F1 Season 2021

Rules are rules, unless we decide otherwise.
we can change rules as we see fit.
Therefore although we didn’t follow rules we did follow allowing rules to be changed.

Agree what next this will creep into other sports like giving a penalty after the final whistle in football

People are saying it was great and exciting etc all I saw was cheating. Did nothing for me apart from not watching next season.
 
i think the variable I was trying to ask was, and extremely hypothetical of course; If Mercedes had taken the first pit stop opportunity, the scenario would have been reversed, so do people think Masi would have still released the lapped cars for a single lap race? I think he would.
If Masi had done what every RC had done previously then Mercedes would have made the right call by maintaining track positions, which WAS at the risk of slow punctures on the old tyres. This isn’t about what the teams did during the race though.
 
It seems people here think this was all by design to allow Max to win. Of course Max being on the fresher tyres in a one lap shoot out was always going to get a fair shot of passing him. Im not saying I think the decision to let them race / allow some backmarkers to pass was right.

However, I can’t help but look at one moment in the race, and it’s a gamble we see teams take week in week out down the field to get a ‘cheap stop’. Mercedes made the call to maintain track position instead of pitting Lewis under the virtual safety car. (Toto on the radio to Masi begging him not to deploy the full safety car). Obviously Red Bull then react, they have to, they are then racing the variables. Both teams gambled and unfortunately for Lewis that initial team decision has put him on the back foot with tyre choice for what happens later. That initial decision keeps him on those worn tyres for the duration. He himself was on the radio multiple times questioning it, even calling it a risk and a gamble.

The sport comes down to split decisions and on a high speed street circuit there was always the possibility of a full safety car.

It’s a farce how the end of the race unfolded, but I do think Lewis is going to come back stronger than ever next season. The man is a warrior.
WADR, I think you’ve missed a big chunk of what happened and conflated the strategies.

Lewis was kept out on the hard tires because he would have given up track position to Verstappen if he had pitted.

This is a known fact and was told to him by Bono.

Indeed, Bono also told him the two possible scenarios…

1) No lapped car overtake, which put enough time and distance between Lewis and Max, even with Max on the softs for the last lap, or

2) Let all the lapped cars undertake the Safety Car, but finish under a yellow flag, because there was simply not enough time (an extra lap) to go racing again.

Those were THE ONLY TWO OUTCOMES, and Mercedes’ strategy had them both covered, REGARDLESS OF TIRES!

The problems were, at a minimum, threefold:

1) Race Control TOLD the teams there would be no overtaking by the lapped cars. This cemented the idea that Lewis would have multiple cars between him and Max IF they were able to clear Latifi’s car and debris in time.

2) Race Control, after being told by Red Bull’s Horner that he just needed ONE RACING LAP (remember that from an earlier race GIVEN to Verstappen on the rain out?!), CHANGED THEIR MIND to allow lapped cars through past the Safety Car.

3) They ONLY allowed it for the cars that Hamilton had recently overtaken and that Verstappen had lost places to because of his tire change. In short, it wasn’t a 14 second “penalty” tire change, it was a FREE TIRE CHANGE AND it removed every car in his way.

Those are the minimum problems. However, even beyond that, when the Safety Car left the track, it’s up to the race leader to determine when they start racing again. Until then, ALL other cars have to stay behind the leader, just as they have to behind the Safety Car. Max didn’t!

Multiple times, Hamilton slowed to a crawl, as he’s allowed to, in an attempt to gain some advantage, but Verstappen was pulled ALONGSIDE AND SOMETIMES AHEAD when the rules clearly state it is verboten.

That appeal was turned down by the Stewards, as they said Hamilton was braking and accelerating. Huh???

There is almost nothing ANYONE can tell me that will convince me that Masi was not pressured (internally and/or externally) into making a horribly flawed decision to change the rules at the most important time of the most important race of the entire World Championship season.

None of that has a damned thing to do with Hamilton being on old hard tires versus new soft tires…unless you believe that Masi was completely cognizant of that fact, which was WHY he did what he did.

I find it impossible to believe he was not acutely aware of the respective drivers’ strategic positions and, by his hand, he placed a thumb on the scale of this Championship.

Masi should not be the Race Director next season, but the FIA would be admitting their own failure by removing him, so it’s kinda like PGMOL! They’re fucked!
 
I don’t think it is a hollow victory for Max. I think if you look at the full season it would be hard to claim that Max is not a deserving winner overall. He didn’t actually do anything wrong either. He took advantage of a situation that never should have happened.

However, despite Max’s brilliance at times this season, Lewis fought back and went into the final race in a winner takes all scenario. Again, I don’t think anyone could argue that Lewis did not deserve to win that race today.

The reality of the situation is that the race director abandoned sporting integrity for entertainment. The fact Mercedes protests have been rejected shows that it’s an acceptable thing in F1.

It does beg the question of whether this happens in other sports. I wouldn’t at all be surprised if referees in football are told to give favourable decisions to sides to make the PL exciting. When we pipped Liverpool to the league a few seasons ago, they had many dodgy decisions in their favour which kept the title race going.
they were level after all the races ,in the last race hamilton was ahead by 12 seconds with 4/5 cars in front of him and verstappen with 5 laps to go, so how is verstappen a deserved winner ? hamilton would of won the championship without the race directors wrong call.

do you think liverpool deserved to win the title the other year when we pipped them, because liverpool didnt do anything wrong, your talking in riddles
 
The thing that even now I don't understand is the whole idea of letting some but not all of the lapped cars come past. I'm pretty sure that there were only another 2 lapped ones in the field and they were towards the front of the train anyway. It would have taken maybe another 10 seconds to let those come past as well and then at least the FIA could have said they had adhered to that part of the regulations. Picking and choosing which ones could overtake and which ones couldn't has led to this situation.
 
The thing that even now I don't understand is the whole idea of letting some but not all of the lapped cars come past. I'm pretty sure that there were only another 2 lapped ones in the field and they were towards the front of the train anyway. It would have taken maybe another 10 seconds to let those come past as well and then at least the FIA could have said they had adhered to that part of the regulations. Picking and choosing which ones could overtake and which ones couldn't has led to this situation.

I don't understand why the lapped cars are allowed thought full stop. How can changing the position of the cars be right. All cars hold position and start racing again from the position the SC was put out. Surely that's fair.
 
I don't understand why the lapped cars are allowed thought full stop. How can changing the position of the cars be right. All cars hold position and start racing again from the position the SC was put out. Surely that's fair.
Not if you wanted Max to win, or you didn't have the balls to tell Red Bull to shut it and suffered a brain melt down trying to keep everyone happy.
 
The thing that even now I don't understand is the whole idea of letting some but not all of the lapped cars come past. I'm pretty sure that there were only another 2 lapped ones in the field and they were towards the front of the train anyway. It would have taken maybe another 10 seconds to let those come past as well and then at least the FIA could have said they had adhered to that part of the regulations. Picking and choosing which ones could overtake and which ones couldn't has led to this situation.
There were 3 others. They wouldn't have all got past the safety car before the end of the lap so it would have had to stay out for the final lap and Hamilton would have won.
 
imagine for one second, instead of verstappen getting passed hamilton so easily he struggled to get passed and mad a last desperate lunge on the last corner,taking both drivers out and killing the pair of them, how would "drive to survive" look then.

im no bif f1 fan,but anyone justifying that outcome yesterday is wumming because they don't like hamilton , why they don't like hamilton is a strange one, he comes across as a decent bloke to me.
 
The thing that even now I don't understand is the whole idea of letting some but not all of the lapped cars come past. I'm pretty sure that there were only another 2 lapped ones in the field and they were towards the front of the train anyway. It would have taken maybe another 10 seconds to let those come past as well and then at least the FIA could have said they had adhered to that part of the regulations. Picking and choosing which ones could overtake and which ones couldn't has led to this situation.
That would have put the Ferrari right behind max and it wasn’t supposed to be that kind of race
 

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top
  AdBlock Detected
Bluemoon relies on advertising to pay our hosting fees. Please support the site by disabling your ad blocking software to help keep the forum sustainable. Thanks.