irrelevant to the question asked - try reading it first
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I don't want to throw oil on the fire, but I understand his observations of the tactics being used in the UK and across the pond, but I also understand your misgivings at the over use of the word 'Nazi'.

However just bare in mind @mcfc1632 that I and others find the casual use of the word 'weaponised', thrown in at every opportunity when talking about the border and the GFA, as not only highly subjective, but also from my perspective lacking in understanding of the psyche of the people here North and South.

We all use hyperbole, I appreciate that. You put forward a good argument despite me not agreeing with it.
So does Dibble, even if the terminology could be tempered a bit, in some other opinions.
 
BobKowalski said:
Corbyn’s letter

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url
 
SebastianBlue said:
5 years for me will be September next year!

And the recovery will be extremely slow, as we’re about to see a world recession (only worse than the last) which is partly independent of the outcome of Brexit, unfortunately. It’s just that a No Deal Brexit will make things much worse at exactly the wrong time.
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I'd be aiming to stay put for 5 years from this point personally, but if you were coming back now you get more £ from your $ than ever before. Its people going the other way that will struggle.
 
BobKowalski said:
It had to come to a head one way or another.

But sidelining Parliament, or at least attempting to, is just signalling you don’t have the votes to carry out effective governance and if Johnson can’t do that then what is the point of the Government? For ‘no deal’ legislation has to be passed. For a ‘deal’ legislation has to be passed. Limiting the time Parliament can sit to do either of these is an odd way to run a country.
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I had to re-read that

The first 3 times I read@

"It had to come to an head one way or another.

But until now we Remainers were confident that no matter what hurdles would need to be overcome - we could at least be certain that Brexit would eventually be stopped.

FFS - for the first time since 2016 I am nervous and want to express my righteous outrage.

Strange how recent fucking around with parliamentary tradition and procedures that were in favour of Remain did not attract the same level of angst from you
 
Ban-jani said:
No deal was the most emphatically defeated way forward in Parliament and Parliament must always be sovereign.

By all means leave but let’s leave with a deal.

That’s the mandate.
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well all those moaning bastards should say they will vote for the withdrawal agreement then or releasing a joint statement saying which SPECIFIC bits of the withdrawal agreement need to change and how and release it to the eu and pm so we know what will get through by 31/10 because that’s what we all want.

But it’s much more funny to play politics and say bollox like you will do everything possible to prevent no deal. When there is One thing which is actually easy to do and will achieve their ends.

The hard line erg must be pissing themselves laughing at this tactic .

Even Boris was pragmatic and voted for the withdrawal agreement in the end which meant we would have left with a deal. But no he is the bad guy nutter who wants to leave with no deal.

Remind me again how did jezza, the snp and Lib Dem’s vote? Yet they are the ones saying Boris is a hard line no deal person. HE VOTED FOR LEAVING WITH THE DEAL!
 
Saddleworth2 said:
I don’t think it will. The outcomes:
He either gets overridden by parliament but has done enough to act the arch brexiter to and steal Farage’s clothes and win a general election
He gets a slight refresh of the current deal and blackmails parliament into passing it as they believe the alternative is worse
He gets his no deal Brexit and still has enough support to win a general election against a divided ‘remain’ set of parties.
As someone on LBC said, reprehensible but cute move from no10.
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Good summary - that's how I see it

Clever fucker (or at least his advisor is)
 
cptaidan88 said:
I'd be aiming to stay put for 5 years from this point personally, but if you were coming back now you get more £ from your $ than ever before. Its people going the other way that will struggle.
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We may need to stay even longer than that if the world economic recession is as I fear (part of my work is to forecast, hence my pessimism).

And I’ve got plenty locked up in £ (unable to divest in any way that makes sense right now) and Swiss, Spanish family, among other complications from the current Brexit farce, so returning now would not be advantageous.
 
Corbyn and the like suddenly bleating on about democracy! Odd how it is democratic to leave the EU despite the country voting for it.
 
Vic said:
It's not mudslinging at Leavers (except at Farage).

Most Germans weren't Nazis. But Hitler took over parliament and they suddenly found they were all Nazis.

To quote Brecht (about Hitler):

The beast is dead but don't rejoice, you men. The bitch that bore him is in heat again.
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I tend to agree with @BlueHammer85. I think the substantive points being made by @Dribble are perfectly valid but the emotive over-use of the word 'Nazi' is as incendiary as some of the language I've seen written on the other side of the argument.
 
mcfc1632 said:
I had to re-read that

The first 3 times I read@

"It had to come to an head one way or another.

But until now we Remainers were confident that no matter what hurdles would need to be overcome - we could at least be certain that Brexit would eventually be stopped.

FFS - for the first time since 2016 I am nervous and want to express my righteous outrage.

Strange how recent fucking around with parliamentary tradition and procedures that were in favour of Remain did not attract the same level of angst from you
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It has to come to a head one way or the other. Irrespective of how it turns out (spoiler. Badly) this is self evidently true.

But the arguments will never die. No deal crash out will always be the illegitimate Johnson ‘forced’ Brexit. Every set back, every disruption, every problem will be lain before it. It will create division, protests and movements and the three devolved countries will feed the fire. Leave with a deal and Brexiteers and a fair few Remainers will claim that as an illegitimate Brexit or a bad deal Brexit and every set back, every problem will be lain before it. The fire and divisions will still burn. Stay and every slight or reverse or issue with the EU will be endlessly recycled for the Brexiteers to fret and pick over and the fire will still be burning brightly.

First rule of fires. Don’t start them.

Oh and truthfully I’m not upset by Johnson’s actions. We need to face the reality of Brexit. And if we can’t do it like adults then being forced to do so will suffice. Besides I Iike how an ‘illegitimate Johnson ‘forced’ Brexit’ sounds. It will play well. It has resonance don’t you think?
 
mcfc1632 said:
Rude?? you call me that after you have called me all manner of names and stupidly called me a liar

Stop whinging and try reading what people post - you might embarrass yourself less

If you had bothered you would have realised the truth of what I have just said to HKW - there is no guarantee that walk-away options force the other party to move - but they are essential

Anyway I suspect that you heightened levels of sensitivity are driven by the news today - best hide in one of the holes that you have recently dug and put your fingers in your ears
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I’m actually okay but thank you for your concern.

Let’s make a deal. I’ll come on here and admit you were right if Johnson suspends parliament and the EU eventually budge. I actually hope this happens to some degree, despite me not liking how he’s going to get there.

If he does it and the EU don’t budge, we leave with no deal and the economy goes to shit, will you come on here and admit I was right?
 
kevin horlocks wand said:
well all those moaning bastards should say they will vote for the withdrawal agreement then or releasing a joint statement saying which SPECIFIC bits of the withdrawal agreement need to change and how and release it to the eu and pm so we know what will get through by 31/10 because that’s what we all want.

But it’s much more funny to play politics and say bollox like you will do everything possible to prevent no deal. When there is One thing which is actually easy to do and will achieve their ends.

The hard line erg must be pissing themselves laughing at this tactic .

Even Boris was pragmatic and voted for the withdrawal agreement in the end which meant we would have left with a deal. But no he is the bad guy nutter who wants to leave with no deal.

Remind me again how did jezza, the snp and Lib Dem’s vote? Yet they are the ones saying Boris is a hard line no deal person. HE VOTED FOR LEAVING WITH THE DEAL!
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I don’t disagree with you.

I really don’t know where it takes us next though. The EU are seemingly not budging and the WA won’t and can’t be put forward again.
 
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