Keir Starmer

The thing I’m not really sure what Johnson can do as a riposte anyway. It’s not like he can just turn the tables and start shouting “Marxist” at him to deflect every time, he can’t criticise policies given we’re not (and nowhere near) an election cycle and he can’t deflect from questions about the pandemic because that’s all anyone cares about right now, quite rightly. All they’ll think of if he does that is...he’s deflecting from questions about the pandemic.

The only thing he can do as a form of defence is do his job better. If he has been training to do that, then great. I highly doubt it though...!
 
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Reactions: Vic
dave_blue12 said:
Word is BJ has been in training!

Let's see how that goes!
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He'll go on the attack over the unions....

EYaIbScXYAE7fkz.jpg:large

Culture wars is all these fuckers have left when everything turns to shit.
 
The perfect fumble said:
He'll go on the attack over the unions....

EYaIbScXYAE7fkz.jpg:large

Culture wars is all these fuckers have left when everything turns to shit.
Click to expand...

John Edmund a member of the SAGE Group is saying its a bad idea without a robust Track and Trace system - which the govt are struggling to set up - furthermore about 20 local councils are saying the schools won't be ready and so they won't allow them to open a week on Monday.....yet again they find that just saying shit for a short term gain has repercussions. Starmer needs to pint this out to him.
 
Chris in London said:
So basically you don’t like the fact that he is making the prime minister look stupid, and you look forward to the time when the nation’s attention isn’t focussed exclusively on what a fuck up he’s making of the crisis?
Click to expand...
No, I couldn't really care less if you think he makes the PM look stupid, as his criticism
carries little weight. This crisis, hopefully, is ending, and he won't have the advantage of an unknown
pandemic to base his forensic analysis and critiques on, I'm interested in what his policies are, if he wants to continue simply attacking, fine, but eventually he'll have to outline some sort
of strategy, or, are Labour's policies now still exactly the same as the ones presented by magic Grandpa?
If they are, then the wilderness years will turn into decades.
 
Ancient Citizen said:
No, I couldn't really care less if you think he makes the PM look stupid, as his criticism
carries little weight. This crisis, hopefully, is ending, and he won't have the advantage of an unknown
pandemic to base his forensic analysis and critiques on, I'm interested in what his policies are, if he wants to continue simply attacking, fine, but eventually he'll have to outline some sort
of strategy, or, are Labour's policies now still exactly the same as the ones presented by magic Grandpa?
If they are, then the wilderness years will turn into decades.
Click to expand...

again, this doesn’t make sense. If you accept that now is not the moment for Starmer to be setting out his views on future foreign policy, and you aren’t troubled by him dismantling Johnson at PMQs every week, what on earth was the point of your post?
 
Chris in London said:
again, this doesn’t make sense. If you accept that now is not the moment for Starmer to be setting out his views on future foreign policy, and you aren’t troubled by him dismantling Johnson at PMQs every week, what on earth was the point of your post?
Click to expand...
What would be the reasons to vote for Labour, now they have a new leader?
 
Ancient Citizen said:
No, I couldn't really care less if you think he makes the PM look stupid, as his criticism
carries little weight. This crisis, hopefully, is ending, and he won't have the advantage of an unknown
pandemic to base his forensic analysis and critiques on, I'm interested in what his policies are, if he wants to continue simply attacking, fine, but eventually he'll have to outline some sort
of strategy, or, are Labour's policies now still exactly the same as the ones presented by magic Grandpa?
If they are, then the wilderness years will turn into decades.
Click to expand...

So good I'll post it twice...

We're years away from a general election, no opposition sets out their stall this early, even in normal times and these aren't normal times.

Starmer has big problems in the Labour Party and one of the unintended consequences of Covid-19 is they're not front and centre, but eventually Cummings will make them so. Starmer might not be Corbyn but the party that elected Corbyn is still in place. In order to get elected Labour leader Starmer mouthed policy positions not too dissimilar to Rebecca Long-Bailey. Cummings knows that in order to burst the image of a middle of the road, well spoken, moderate politician of authority and gravitas, so appealing to Mail and Torygraph readers, he'll have to bring to the surface all the identity politics baggage Starmer is carrying.

I expect Cummings to bring legislation to Parliament in the not too distant future around these issues, for no other reason than to force Starmer to defend his "extreme" positions. In so doing Cummings will try to get a low key culture war going, after all the right wing media can't run with the likes of donkeygate forever.

The ticking time bomb is the leaked report showing right wing sabotage in the Labour Party, it has the potential to tear the party to pieces. How Starmer deals with this scandal is pivotal to his leadership and the future of the party.

Cummings and his right wing allies in the media see an opportunity.

To sow distrust among the left and reinforce the fear that Starmer is going to sell them out, the media is now prominently featuring the voices of old blairite war horses like Alan Johnson and David Blunkett. The blairites are dead in the party, but by presenting Blunkett and Johnson as relevant voices again, it creates the impression that Starmer is really nothing more than a blairite in left wing clothing.

It's all a bit double edged sword. Cummings and his stooges will portray Starmer as nothing more than a left winger in a good suit to scare the Shires and simultaneously as a right wing blairite clone to scare the left in the party.

I don't envy him.
 
Chris in London said:
When? At what election?
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*Sigh*
Ok,Sir Keir Starmer is the Labour leader, are you, and Labour supporters overjoyed by that?
Is he the one you would have selected?
I'm merely commenting on a thread about Starmer, so discussing whether he's good/bad/excellent
or shit is a relevant part of that process I'd have thought. If it's not, fine, fair enough, everyone can
continue telling us about PMQ's.
 
Ancient Citizen said:
*Sigh*
Ok,Sir Keir Starmer is the Labour leader, are you, and Labour supporters overjoyed by that?
Is he the one you would have selected?
I'm merely commenting on a thread about Starmer, so discussing whether he's good/bad/excellent
or shit is a relevant part of that process I'd have thought. If it's not, fine, fair enough, everyone can
continue telling us about PMQ's.
Click to expand...

You're going to have to up your game, if that's possible.

Come back when you have evidence of a Tory opposition with a fully fleshed out manifesto for government, four and half years away from an election.

Right now, Starmer's performance at the despatch box is all we have, and that's all one could reasonably expect.

I don't know why you bother, unsubstantiated opinion doesn't get you a free ride, you need to know stuff, and you know sweet Fanny Adams about fuck all.
 
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The perfect fumble said:
So good I'll post it twice...

We're years away from a general election, no opposition sets out their stall this early, even in normal times and these aren't normal times.

Starmer has big problems in the Labour Party and one of the unintended consequences of Covid-19 is they're not front and centre, but eventually Cummings will make them so. Starmer might not be Corbyn but the party that elected Corbyn is still in place. In order to get elected Labour leader Starmer mouthed policy positions not too dissimilar to Rebecca Long-Bailey. Cummings knows that in order to burst the image of a middle of the road, well spoken, moderate politician of authority and gravitas, so appealing to Mail and Torygraph readers, he'll have to bring to the surface all the identity politics baggage Starmer is carrying.

I expect Cummings to bring legislation to Parliament in the not too distant future around these issues, for no other reason than to force Starmer to defend his "extreme" positions. In so doing Cummings will try to get a low key culture war going, after all the right wing media can't run with the likes of donkeygate forever.

The ticking time bomb is the leaked report showing right wing sabotage in the Labour Party, it has the potential to tear the party to pieces. How Starmer deals with this scandal is pivotal to his leadership and the future of the party.

Cummings and his right wing allies in the media see an opportunity.

To sow distrust among the left and reinforce the fear that Starmer is going to sell them out, the media is now prominently featuring the voices of old blairite war horses like Alan Johnson and David Blunkett. The blairites are dead in the party, but by presenting Blunkett and Johnson as relevant voices again, it creates the impression that Starmer is really nothing more than a blairite in left wing clothing.

It's all a bit double edged sword. Cummings and his stooges will portray Starmer as nothing more than a left winger in a good suit to scare the Shires and simultaneously as a right wing blairite clone to scare the left in the party.

I don't envy him.
Click to expand...
That’s a pretty good analysis. He is going to have to be very clever and I really don’t know enough about his vision for the Labour Party and how he keeps the left relatively onside whilst making the party electable again. The crisis may offer some political opportunities as the U.K. may be ready for a different type of politics, some of it depends on the damage the crisis inflicts on Johnson and his regime.
 
Ancient Citizen said:
*Sigh*
Ok,Sir Keir Starmer is the Labour leader, are you, and Labour supporters overjoyed by that?
Is he the one you would have selected?
I'm merely commenting on a thread about Starmer, so discussing whether he's good/bad/excellent
or shit is a relevant part of that process I'd have thought. If it's not, fine, fair enough, everyone can
continue telling us about PMQ's.
Click to expand...

what a strange post.

you asked what were the reasons were to vote labour (post #2110) and I asked at which election (post #2112).

Are you unable to tell me what your own question meant?
 
Ancient Citizen said:
*Sigh*
Ok,Sir Keir Starmer is the Labour leader, are you, and Labour supporters overjoyed by that?
Is he the one you would have selected?
I'm merely commenting on a thread about Starmer, so discussing whether he's good/bad/excellent
or shit is a relevant part of that process I'd have thought. If it's not, fine, fair enough, everyone can
continue telling us about PMQ's.
Click to expand...

Personally, I think he’s the best opposition leader available given the current situation. During an election cycle probably not, but then that doesn’t matter right now, what everyone should want is someone holding the government properly to account.
 
The perfect fumble said:
You're going to have to up your game, if that's possible.

Come back when you have evidence of a Tory opposition with a fully fleshed out manifesto for government, four and half years away from an election.

I don't know why you bother, unsubstantiated opinion doesn't get you a free ride, you need to know stuff, and you know sweet Fanny Adams about fuck all.
Click to expand...
Lol, you 'Upped your game' years ago by telling us that some far left crank that had spent
all his life throwing bottles was the next messiah, look how that turned out.
I knew, and still know, that he, and the likes of you, have zero credibility then, and
always will, that must hurt, because you lose, and keep on losing, so whatever it is you think you
know, best think again.
 
I really don't understand the logic here? His position is Leader of Her Majesty's Opposition, his job is to hold the government to account. Him creating a manifesto comes when an election cycle comes around.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
That’s a pretty good analysis. He is going to have to be very clever and I really don’t know enough about his vision for the Labour Party and how he keeps the left relatively onside whilst making the party electable again. The crisis may offer some political opportunities as the U.K. may be ready for a different type of politics, some of it depends on the damage the crisis inflicts on Johnson and his regime.
Click to expand...
Good point, and like you, and many others, we don't know about his vision for Labour, it
appears that not many do.
 
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