Kalidou Koulibaly

Ezzy said:
I'm having a discussion my friend. I like to know the reasoning behind people's Opinions.

Koulibaly is not getting signed by Man City. We don't have to worry about that.

I'm interested in knowing why people think he is the sole answer to our defense problems.
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He's not the sole answer to our problems. One problem is actually having Dave in the side. As much as I love him, he creates positional problems for us defensively. On the right with Kev, when Walker goes forward Kev fills in as a temporary RB and stays behind. Silva can't do this for obvious reasons. So we have Mendy on the wing, but he can't go too far up in attack. He's mainly there for the outlet to cross. So Rodri usually has to shift over and cover more space where it would be Delph in the past. I think when Phil comes in next year he can do similarly to Kev if need be and Mendy can go forward more or stay behind when the LW and Left CM attack.

The problem I have right now is that when you take Laporte out of the line up none of the others are a good enough paring. Otamendi is slow and isn't really good at distributing the ball. Fernandinho is learning how to play CB and may get better, but he also is slow and isn't able to handle some Center Forwards so he should be partnered with someone who is quick and physical. Garcia is young and similarly to Dinho needs an experienced CB next to him. I'm not even going to include Stones.

You can say Laporte won't get injured again and maybe so, but he can't play every game. Pep likes to rotate and we have a lot of games.
 
Larry Stranger said:
He's not the sole answer to our problems. One problem is actually having Dave in the side. As much as I love him, he creates positional problems for us defensively. On the right with Kev, when Walker goes forward Kev fills in as a temporary RB and stays behind. Silva can't do this for obvious reasons. So we have Mendy on the wing, but he can't go too far up in attack. He's mainly there for the outlet to cross. So Rodri usually has to shift over and cover more space where it would be Delph in the past. I think when Phil comes in next year he can do similarly to Kev if need be and Mendy can go forward more or stay behind when the LW and Left CM attack.

The problem I have right now is that when you take Laporte out of the line up none of the others are a good enough paring. Otamendi is slow and isn't really good at distributing the ball. Fernandinho is learning how to play CB and may get better, but he also is slow and isn't able to handle some Center Forwards so he should be partnered with someone who is quick and physical. Garcia is young and similarly to Dinho needs an experienced CB next to him. I'm not even going to include Stones.

You can say Laporte won't get injured again and maybe so, but he can't play every game. Pep likes to rotate and we have a lot of games.
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Agree with all that, but the one thing Koulibaly offers that very few can is his two footedness. He can partner Laporte, but just a easily play left when Laporte is rested or did get injured, so having Garcia and another right footed centre back cover would still leave us with 2 left sided experienced centre backs and two / three right sided. Unless Laporte and Koulibaly were injured together we’d be okay, and we can’t cover for every possible eventuality.
 
OliMCFC said:
Don't be an arse because we have different opinions.
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It wasn't aimed at you or anyone else, just at the general consensus of opinion that Koulibaly will be a guaranteed success and a god like figure. It was more a piss take at the lack of balance in people's opinion. He's a brilliant brilliant player but no one is a guaranteed success, the reaction is so over the top it's quite funny seeing grown men behaving like excited kids at Christmas.
 
Larry Stranger said:
The problem I have right now is that when you take Laporte out of the line up none of the others are a good enough paring.

Pep likes to rotate and we have a lot of games.
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blueparrot said:
Agree with all that, but the one thing Koulibaly offers that very few can is his two footedness.
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Stones & Otamendi is not good enough.
We also have Walker and Rodri who are right footed.
3 ATB is a formation that we can also use now.

So what is more important for us to look for in the transfer market?
 
Ezzy said:
Stones & Otamendi is not good enough.
We also have Walker and Rodri who are right footed.
3 ATB is a formation that we can also use now.

So what is more important for us to look for in the transfer market?
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Bastoni would be a good option to go for, but we don't know where that stands right now. Will Inter sell and would Bastoni come here? Is he like a lot of Italians and don't want to leave Italy? I just think we should be looking at more options than just 1. 3 at the back is an option, but I think Pep would want to play 4 at the back in some games. So if we don't get any other CB he may lose that tactical flexibility if he's force to play 3 at the back.
 
So Ezzy is saying our priority is left CB not right CB due to the fact we have one left CB in Laport and a whole load of options on the right in Fernandinho, Garcia, Otamendi, Stones, Sandler adarabioyo and Harwood Bellis He has a point but

Consensus is Stones and Otamendi are not good enough and will leave I am
less certain of both it’s not long ago they where decent and who will buy in this market? Looks like we might start seeing interest in Stones tho and Otamendi could take a pay off and go to Spain or Argentina. I would like to try Stones one more season.

if they left that would leave us with Fernandinho Garcia Sandler Adarabioyo and Harwood Bellis Which is still enough but I have my doubts in terms of ability ability to integrate for the younger and on loan players and there is surely a good chance some will be sold or go on loan and how will Fernandinho be this season with his legs. Also surely you strengthen in your weak spots right CB is weaker than left CB even if we have more depth at right plus could some on the right not play left ? Not ideal not pep think but possible
 
WRicko said:
I have my doubts in terms of ability ability to integrate for the younger and on loan players

if we have more depth at right plus could some on the right not play left ? Not ideal not pep think but possible
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The appointment of Lillo is going to help a lot with that.
Since a lot of their development will take place in training, just like it was with Foden's.


the footedness balance is extremely important to our build up play.

having a right footed player on the left loses some advantage, no matter how two footed they might be. It's just not the same, especially when we play top European teams.
 
ctid1894 said:
It wasn't aimed at you or anyone else, just at the general consensus of opinion that Koulibaly will be a guaranteed success and a god like figure. It was more a piss take at the lack of balance in people's opinion. He's a brilliant brilliant player but no one is a guaranteed success, the reaction is so over the top it's quite funny seeing grown men behaving like excited kids at Christmas.
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No point risking signing anyone ever again then.
 
Ezzy said:
The appointment of Lillo is going to help a lot with that.
Since a lot of their development will take place in training, just like it was with Foden's.


the footedness balance is extremely important to our build up play.

having a right footed player on the left loses some advantage, no matter how two footed they might be. It's just not the same, especially when we play top European teams.
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But what happens when we want to play our 2 best centre-backs and they are both left footed?
 
The Fat el Hombre said:
No point risking signing anyone ever again then.
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That's a very childish reaction and you know it. Potentially paying £70-90m or whatever figures are banded about for a 29 year old who will command huge wages is a big gamble. If we get it wrong and it doesn't work out, there's no plan b, there's no selling him on and trying again, you're stuck paying huge wages for 5 years limiting your future options because of FFP.

Signing younger players like Danilo, Cancelo, Stones, Rodri, Sane and Jesus at least gives you a good chance to recoup some of the money to reinvest. You're not throwing all your eggs into one basket.
 
ctid1894 said:
That's a very childish reaction and you know it. Potentially paying £70-90m or whatever figures are banded about for a 29 year old who will command huge wages is a big gamble. If we get it wrong and it doesn't work out, there's no plan b, there's no selling him on and trying again, you're stuck paying huge wages for 5 years limiting your future options because of FFP.

Signing younger players like Danilo, Cancelo, Stones, Rodri, Sane and Jesus at least gives you a good chance to recoup some of the money to reinvest. You're not throwing all your eggs into one basket.
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Fair points. Are there any good, younger alternatives that fit the role though?
 
ctid1894 said:
That's a very childish reaction and you know it. Potentially paying £70-90m or whatever figures are banded about for a 29 year old who will command huge wages is a big gamble. If we get it wrong and it doesn't work out, there's no plan b, there's no selling him on and trying again, you're stuck paying huge wages for 5 years limiting your future options because of FFP.

Signing younger players like Danilo, Cancelo, Stones, Rodri, Sane and Jesus at least gives you a good chance to recoup some of the money to reinvest. You're not throwing all your eggs into one basket.
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Equally signing some young CB again as gamble will end up in failure yet again (see Stones) and we get nowhere.

We need instant impact at the back, now.

We wont be getting more than £25m for Stones. Not exactly great investment.

Regardless I don't really get the point you are making. Every signing is gamble, there is simply no guarantees.

Koulibaly is certainly much more likely to succeed than unknown young CB.
 
ctid1894 said:
That sounds even worse, you don't buy a player for a manager whose contract runs out in 12 months. It's a huge amount of money for a player who the new manager may not fancy, who would be very difficult to sell on because of his age and wages. That's the mistake United made with Ferguson, they fucked up the squad and brought in older players to give the pisscan a great send off. That destroyed any chance of future managers, they were stuck trying to get rid of the deadwood with no one coming through the ranks.
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This simply is not true at City. Every manager City hire will play possession based football. The club is following the Barca model. The entire club plays exactly the same way already from U8 onwards.
 
MeatHunterrr said:
Equally signing some young CB again as gamble will end up in failure yet again (see Stones) and we get nowhere.

We need instant impact at the back, now.

We wont be getting more than £25m for Stones. Not exactly great investment.

Regardless I don't really get the point you are making. Every signing is gamble, there is simply no guarantees.

Koulibaly is certainly much more likely to succeed than unknown young CB.
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A failure like Laporte, an untried French centre back who couldn't even get in the national team. Not all young defenders are doomed to failure.
MeatHunterrr said:
This simply is not true at City. Every manager City hire will play possession based football. The club is following the Barca model. The entire club plays exactly the same way already from U8 onwards.
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Just because we'll play a similar way doesn't mean a manager will automatically fancy a certain player, you only have to see the difference of opinion on players already at the club with fans. Some love certain players who others hate abd vice versa, it's a very strange statement to make.
 
kun said:
But what happens when we want to play our 2 best centre-backs and they are both left footed?
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Two best full-backs can't defend.

Wingers are all inverted.

RCB's are not "Top Class" yet.

Best centre-backs are both left-footed.

Versatility of certain players.
(DM & CB) (F9 & AM) (Double Pivot & AM)


What is another formation we can use to address all of these problems & get the best out of our players?
 
Ezzy said:
The appointment of Lillo is going to help a lot with that.
Since a lot of their development will take place in training, just like it was with Foden's.


the footedness balance is extremely important to our build up play.

having a right footed player on the left loses some advantage, no matter how two footed they might be. It's just not the same, especially when we play top European teams.
Click to expand...

Just to emphasise a point here

 
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