Couldn’t have put it better
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Var debate 2019/20
- Thread starter Chi-town blues
- Start date
Colin Bells Boots
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Video replays exist in multiple sports and I'm with you in the sense that they've taken some of the emotion out of the sport. You can't seem to celebrate goals immediately as you worry about them being chalked off.
That was the argument against VAR and the opposing argument was that we would minimise incorrect decisions. So far, its implementation has been poor.
It's taking too long to make decisions and some of the offside decisions are too difficult to make. It's been more of a success in La Liga and Seria a than it's been here.
Maybe it's the initial implementationthatds a problem and I'll reserve judgement until the end of the season. But it's been disappointing so far.
Makes you wonder why PiGMOL decided not to adopt other more successful applications , or does it really ? ( or should that be Riley )
MillisleBlue
Well-Known Member
2 threads seem to be merging. VAR and corruption.
The intrinsic issues with VAR are being lost in the debate about the use of VAR to manipulate games. Regardless of potential corrupt application VAR is shite and always will be bacuse:
1. Prevents spontaneous celebration of goals
2. Is always a subjective view from another humanbeing
3. Off side - (even with margins of error built in) are subjective based on when the ball is played (margins of error simply give us new lines to argue about fine margins over).
4. Prevents spontaneous celebrations of goals
5. On-field decisions are influenced by a Refs proximity to the physical action not just visual cues.
6. Does and ALWAYS WILL prevent spontaneous celebration of goals.
Football is dead. The corpse is being handed over to the anal band of brothers apparent on this thread. Steralised, homogenised and prutified by pricks, dicks and enemas who have no passion for the game but need everything to be right!
They can OCD off.
And yes, i am angry. Very angry that the game i have followed all my life has gone. Football is about passion emotion. Without it, it is nothing.
Now that right there is a post and a half.
Was it their turn to buy a round?It’s not just us, I was in a bar in Spain yesterday watching most of the football and there were fans from pretty much all clubs in, who to a man thought VAR was ruining the game.
Even the scousers looked a bit embarrassed.
M18CTID
Well-Known Member
Hit van dykes arm before he passed it upfield.
I was in the pub before our game and all they seemed to be concentrating on was whether it was handball by Lallana. I had no idea there was another handball by Van Dick earlier in the move! As for the Lallana one, am I looking at it with blue tinted specs? For me the ball didn’t hit him flush on the shoulder and was wedged between his shoulder and upper arm, so that’s handball surely?
Whymewhynot
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I was in the pub before our game and all they seemed to be concentrating on was whether it was handball by Lallana. I had no idea there was another handball by Van Dick earlier in the move! As for the Lallana one, am I looking at it with blue tinted specs? For me the ball didn’t hit him flush on the shoulder and was wedged between his shoulder and upper arm, so that’s handball surely?
blue tinted sadly. Never hit Lallanas arm, it was actually Sky who flagged the VVD handball at half time, asked him after the game if it hit him too. Inconclusive isn’t an answer you want to hear with technology
M18CTID
Well-Known Member
blue tinted sadly. Never hit Lallanas arm, it was actually Sky who flagged the VVD handball at half time, asked him after the game if it hit him too. Inconclusive isn’t an answer you want to hear with technology
Fair enough. Looked to me like it connected with his arm as well but was stood in a crowded pub with not the best viewing angle.
Why pretend to be a City fan and continue to talk about 'us'? No genuine City fan would resort to nitpicking like that to show the playing field has been level and Liverpool haven't got unfair advantages.
It's not simply that Liverpool have more rest than City after both games, 3 and 4 days vs 2 and 3 days respectively, but that they play Wolves at home 45 hours after the latter played City. Even Klopp and some Liverpool sites admitted that's not fair. Further SU have more rest before playing City.
Even if you give another day rest to Liverpool because of their travel to Dubai (where they played teams whose players are not good enough for the big clubs in Europe, Liverpool played several reserves in the 1st game while Leicester played their first XI against Everton in the league cup and then got battered against City), why make it easy for them by giving only 45 hours to Wolves who had to rotate half the team and start without their best attackers the game at Anfield? That's obviously unfair.
Favourable decisions for Liverpool? Leicester pen. The game with City was scandalous. 1st goal shouldn't have stood even if no pen for City was awarded. 2nd goal no VAR check for offside, then Mane pushes Sterling in the box and then the ball hits TAA,s hand again.
Next game Palace away, goal ruled out because Lovren was pushed. Why pushing Sterling while dribbling at speed isn't a foul, but pushing Lovren is a foul? Next game Everton, Van Dijk pushes an Everton player in the box, no foul again. Double standards again. TAA - deliberate handball while being on a yellow...
There are other examples going Liverpool's way. There are no such examples with City influencing the final result in City's favour.
That's my last response to you because I don't want to waste my time arguing with a troll.
So wait, you are saying that every decision that went againts liverpool is correct but everything that went for them is wrong? You didnt state facts, just your assumptions. You are biased and you know it. That lovren push, he was smart of making it look like a fault, didnt we all wish Mendy did that? Dont talk about taa handball, we lost the game and were never in the contest, still think we would have lost because we dont know what would have happened if the first hand ball were given as free kic That leicester penalty, was dubious, yes, but you cant let a leg out like that with players like mane, he will take advantage. Now VAR didnt exist last season, how were they only one point behind us? No conspiracy theory then, oh wait, because we won. So no need to be clutching at straws.
You keep talking about the Christmas schedule like that was a title decider, we were already behind them before that. Why arent you talking about how easy our schedule was and the fact we played less game, and the fact we had the easiest group in ever CL history ever that should have helped to propel us to the top. No, let's not talk about that, that was for us, we conspiracy theoriest cant talk about that.
Stop with this conspiracy theories man. Your statements are biased, one sided to suit your arguments. "Oh why are we losing, must be because liverpool bought the league and they had 45 hours worth of extra rest for one game." You sound like the sore loser they were last season. All you talk is liverpool, nothing about us, you sure your not having a crush on them?
This season is our doing, like I said, we already lost 5 games, and it's not liverpool's fault. You want to live just with hate, go ahead man, this forum is full of you people. I for one want to see our owners and pep react to this.
So wait, you are saying that every decision that went againts liverpool is correct but everything that went for them is wrong? You didnt state facts, just your assumptions. You are biased and you know it. That lovren push, he was smart of making it look like a fault, didnt we all wish Mendy did that? Dont talk about taa handball, we lost the game and were never in the contest, still think we would have lost because we dont know what would have happened if the first hand ball were given as free kic That leicester penalty, was dubious, yes, but you cant let a leg out like that with players like mane, he will take advantage. Now VAR didnt exist last season, how were they only one point behind us? No conspiracy theory then, oh wait, because we won. So no need to be clutching at straws.
You keep talking about the Christmas schedule like that was a title decider, we were already behind them before that. Why arent you talking about how easy our schedule was and the fact we played less game, and the fact we had the easiest group in ever CL history ever that should have helped to propel us to the top. No, let's not talk about that, that was for us, we conspiracy theoriest cant talk about that.
Stop with this conspiracy theories man. Your statements are biased, one sided to suit your arguments. "Oh why are we losing, must be because liverpool bought the league and they had 45 hours worth of extra rest for one game." You sound like the sore loser they were last season. All you talk is liverpool, nothing about us, you sure your not having a crush on them?
This season is our doing, like I said, we already lost 5 games, and it's not liverpool's fault. You want to live just with hate, go ahead man, this forum is full of you people. I for one want to see our owners and pep react to this.
You are a troll and not a smart one at that. Go to RAWK where you belong. Not interested in having a debate with a Liverpool supporter pretending to be a City fan.
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The Liverpool v Man City game swung on a refereeing error. Within moments City were 1-0 down instead of being potentially 1-0 up. Had VAR operated correctly, we'd have been given the 2nd penalty. That maybe opinion but even a Liverpool fan would probably agree that that game was shaped by refereeing decisions.So wait, you are saying that every decision that went againts liverpool is correct but everything that went for them is wrong? You didnt state facts, just your assumptions. You are biased and you know it. That lovren push, he was smart of making it look like a fault, didnt we all wish Mendy did that? Dont talk about taa handball, we lost the game and were never in the contest, still think we would have lost because we dont know what would have happened if the first hand ball were given as free kic That leicester penalty, was dubious, yes, but you cant let a leg out like that with players like mane, he will take advantage. Now VAR didnt exist last season, how were they only one point behind us? No conspiracy theory then, oh wait, because we won. So no need to be clutching at straws.
You keep talking about the Christmas schedule like that was a title decider, we were already behind them before that. Why arent you talking about how easy our schedule was and the fact we played less game, and the fact we had the easiest group in ever CL history ever that should have helped to propel us to the top. No, let's not talk about that, that was for us, we conspiracy theoriest cant talk about that.
Stop with this conspiracy theories man. Your statements are biased, one sided to suit your arguments. "Oh why are we losing, must be because liverpool bought the league and they had 45 hours worth of extra rest for one game." You sound like the sore loser they were last season. All you talk is liverpool, nothing about us, you sure your not having a crush on them?
This season is our doing, like I said, we already lost 5 games, and it's not liverpool's fault. You want to live just with hate, go ahead man, this forum is full of you people. I for one want to see our owners and pep react to this.
I believe UEFA have acknowledged that the VAR process is flawed in regards to offside and I expect change in the Summer. Unfortunately I think it will be rule changes and VAR itself is going to remain in place.
I do think the Premier League should be careful about its use because it threatens to damage credibility.
Dave Ewing's Back 'eader
Well-Known Member
So wait, you are saying that every decision that went againts liverpool is correct but everything that went for them is wrong? You didnt state facts, just your assumptions. You are biased and you know it. That lovren push, he was smart of making it look like a fault, didnt we all wish Mendy did that? Dont talk about taa handball, we lost the game and were never in the contest, still think we would have lost because we dont know what would have happened if the first hand ball were given as free kic That leicester penalty, was dubious, yes, but you cant let a leg out like that with players like mane, he will take advantage. Now VAR didnt exist last season, how were they only one point behind us? No conspiracy theory then, oh wait, because we won. So no need to be clutching at straws.
You keep talking about the Christmas schedule like that was a title decider, we were already behind them before that. Why arent you talking about how easy our schedule was and the fact we played less game, and the fact we had the easiest group in ever CL history ever that should have helped to propel us to the top. No, let's not talk about that, that was for us, we conspiracy theoriest cant talk about that.
Stop with this conspiracy theories man. Your statements are biased, one sided to suit your arguments. "Oh why are we losing, must be because liverpool bought the league and they had 45 hours worth of extra rest for one game." You sound like the sore loser they were last season. All you talk is liverpool, nothing about us, you sure your not having a crush on them?
This season is our doing, like I said, we already lost 5 games, and it's not liverpool's fault. You want to live just with hate, go ahead man, this forum is full of you people. I for one want to see our owners and pep react to this.
Just what does this throwaway phrase mean. I think I'm one of those. I've been biased since the Cup Final in '55. Ever since the Good Sheikh took over we have RDAHMeedya shit spread thickly over anything we have ever done in the last ten years. And as for choice between bias with ne'er a shred of evidence to back it up and murderous hooliganism I will always take the former!
the talisman
Well-Known Member
Just what does this throwaway phrase mean. I think I'm one of those. I've been biased since the Cup Final in '55. Ever since the Good Sheikh took over we have RDAHMeedya shit spread thickly over anything we have ever done in the last ten years. And as for choice between bias with ne'er a shred of evidence to back it up and murderous hooliganism I will always take the former!
Yep, “you people” seems to mean City fans, count me in.
Buswrecker doesn’t even know that we’re owned by one man, but he supports City.... apparently;-)
Nah they don't (as far as I have seen anyways).
I was watching CF America vs CF Monterrey in the mexican league last night as I couldn't sleep. America had two goals disallowed in the first half (as well as there being one if not two (I cant fully remember) pen decisions, all in the first half) that were checked by VAR. One of the goals was disallowed for offside (and no line was drawn at all and looked borderline) then another was given for a handball in the build up (far more passes compared to the Van Dijk handball against Wolves), each time the ref stopped play, and for the majority of them checked the pitch side monitor before making the decision.
They all appeared to be the correct decision and they were all done far quicker than VAR decisions are done here (us vs Liverpool aside when VAR was "seemingly" done before the ball had hit the net for the offside!)
European league wise I only watch it intermittently and it's mainly Barca/a top Italian game, all of which from memory use the pitch side monitor.
It's easy as fuck to sort VAR, force the refs to use the pitchside monitor and mic up the refs (like in rugby/NFL and its played in the stadium too so everyone knows what's going on).
But theyll never do that cos they cant work the narrative in their own interests then, can they!?
I also thought things would run a lot smoother if the Ref checked the pitch side monitor. That was until I saw Düsseldorf vs Leipzig a few weeks ago. Leipzig ran out 3-0 winners and their second goal was a Penalty. From every single angle (except one) it’s not penalty. The hand is up, in front of the body, very soft at best. But one angle from a side camera made it look a stonewall penalty. The Ref went to the pitch side monitor and the VAR officials only showed him the clip of the one angle where it looked stonewall. He was always going to give the penalty. Had he seen all the angles and seen where the arm was, he may not have given. I don’t think it’ll change things much, VAR just get to choose a particular camera angle to show the Ref and can pick and choose whichever angle they want.
You mean tv can decide who wins ?I also thought things would run a lot smoother if the Ref checked the pitch side monitor. That was until I saw Düsseldorf vs Leipzig a few weeks ago. Leipzig ran out 3-0 winners and their second goal was a Penalty. From every single angle (except one) it’s not penalty. The hand is up, in front of the body, very soft at best. But one angle from a side camera made it look a stonewall penalty. The Ref went to the pitch side monitor and the VAR officials only showed him the clip of the one angle where it looked stonewall. He was always going to give the penalty. Had he seen all the angles and seen where the arm was, he may not have given. I don’t think it’ll change things much, VAR just get to choose a particular camera angle to show the Ref and can pick and choose whichever angle they want.
mrtwiceaseason
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If you think about it that's right. Didn't the ref v spurs say he would of givern handball had he seen the one angle that showed the handball? So whoever controls the cameras is controlling the gameYou mean tv can decide who wins ?
BamberBridgeBlue
Well-Known Member
Just seen Grealish’s goal disallowed at Burnley. Somebody’s heel was offside.
I had settled down for a day of watching football, but I have relinquished control of the remote. Reruns of Father Brown are better than that shit.
I had settled down for a day of watching football, but I have relinquished control of the remote. Reruns of Father Brown are better than that shit.
squirtyflower
Well-Known Member
There was millimetres in it as the player was returning to the line. Shades of Aguero v Spurs in the bent CL game.Just seen Grealish’s goal disallowed at Burnley. Somebody’s heel was offside.
I had settled down for a day of watching football, but I have relinquished control of the remote. Reruns of Father Brown are better than that shit.
goatersnipple
Well-Known Member
That has made me realise I was right to sell my ticket today.
Really i am done with football
Really i am done with football
give it to gordon
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Just seen Grealish’s goal disallowed at Burnley. Somebody’s heel was offside.
I had settled down for a day of watching football, but I have relinquished control of the remote. Reruns of Father Brown are better than that shit.
It really is getting beyond a joke now how is a mm a clear and obvious error ?? Just scrape the league and start again next season this season is a bloody joke. I to can see tv companys not paying as much to cover the corrupt league
Len Rum
Well-Known Member
Just seen a freeze frame on Twitter of a disallowed VAR goal because someone's heel was a mm offside.
Tell me that isn't true.
Tell me that isn't true.