Var debate 2019/20

Busser said:
Hey man, I think you are talking about my response. Ok let's do this.

You say there a a few favourable decisions againts liverpool, which one? State your data facts like I did, I cant even argue your point because you didnt state anything.

How is FA making it easier for Liverpool when they had to travel to Dubai and play againts Aston villa? No help from anyone there.

The fact I'm talking about schedule, group stages is because if how much it favoured us and how we didnt take advantage of.

Like my post, I agree, liverpool had their break for Christmas, as opposed to us, who had an easier opponents in the first half of season and we didnt travel to dubai play a cup semi final and final and come back to play a team who is 2nd on the table. All within 5 days. But wait, they did get another day rest, the only advantage I'm seeing so far.

Remember last season, they only lost one game and was only 1 point different from us. They won CL. Without VAR. How can we conclude that this season is helped by VAR?

Also, which decision went againts us? We need to stop this conspiracy theories man and focus on us. We lost 5 games, how many because of liverpool? 1. We are clutching at straws he man. Just gasping at every opportunity to lay blame at everyone else but us.
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still peddling my man....?

give it up, your not winning the one man crusade.
 
Busser said:
Hey man, I think you are talking about my response. Ok let's do this.

You say there a a few favourable decisions againts liverpool, which one? State your data facts like I did, I cant even argue your point because you didnt state anything.

How is FA making it easier for Liverpool when they had to travel to Dubai and play againts Aston villa? No help from anyone there.

The fact I'm talking about schedule, group stages is because if how much it favoured us and how we didnt take advantage of.

Like my post, I agree, liverpool had their break for Christmas, as opposed to us, who had an easier opponents in the first half of season and we didnt travel to dubai play a cup semi final and final and come back to play a team who is 2nd on the table. All within 5 days. But wait, they did get another day rest, the only advantage I'm seeing so far.

Remember last season, they only lost one game and was only 1 point different from us. They won CL. Without VAR. How can we conclude that this season is helped by VAR?

Also, which decision went againts us? We need to stop this conspiracy theories man and focus on us. We lost 5 games, how many because of liverpool? 1. We are clutching at straws he man. Just gasping at every opportunity to lay blame at everyone else but us.
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Are you for real, you’ve had that many decisions I don’t have time to list them.

as for not being helped. You weren’t helped with the league cup, that’s it & your out. We had the same with EFL cup last season, 2nd leg of semi against a Burton on same day as EFL v Sunderland so couldn’t use the players we wanted, no problem we won the league Cup by using better younger players away in Burton. We went out of EFL cup & no point complaining as we had enough players to play both games on same night like you did but like us you prioritised.

Now I’m gonna bother with much more as my experience with talking with someone who doesn’t realise you are being refereed differently thus season is pointless.
 
mat said:
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That table is bullshit, they’ve had far more than that.

I take it that it can’t legislate any points in the game between Scousers & us despite the fact we shoukd have had a pen for their 1st.
 
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Busser said:
Hey man, I think you are talking about my response. Ok let's do this.

You say there a a few favourable decisions againts liverpool, which one? State your data facts like I did, I cant even argue your point because you didnt state anything.

How is FA making it easier for Liverpool when they had to travel to Dubai and play againts Aston villa? No help from anyone there.

The fact I'm talking about schedule, group stages is because if how much it favoured us and how we didnt take advantage of.

Like my post, I agree, liverpool had their break for Christmas, as opposed to us, who had an easier opponents in the first half of season and we didnt travel to dubai play a cup semi final and final and come back to play a team who is 2nd on the table. All within 5 days. But wait, they did get another day rest, the only advantage I'm seeing so far.

Remember last season, they only lost one game and was only 1 point different from us. They won CL. Without VAR. How can we conclude that this season is helped by VAR?

Also, which decision went againts us? We need to stop this conspiracy theories man and focus on us. We lost 5 games, how many because of liverpool? 1. We are clutching at straws he man. Just gasping at every opportunity to lay blame at everyone else but us.
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Why pretend to be a City fan and continue to talk about 'us'? No genuine City fan would resort to nitpicking like that to show the playing field has been level and Liverpool haven't got unfair advantages.

It's not simply that Liverpool have more rest than City after both games, 3 and 4 days vs 2 and 3 days respectively, but that they play Wolves at home 45 hours after the latter played City. Even Klopp and some Liverpool sites admitted that's not fair. Further SU have more rest before playing City.

Even if you give another day rest to Liverpool because of their travel to Dubai (where they played teams whose players are not good enough for the big clubs in Europe, Liverpool played several reserves in the 1st game while Leicester played their first XI against Everton in the league cup and then got battered against City), why make it easy for them by giving only 45 hours to Wolves who had to rotate half the team and start without their best attackers the game at Anfield? That's obviously unfair.

Favourable decisions for Liverpool? Leicester pen. The game with City was scandalous. 1st goal shouldn't have stood even if no pen for City was awarded. 2nd goal no VAR check for offside, then Mane pushes Sterling in the box and then the ball hits TAA,s hand again.

Next game Palace away, goal ruled out because Lovren was pushed. Why pushing Sterling while dribbling at speed isn't a foul, but pushing Lovren is a foul? Next game Everton, Van Dijk pushes an Everton player in the box, no foul again. Double standards again. TAA - deliberate handball while being on a yellow...

There are other examples going Liverpool's way. There are no such examples with City influencing the final result in City's favour.

That's my last response to you because I don't want to waste my time arguing with a troll.
 
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BlueHammer85 said:
then you’ve clearly not read history of my posts on this subject or just purposely ignoring how many times I’ve stated my dislike for some parts of VAR. I’ve absolutely got nothing to be ‘embarrassed’ about, I don’t live in a world of thinking everything’s a conspiracy- I just don’t want players getting away with cheating and diving and clear offside goals being allowed to stand. That is all. That’s all I want. If we can have technological help towards that then I’m all for it. VAR is shit at times but it’s a start. Ffs how can that be a unreasonable position to take ?

I think the Aguero analogy is a fair one - if officials are corrupt, on that day they could have flagged it offside and denied you the title - would you seriously not had wished for some technological proof that could be given to the ref to prove it was miles onside ? I know it’s a made up example but without going mad and being abusive try and give a rational answer as this is a VAR debate.

We can debate each individual Liverpool decision if you like and I do admit they’ve had the rub of the green on many occasions- but sometimes i genuinely think the margins are so tight I can see why it could be one way or the other - also their seems to be a lot of anger when Liverpool have a decision in their favour which turns out to be correct when it was correct ! For example it looked like Lallana handballed in the lead up to the goal the other day - yet VAR clearly shows it wasn’t a handball- then there is uproar about how VAR is ‘once again’ favouring Liverpool - fair enough on marginal decisions that sway their way - but on clear black and white decisions that are correct people still go mad.

By way, if you’re really interested you can go back on my previous posts and see how much I despise Liverpool and was desperate for City to win the title.

When it comes to VAR I just try to be a bit rational, don’t jump on the corruption bandwagon and prey we can find a better solution than before of officials being left to blind guessing with no help.

I think I answer fairly, honestly and never abuse anyone on this topic but guess if you hate VAR and are convinced it’s all to do with corruption then anything I say is met with scorn. So that’s me done on this topic for a while. Happy new year bud.
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Just to clear a few things up here..

1.
Firstly, I too don't live in a world were I assume everything and everyone are conspiring against my football team..

You state you don't want players getting away with cheating and diving, well VAR's in place and these things are still going on..

Can you tell me why not 1 Wolves player was booked the other night for diving every time they got into our penalty area?

I have formed my opinion based on what I've seen live, on TV and in the media.

My conclusions are, we have been shafted more than most this season.

2.
Show me where I've 'gone mad and been abusive' regarding my posts in replying to yours..

What I did pick up on was you and a couple of other none blues liking a post on here that was directed at a long standing and passionate City fan, deriding her views and dismissing her comments as embarrassing..

Regarding the Aguero analogy, like I said, the goal stood so saying 'what if' is pointless.

What if your recently sacked manager had won all your games this season, he'd still be in a job.. Pointless analogy too..!

3.
I'm on no bandwagon, I'm a City fan who is pissed off with the way we have been treated, especially this season by VAR and the whole media in general..

You are on a City forum full of City fans who feel the same way as me so don't preach to me that VAR is working to the best of intentions and will ultimately prove to be fair to one and all.

It certainly hasn't worked out that way to date and I have no confidence that it will be any different next season either..

Hope you have a better 2020 than what's coming down the pipe regarding City..!
 
alexmcity said:
For me the problem is not with VAR as such but with its use. VAR has been implemented badly. Why? Partly because of stupidity and partly because of wanting to control what's happening.
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Pretty much how I feel. I have no problem with technology being used but feel it is being used in the wrong way. There are also several claims that the PL is using it in a way which differs from most of the other top leagues in Europe. We have Mike Riley's version, others have something more reasonable. A cynic might suggest Riley wants it to fail so we get rid of it.
 
cheekybids said:
Are you for real, you’ve had that many decisions I don’t have time to list them.

as for not being helped. You weren’t helped with the league cup, that’s it & your out. We had the same with EFL cup last season, 2nd leg of semi against a Burton on same day as EFL v Sunderland so couldn’t use the players we wanted, no problem we won the league Cup by using better younger players away in Burton. We went out of EFL cup & no point complaining as we had enough players to play both games on same night like you did but like us you prioritised.

Now I’m gonna bother with much more as my experience with talking with someone who doesn’t realise you are being refereed differently thus season is pointless.
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they had the option to move the league cup game but chose not to & threw the towel in...like they do with domestic cups....fuck em....
 
alexmcity said:
Why pretend to be a City fan and continue to talk about 'us'? No genuine City fan would resort to nitpicking like that to show the playing field has been level and Liverpool haven't got unfair advantages.

It's not simply that Liverpool have more rest than City after both games, 3 and 4 days vs 2 and 3 days respectively, but that they play Wolves at home 45 hours after the latter played City. Even Klopp and some Liverpool sites admitted that's not fair. Further SU have more rest before playing City.

Even if you give another day rest to Liverpool because of their travel to Dubai (where they played teams whose players are not good enough for the big clubs in Europe, Liverpool played several reserves in the 1st game while Leicester played their first XI against Everton in the league cup and then got battered against City), why make it easy for them by giving only 45 hours to Wolves who had to rotate half the team and start without their best attackers the game at Anfield? That's obviously unfair.

Favourable decisions for Liverpool? Leicester pen. The game with City was scandalous. 1st goal shouldn't have stood even if no pen for City was awarded. 2nd goal no VAR check for offside, then Mane pushes Sterling in the box and then the ball hits TAA,s hand again.

Next game Palace away, goal ruled out because Lovren was pushed. Why pushing Sterling while dribbling at speed isn't a foul, but pushing Lovren is a foul? Next game Everton, Van Dijk pushes an Everton player in the box, no foul again. Double standards again. TAA - deliberate handball while being on a yellow...

There are other examples going Liverpool's way. There are no such examples with City influencing the final result in City's favour.

That's my last response to you because I don't want to waste my time arguing with a troll.
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You forgot the extra days rest the mickeys have got today as well
 
How many fans would be willing to boycott a game in protest against VAR, it is ruining the game and so many supporters are going to stop going, there is a reason football is the most watched sport and technology is taking over, you can't even celebrate properly! The Premier League would not be considered the best if there were so many empty seats in stadiums.
 
2 threads seem to be merging. VAR and corruption.
The intrinsic issues with VAR are being lost in the debate about the use of VAR to manipulate games. Regardless of potential corrupt application VAR is shite and always will be bacuse:
1. Prevents spontaneous celebration of goals
2. Is always a subjective view from another humanbeing
3. Off side - (even with margins of error built in) are subjective based on when the ball is played (margins of error simply give us new lines to argue about fine margins over).
4. Prevents spontaneous celebrations of goals
5. On-field decisions are influenced by a Refs proximity to the physical action not just visual cues.
6. Does and ALWAYS WILL prevent spontaneous celebration of goals.

Football is dead. The corpse is being handed over to the anal band of brothers apparent on this thread. Steralised, homogenised and prutified by pricks, dicks and enemas who have no passion for the game but need everything to be right!
They can OCD off.

And yes, i am angry. Very angry that the game i have followed all my life has gone. Football is about passion emotion. Without it, it is nothing.
 
Hart of the Matter said:
2 threads seem to be merging. VAR and corruption.
The intrinsic issues with VAR are being lost in the debate about the use of VAR to manipulate games. Regardless of potential corrupt application VAR is shite and always will be bacuse:
1. Prevents spontaneous celebration of goals
2. Is always a subjective view from another humanbeing
3. Off side - (even with margins of error built in) are subjective based on when the ball is played (margins of error simply give us new lines to argue about fine margins over).
4. Prevents spontaneous celebrations of goals
5. On-field decisions are influenced by a Refs proximity to the physical action not just visual cues.
6. Does and ALWAYS WILL prevent spontaneous celebration of goals.

Football is dead. The corpse is being handed over to the anal band of brothers apparent on this thread. Steralised, homogenised and prutified by pricks, dicks and enemas who have no passion for the game but need everything to be right!
They can OCD off.

And yes, i am angry. Very angry that the game i have followed all my life has gone. Football is about passion emotion. Without it, it is nothing.
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Video replays exist in multiple sports and I'm with you in the sense that they've taken some of the emotion out of the sport. You can't seem to celebrate goals immediately as you worry about them being chalked off.

That was the argument against VAR and the opposing argument was that we would minimise incorrect decisions. So far, its implementation has been poor.

It's taking too long to make decisions and some of the offside decisions are too difficult to make. It's been more of a success in La Liga and Seria a than it's been here.

Maybe it's the initial implementationthatds a problem and I'll reserve judgement until the end of the season. But it's been disappointing so far.
 
Not sure if its worth starting another thread !

Do people think that all players know something isn't right this season with the way everything seems to be going the dippers way ? a squad of players are going to be crown premier league winners, it possible the most bent season so far. Do we think other players will look at them and say 'yea but you lot didn't win it fairly' . Or do professional players just except its bent as being part of the game. 3 teams are going to get relegated which might mean a reduction in income for both players and club. It seems odd that the players union aren't standing up for they members and saying something is wrong here a set of our members are being treated different to all the others, whats going on ?. Or is it a case that the players just keep quite to save their careers.

To me yes the dippers will win the league but in my eyes ( which counts for nothing ) a tainted league.
 
samb66 said:
How many fans would be willing to boycott a game in protest against VAR, it is ruining the game and so many supporters are going to stop going, there is a reason football is the most watched sport and technology is taking over, you can't even celebrate properly! The Premier League would not be considered the best if there were so many empty seats in stadiums.
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Said it before that as long as grounds are full the powers don’t give a f**k. Now if a live game saw half empty stands for the first ten minutes on a regular basis maybe people might take notice of how the fans feel. We of course do it for the last ten minutes of a game.
 
Eds said:
Said it before that as long as grounds are full the powers don’t give a f**k. Now if a live game saw half empty stands for the first ten minutes on a regular basis maybe people might take notice of how the fans feel. We of course do it for the last ten minutes of a game.
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I think it would need to be at all stadiums ( not anfield ! of course ) on the same day all arrive ten minutes after ko to our seats all singing fuck var !
trouble with so many tourist it might be impossible to do
 
VAR is shit although if our first two games of the season were the last two we played, there would have been less initial grumbling for obvious reasons.
 
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