Julian Alvarez | Signs for City (see main forum)

[Deleted member 87819]

Alario also hasn’t had the benefit of Pep coaching him alongside excellent players.
Big big difference in circumstances.

Neither has Schick who plays in his same team and look at his numbers

 

[Gingers Dad]

It’s cheap because it’s a risk. You take a player like Lucas Alario, also came from River Plate, a striker who scored 22 goals in 47 games for that club and left for Bayer Leverkusen in 2017 for more money they we’re supposedly paying for Julian (who has 23 goals in 57 games at River) at an older age. Alario was seen as a major player in South America; he scored in the Copa Libertadores final which RP won and also at the Club World Cup; a recent poll by their fans elected him as their favorite centerforward the past decade with more than half the votes; but at Leverkusen, he has 36 goals in 102 games and is currently Patrick Schick’s sub and doesn’t play much. He has an agreement to already come back to South America this window to play for Brazilian club Palmeiras and it’s pending on Leverkusen finding a replacement. Probably dreaming of World Cup but with 9 national team appearances and 3 goals it’s not going to be more than just a dream (Alvarez has five national team appearances and zero goals). European football is a big big step for a player used to South American football and why you can’t count on them to come in and fit in right away. The best striker playing in Brazil (and South America) today (Gabriel Barbosa/Gabigol, from Flamengo, who recently received an offer from West Ham turned down by the Brazilian club) also flopped at Inter and Benfica but is a king here.

And that is why a loan back is a waste of time for the player. He needs to be training and sometimes playing in the EPL as soon as possible. He will get complacent knocking in goals for fun at a lower level.

 

[LongsightM13]

And that is why a loan back is a waste of time for the player. He needs to be training and sometimes playing in the EPL as soon as possible. He will get complacent knocking in goals for fun at a lower level.

Maybe that’s the only deal he will agree to?
A lot like parking Jesus at Palmeiras until Copa Libertadores is over imo
Also as others have said, it potentially puts a huge club like River Plate in our orbit of teams who like the respectful way we go about our business and ensure that the selling club gets the big slice of the pie, rather than predatory agents and middlemen.
it would be an investment in our future

 

[Gingers Dad]

Maybe that’s the only deal he will agree to?
A lot like parking Jesus at Palmeiras until Copa Libertadores is over imo
Also as others have said, it potentially puts a huge club like River Plate in our orbit of teams who like the respectful way we go about our business and ensure that the selling club gets the big slice of the pie, rather than predatory agents and middlemen.
it would be an investment in our future

I agree but I'm just talking about the lads personal development. If the only agreement is a loan back then so be it. At 22 he really should be kicking on though. Premier league is very tough it's not for everyone

 

[Deleted member 87819]

Maybe that’s the only deal he will agree to?
A lot like parking Jesus at Palmeiras until Copa Libertadores is over imo
Also as others have said, it potentially puts a huge club like River Plate in our orbit of teams who like the respectful way we go about our business and ensure that the selling club gets the big slice of the pie, rather than predatory agents and middlemen.
it would be an investment in our future

I don’t understand what he gains from another season in Argentina. He already played all domestic and continental competitions for a few seasons, has all that experience. Why not just move already? Oh he wants play time before the WC? I don’t get why that’s in our interest. And frankly don’t know why it would be a problem to take him away from River now when the season hasn’t even started. Isn’t it much worse to take him away from RO halfway through a season?

 

[Otamendi's Beard]

Alario has two goals this season.
He came to Europe older and as more experienced than Alvarez, much more of a goalscorer (a centerforward after all) and in a league made for him (Bundesliga). He was super impressive here in South American football and he will be a star if he indeed comes back this window. Leverkusen is already open to getting rid of him for minimal compensation. I wouldn’t call him a flop, but more was expected. Another major River Plate forward arrived at Frankfurt last summer, Colombian Rafael Borré, 18 games, 6 goals, which isn’t a disaster, but the performances haven’t been very good.

They probably did expect more but for the price paid, his goal return isn't actually that bad. He's also not playing in Germany's best club side whereas at River he was.

With Alvarez it's less of a risk for us than overpaying on another Wilfried Bony. If he can contribute a combined 15 goals and assists in all competitions (each season) then it'll prove an astute signing.

 

[Deleted member 87819]

With Alvarez it's less of a risk for us than overpaying on another Wilfried Bony. If he can contribute a combined 15 goals and assists in all competitions (each season) then it'll prove an astute signing.

Basically the Torres replacement

 

[dachoosen1]

I agree but I'm just talking about the lads personal development. If the only agreement is a loan back then so be it. At 22 he really should be kicking on though. Premier league is very tough it's not for everyone

Think it's to do with the world Cup. At the minute it's easy to include him in the squad but if he comes here and spends 6 months on the bench he gives the Argentina manager a decision to make.

 

[eversince 76]

I’m not sure where this comes from. Most of our signings under him came mostly ready, some already playing for their national team.

Yet every player states he has become better under Pep.

And what is mostly ready to you anyways? Is Kayka almost ready? Was Torres? Is almost ready comes with age? Talent? Mentality? Drive?


If City is interested in a player I like to think, based on the time Txiki and Pep work together, they know the player can fit whatever use they think he can be, and from a perspective he will become a better player. Does every player they brought in was a succes? No. There are no guarantees. Ever. But I very much trust their judgement, even if they allow the player to spent more time at his club.
But than again I hardly start getting excited over a player unless he plays for City and delivers. Some can do that straight away. Some need time.

 

[ChicagoBlue]

I agree but I'm just talking about the lads personal development. If the only agreement is a loan back then so be it. At 22 he really should be kicking on though. Premier league is very tough it's not for everyone

I think we are forgetting that a 22 yr old is a kid in global footballing terms. A top player has at least 10 yrs ahead of him, with his peak coming from age 25-30.

 

[The Fat el Hombre]

I think a few people might be underestimating this one

No comment from Tim Vickery yet? Can't see anything on his twitter

 

[Deleted member 87819]

I think we are forgetting that a 22 yr old is a kid in global footballing terms. A top player has at least 10 yrs ahead of him, with his peak coming from age 25-30.

I actually think 22 is not that young for football. Messi was 22 when he won his first Ballon D’Or. Many will break later but most of the top talents you can spot even considerably earlier than that

 

[Deleted member 87819]

And what is mostly ready to you anyways? Is Kayka almost ready? Was Torres? Is almost ready comes with age? Talent? Mentality? Drive?

Kayky was not a first team signing. Torres was ready for the Spanish national team. Ready for the responsibility is what I mean. Technically and mentally for sure.

 

[blueparrot]

I actually think 22 is not that young for football. Messi was 22 when he won his first Ballon D’Or. Many will break later but most of the top talents you can spot even considerably earlier than that

Messi,and his career should never be used to measure anybody.

 

[Deleted member 87819]

Messi,and his career should never be used to measure anybody.

I don’t think Messi is the only example. I also think Alvarez has done well for his age and region, but I am on record in this thread from the beginning saying that for me he was a player to start in England in a midtable team. For us, as a supporting player, Torres replacement etc, it might be a waste, but we can only hope for the best.

 

[blueparrot]

I don’t think Messi is the only example. I also think Alvarez has done well for his age and region, but I am on record in this thread from the beginning saying that for me he was a player to start in England in a midtable team. For us, as a supporting player, Torres replacement etc, it might be a waste, but we can only hope for the best.

We don't need to hope for the best, it isn't really our problem. Chances are the club know what they are doing and have a plan for him and the squad over the next 2 0r 3 years. Age doesn't matter players develop at different speeds. Kane was quite slow developing for one.

 

[Dave Ewing's Back 'eader]

We don't need to hope for the best, it isn't really our problem. Chances are the club know what they are doing and have a plan for him and the squad over the next 2 0r 3 years. Age doesn't matter players develop at different speeds. Kane was quite slow developing for one.

And I recall Dave Ewing having to hang around before he got the shout!

 

[Deleted member 87819]

We don't need to hope for the best, it isn't really our problem.

It’s our club

 

[blueparrot]

It’s our club

It's our team. The club is in safe hands, their record is pretty good and if they have a plan for Alvarez I'm sure it will be fine. What's the worst that can happen we lose some of the 15 mill fee, we'll cope. Whats the best we get another Aguero. Whats most likely we get a good player or we make a profit. That's why it isn't our problem Only what the team do on the pitch.

 

[kippaxwarrior]

I think a few people might be underestimating this one

No comment from Tim Vickery yet? Can't see anything on his twitter

He was on the BBC a few days ago raving about him.

Although when we signed Jesus and Marlo Moreno at the same time he did say Moreno was the better player and he hasn't made a single appearance for us