The Labour Party

[Chippy_boy]

Labour's second referendum is the only real chance left of remaining.

A Corbyn government will tax the rich and big business and will hurt me badly but they won't bankrupt the country. That's hyperbole. And the policies will help the disadvantaged, which matters. I don't like him or his policies but phrases like bankrupcy are tabloid scaremongering.

I'm sorry but I think you are absolutely mistaken.

Can I remind you of the last time policies anything like Corbyn's were allowed in this country, and even then they weren't that extreme? This is what actually happened, from the National Archives.

Sterling devalued and the IMF loan
Devaluation of the pound
The left wing of the Labour Party defeated the Public Expenditure White Paper in the Commons in March 1976. Subsequently, Harold Wilson resigned and James Callaghan took over as Prime Minister. Around this time, investors became convinced that the pound was overvalued and that the government might devalue. A large-scale sale of sterling began, which rapidly lost value against the dollar.

In spite of further efforts to reduce inflation, the pound continued to lose value, reaching a record low against the dollar in June 1976. The US Treasury Secretary now agreed with officials in the International Bank of Settlements that the pound was undervalued. He offered to partially fund a stand-by loan of $5.3 billion to support the pound. He insisted, however, on repayment of the loan by December 1976. Proposals for further cuts in expenditure and tax increases to reduce the budge deficit were debated in Cabinet in July. By September 1976, Britain had already drawn heavily on the short-term loan and it was apparent that a loan from the IMF would be necessary to fund repayment.

The 3.9 billion dollar loan
As pressure on the pound continued, the government approached the IMF for a loan of $3.9 billion in September 1976. This was the largest amount ever requested of the Fund, which needed to seek additional funds from the US and Germany. The IMF negotiators demanded heavy cuts in public expenditure and the budget deficit as a precondition for the loan. Healey's proposals for a cut of around 20 per cent in the budget deficit were hotly debated in Cabinet, particularly by Anthony Crosland and Michael Foot. Eventually they acceded, as it seemed likely that the refusal of the loan would be followed by a disastrous run on the pound. Healey announced the forthcoming reductions in public expenditure to the House of Commons on 15 December 1976.

... The IMF crisis reinforced a change in policy orientation away from full employment and social welfare towards the control of inflation and expenditure.

And you think this is impossible? It happened.

 

[mcfc1632]

One of the worst bits is that landlords (probably evil and greedy) can only put rents up by inflation . Cue a load of people ditching the private landlord sector and people claiming there isn’t enough affordable property to rent anymore especially in London . No shit Sherlock because nobody wants to be a bloody landlord anymore .

Well I can immediately think of 12 families that are going to be very disappointed by my reaction to this bollocks should the unthinkable happen and they get elected

 

[mcfc1632]

At least he’s not actually said: “Fuck business”

Oh he has - much more emphatically

He does it through his actions which has more impact than a throw away comment

 

[mcfc1632]

But it much happier news, the very latest poll out today - IPSOS MORI - now has the Tories a whopping 16 points clear. Way to go Jeremy!

Be interesting to see polls tomorrow!!!

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

He is talking about billionaires being the enemy and paying their fair share . They pay their fair share Jeremy. If they don’t pay what they should pay arrest the fuckers

he then said a third of billionaires fund the Tory party and therefore the Tory party is owned by the billionaires whereas labour isn’t. Hello Jeremy that means 2/3 of billionaires don’t fund the Tories,

listening to his speech you would think he has identified a new form of criminality . You know move over murderers, peados, people smugglers there is a new crime in town.

working hard for a living and being successful. Those billionaires really are scum according to Corbyn.

People vote for this absolute nut job. He is a lunatic.

Also being paid 80k a Year doesn’t make you a billionaire !

 

[cjn]

As an American and casual observer of UK politics I'm generally confused by the Labour party and pretty amazed how (it seems) they won't win this election. The Tories appear to be wildly incompetent, unpopular, and have mismanaged Brexit on practically every level yet all I read about is how Corbyn can never win and allegations of antisemitism. How did this happen? Have any of you guys read anything recently that could bring me up to speed? I really can't believe how even after everything that's happened since 2016 that Boris Johnson will likely continue as PM.

 

[Blue Hefner]

As an American and casual observer of UK politics I'm generally confused by the Labour party and pretty amazed how (it doesn't seem) they won't win this election. The Tories appear to be wildly incompetent, unpopular, and have mismanaged Brexit on practically every level yet all I read about is how Corbyn can never win and allegations of antisemitism. How did this happen? Have any of you guys read anything recently that could bring me up to speed? I really can't believe how even after everything that's happened since 2016 that Boris Johnson will likely continue as PM.

It’s all very odd

 

[Chippy_boy]

As an American and casual observer of UK politics I'm generally confused by the Labour party and pretty amazed how (it doesn't seem) they won't win this election. The Tories appear to be wildly incompetent, unpopular, and have mismanaged Brexit on practically every level yet all I read about is how Corbyn can never win and allegations of antisemitism. How did this happen? Have any of you guys read anything recently that could bring me up to speed? I really can't believe how even after everything that's happened since 2016 that Boris Johnson will likely continue as PM.

Really? When was the last time a communist won popular support in your country?

 

[urban genie]

As an American I'm generally confused .

You didn't need to write the rest ;-)


No only kidding, the answer is we have spent years where we have abandobed fact and reasonable debate for clickbait soundbites and vox pop politics, so the idiots seem to be given as equal and respected a platform as those who actual take this political stuff and the countries welthfare seriously.


Best example is where people like farage are concerned and we debate his xenophobia like such a mindset in a post WW2 world is an actual option to have rather than just calling him out as the crank he is.

 

[BlueAnorak]

According to the BBC his spending pledges would increase government spending by £83bn a year by 2024. That's equivalent 11p on the basic rate of income tax for all 31 million tax payers!

Are people so utterly gullible to imagine that by taxing 1% of the population and businesses by just a bit more, all of this can be paid for without affecting anyone else?

Good grief people, wake up, FFS.

It's more than that.
- The Openreach nationalisation will cost 3 times what it says in the Labour manifesto and will knock 5-10% off every UK hosted pension fund (more if Nationalised without a proper fee paid for the assets). The amount lost depends on the funds exposure to telecoms shares.
-The oil company tax makes North Sea Oil and Gas production untenable. 120,000 UK jobs on the line.
- Will companies pay the extra corperation tax? No they'll find ways to export profits abroad. Many may even relocate company HQs abroad (probably to Ireland). Pension fund values will also drop dramatically as a result.
- House building costs are understated. Average = £180,000 for 2/3 bedrooms. This will also incur massive costs to local councils on local infrastructure provision costs that appears uncosted. Also who is going to build them? A big bang provision as implied in the manifesto simply won't work.

It's a farce. Clearly Labour know they're going to lose and a trying to blag it.

 

[Chippy_boy]

It's more than that.
- The Openreach nationalisation will cost 3 times what it says in the Labour manifesto and will knock 5-10% off every UK hosted pension fund (more if Nationalised without a proper fee paid for the assets). The amount lost depends on the funds exposure to telecoms shares.
-The oil company tax makes North Sea Oil and Gas production untenable. 120,000 UK jobs on the line.
- Will companies pay the extra corperation tax? No they'll find ways to export profits abroad. Many may even relocate company HQs abroad (probably to Ireland). Pension fund values will also drop dramatically as a result.
- House building costs are understated. Average = £180,000 for 2/3 bedrooms. This will also incur massive costs to local councils on local infrastructure provision costs that appears uncosted. Also who is going to build them? A big bang provision as implied in the manifesto simply won't work.

It's a farce. Clearly Labour know they're going to lose and a trying to blag it.

Regards housing - and apologies this is second-hand because I am just going off what my wife has heard from a building industry spokesperson - but apparently there is already an acute shortage of skilled trades in the housebuilding sector, because half the labour being from eastern European countries etc have fucked off due to Brexit fears. So we cannot even sustain the rate of building we have seen previously, let alone find the resources to build another 100,000 homes a year. The only option would be to develop domestic skills with apprenticeships and various incentives, but that would take years (so I am told) and therefore not be remotely viable as a solution to meet Labour's house-building promises. In short, the promises are completely undeliverable, vote-stealing bollocks.

 

[Ban-jani]

As an American and casual observer of UK politics I'm generally confused by the Labour party and pretty amazed how (it seems) they won't win this election. The Tories appear to be wildly incompetent, unpopular, and have mismanaged Brexit on practically every level yet all I read about is how Corbyn can never win and allegations of antisemitism. How did this happen? Have any of you guys read anything recently that could bring me up to speed? I really can't believe how even after everything that's happened since 2016 that Boris Johnson will likely continue as PM.

Have you read Labour’s manifesto?

I can’t stand hyperbole but it’s genuinely a step toward Venezuela.

I actually liked the last Labour manifesto in parts but they’ve gone and doubled it.

We won’t have a City of London or be a rich country when they’ve finished.

 

[hilts]

• Giving everyone full rights from day one on the job.
• Strengthening protections for whistleblowers and rights against unfair dismissal for all workers, with extra protections for pregnant women, those going through the menopause and terminally ill workers.
• Ending bogus self-employment and creating a single status of ‘worker’ for everyone apart from those genuinely self-employed in business on their own account, so that employers can not evade workers’ rights; and banning overseas-only recruitment practices.
• Introducing a legal right to collective consultation on the implementation of new technology in workplaces.
• Banning zero-hour contracts and strengthening the law so that those who work regular hours for more than 12 weeks will have a right to a regular contract, reflecting those hours.

We will help people balance work and family life by:

• Increasing wages through sectoral collective bargaining.
• Requiring breaks during shifts to be paid.
• Requiring cancelled shifts to be paid and proper notice for changes in hours.
• Giving all workers the right to flexible working.
• Extending statutory maternity pay from nine to 12 months.
• Doubling paternity leave from two weeks to four and increasing statutory paternity pay.
• Introducing statutory bereavement leave, guaranteeing workers time off to grieve the loss of close family members or following miscarriage.
• Introducing four new bank holidays celebrating our four patron saints’ days.
• Reviewing family-friendly employment rights, including rights to respond to family emergencies.

We will make sure people are treated equally at work by:

• Requiring employers to devise and implement plans to eradicate the gender pay gap – and pay inequalities underpinned by race and/or disability – or face fines.
• Requiring employers to maintain workplaces free of harassment, including harassment by third parties.
• Increasing protection against redundancy for people wherever they work.
• Giving statutory rights to equalities representatives.
• Setting up a Royal Commission to bring health (including mental health) and safety legislation up to date.
• Ensuring that public-facing workers are protected by toughening the law against abuse and violence.
  Banning unpaid internships.

Ok so where do we all stand on this who is opposed to the above ?

Wow that is beyond fantasy fuck me I think he wants to throw the election.

 

[BlueAnorak]

Regards housing - and apologies this is second-hand because I am just going off what my wife has heard from a building industry spokesperson - but apparently there is already an acute shortage of skilled trades in the housebuilding sector, because half the labour being from eastern European countries etc have fucked off due to Brexit fears. So we cannot even sustain the rate of building we have seen previously, let alone find the resources to build another 100,000 homes a year. The only option would be to develop domestic skills with apprenticeships and various incentives, but that would take years (so I am told) and therefore not be remotely viable as a solution to meet Labour's house-building promises. In short, the promises are completely undeliverable, vote-stealing bollocks.

There is that too.
The sector does need to be increased.
The big problem is that when employers bring an employee in from overseas, capital costs for the accomodation and infrastructure are not provisioned for them. This is the biggest cause of the unrest leading to Brexit. Increased tax only pays the revenue costs of supporting the newcomer.. Massive capital costs are incurred because of the numbers arriving, but nobody is paying for it leading to unrest and infrastructure stretched to breaking point.
Why should the government pay to subsidise a worker many of whom incur benefit costs as well?
To fill this void, I personally think 4 years tax needs to be paid up front for the individual with the company getting a tax rebate on the individual for 6 years that reclaims the payment incurred up front. That way you actually stand a chance of tge additional infrastructure being delivered.

 

[Mike D]

You just cannot get your head around the fact that I am not a rich toff, can you. It's beyond your and your comrades' intellectual capacity to imagine that normal working class lads like me could possibly see this pile of shite for what it is.

Normal working class like me oh the irony

You may have have had a working class upbringing but you certainly aren't now voting Tory.

 

[Mike D]

is it, so what is he going to do list a load of companies on a naughty list that are bad and must give consultants immediate employment rights, like sports direct. Is JD ok?

but those companies and sectors that labour think are ok are exempt.

how does it apply to seasonal work or summer work , you kNow like how now restaurants and staff are taking on staff now and you say in your first bullet.these people get FULL employment rights from day one?

I don't know the details because you would have to legislate but you have to take ok into consideration seasonal and actual genuine project work.

 

[Mike D]

Does it apply to all businesses regardless of size ?

It's an overall in general view and accept it would create issues for small businesses.

 

[Mike D]

Wow that is beyond fantasy fuck me I think he wants to throw the election.

It's radical it's about changing society personally for the better. When Johnson is basically lying his arse off about everything including the true cost of his Brexit strategy. I would take this manefesto every day of the week over you poor saps that believe the lying ****.

 

[Mike D]

Every single small/medium sized business owner in the country.

As I just said earlier I can see issues with this for them . Flexible working would be an issue and others too.

 

[hilts]

It's radical it's about changing society personally for the better. When Johnson is basically lying his arse off about everything including the true cost of his Brexit strategy. I would take this manefesto every day of the week over you poor saps that believe the lying ****.

Please don’t even hint I’m a supporter of Johnson.